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Geoff Baker echos my thoughts on FA and the standard cliches (excuses) for a non-contending team


JTrea81

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A great read here about Fielder and any other premium FA signing by a team that supposedly isn't close to contending.

What does it matter if the Mariners aren't going to be "ready" to contend before 2013 or 2014? You don't sign guys to multi-year deals -- and Fielder is said to be looking at five years or more -- based on what's going to happen in the next 12 months. Since when did we devolve into this myopic brand of roster construction? Here's a news flash: Fielder won't be around as a free agent a year from now and it's possible there won't be an impact hitter out there.

Free agents aren't sitting around waiting for the Mariners and their fans to decide when they're "ready" to contend. You build a team piece by piece based on what's available to you at the time.

And if Fielder is the best upgrade you can get now, you sign him, spend another year developing the rest of your team while (hopefully) playing .500 ball, then add the rest of the pieces a year from now. So, you'll have used up one year of your five-or-six-year deal. So what?

Which brings us to another excuse I keep hearing: what makes anybody believe Fielder would want to come to Seattle?

Well, I can guarantee you one thing. If that's the attitude the Mariners take into any negotiations with Fielder, they have zero chance.

Fielder won't be the only answer for this squad. But he doesn't have to be the only answer brought in this winter. And the rebuilding doesn't have to end this winter either. If your plan is to contend in 2013, Fielder will bring you one step closer.

He's not signing a one-year deal. To rule him out because you're waiting until the team has its absolute best shot of contending within a 12-month window is not only foolish, it might set your rebuilding back even further if no better bat comes along after.

Nail meet head. Just an awesome piece that should be required reading for every Orioles fan, media person and executive. Bra-freaking-vo! :clap3::clap3::clap3:

You can always make excuses not to sign anybody.

The opportunities for the Orioles are running out. Free agency is getting worse and worse. The Orioles keep passing and the players keep declining in quality.

You need to acquire the talent when it is available otherwise you may not be able to acquire it when you think you need it.

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A great read here about Fielder and any other premium FA signing by a team that supposedly isn't close to contending.

Nail meet head. Just an awesome piece that should be required reading for every Orioles fan, media person and executive.

Bra-freaking-vo! :clap3::clap3::clap3:

Ehh, yes and no. You don't just grab guys that are "available at the time" and there is more consideration than grouping all premium Free Agents . Fielder is a nice piece for a tweener team because he's 27 years old (forgetting the fat risk factor here). His acquisition on a long term deal could fit for a rebuilding team (hoping to contend in the short term) or a contending team. Anyways nice try, you're certainly perseverant in finding things that fit your viewpoint.

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The Mariners are ready to take the next step. The Orioles aren't. The O's need to make some trades for the best available players then deal from a position of strength for a big bopper or draft Victor Roache.

How are the Mariners ready to take the next step? They had a worse record than we did.

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The opportunities for the Orioles are running out. Free agency is getting worse and worse. The Orioles keep passing and the players keep declining in quality.

You need to acquire the talent when it is available otherwise you may not be able to acquire it when you think you need it.

cry_wolf3.jpg

I heard this tune from you with Teixeira and Matt Holliday. Even Chone Figgins. Trading the farm for Adrian Gonzalez and Miguel Cabrera fit your same logic. And we'd be in even further up s*** creek if we currently had to pay the contracts almost all of these guys have.

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cry_wolf3.jpg

I heard this tune from you with Teixeira and Matt Holliday. Even Chone Figgins. Trading the farm for Adrian Gonzalez and Miguel Cabrera fit your same logic. And we'd be in even further up s*** creek if we currently had their contracts on the books.

After Fielder, there will be no FA bat under 30 that can be acquired in free agency for several years other than Matt Kemp who will likely be extended.

If you want to contend in the near future, he's the best that's left.

Otherwise you are going to be giving out 6-8 year deals to 30+ year old players to get a premium bat or trading players for 1-2 year rentals that you hope you can extend.

And I'd hardly call having AGon or MCab on the books as a bad thing. That's 6-7 wins we'd already have on the team going into this offseason.

We'd be a .500 team with them as we have 75 win talent now.

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How are the Mariners ready to take the next step? They had a worse record than we did.

The Mariners have quite a bit of young talent to supplement with Fielder and the Orioles don't have anything in their rotation that even remotely compares to King Felix. The M's would be freed up to deal Smoak for more talent.

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The Mariners have quite a bit of young talent to supplement with Fielder and the Orioles don't have anything in their rotation that even remotely compares to King Felix. The M's would be freed up to deal Smoak for more talent.

Smoak isn't the chip he once was. He's rapidly approaching Chris Davis territory...

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Dumb argument. A free agent's greatest value is USUALLY at the start of his contract. By the end of their contracts, most free agents are no longer capable of maintaining the same level of production. Thus, for instance, the Yankees signed Alex Rodriguez to a $300 million deal which looks really bad now. It did however help them win the World Series in 2009, but from here on out Rodriguez is not going to be valuable enough to justify the amount that the Yankees paid for him. Of course, the Yankees can get away with stuff like that because of their revenues and because they were IN A POSITION TO WIN when they signed Rodriguez. But by the logic of this "argument," a whole bunch of teams should be have been in on Rodriguez because he wasn't going to be on the market again. Well, duh. But he also isn't going to meet his previous levels of production again either, and managing the down side of FA contracts is actually critically important for teams that have limited payroll flexibility.

I mean, JTrea, imagine if the Orioles had signed Teixeira prior to 2009. Would he have put them over the hump in any of the last three years? No. In fact, he probably wouldn't have even brought the Orioles a .500 season. Now Teixeira is 32 as of April of next year, and seems to be in a rather significant offensive decline. Imagine if the Orioles had that contract. It would severely limit their ability to address other needs of the ballclub, all while FAILING TO MAKE THE TEAM A CONTENDER. That's the goal, isn't it? To contend? Your emphasis on instant gratification through the FA market, which you harp on EVERY OFFSEASON would have long since sunk the Orioles with horrible contracts for declining players. Your philosophies should be kept as far away from the Orioles decision-making process as possible.

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Dumb argument. A free agent's greatest value is USUALLY at the start of his contract. By the end of their contracts, most free agents are no longer capable of maintaining the same level of production. Thus, for instance, the Yankees signed Alex Rodriguez to a $300 million deal which looks really bad now. It did however help them win the World Series in 2009, but from here on out Rodriguez is not going to be valuable enough to justify the amount that the Yankees paid for him. Of course, the Yankees can get away with stuff like that because of their revenues and because they were IN A POSITION TO WIN when they signed Rodriguez. But by the logic of this "argument," a whole bunch of teams should be have been in on Rodriguez because he wasn't going to be on the market again. Well, duh. But he also isn't going to meet his previous levels of production again either, and managing the down side of FA contracts is actually critically important for teams that have limited payroll flexibility.

I mean, JTrea, imagine if the Orioles had signed Teixeira prior to 2009. Would he have put them over the hump in any of the last three years? No. In fact, he probably wouldn't have even brought the Orioles a .500 season. Now Teixeira is 32 as of April of next year, and seems to be in a rather significant offensive decline. Imagine if the Orioles had that contract. It would severely limit their ability to address other needs of the ballclub, all while FAILING TO MAKE THE TEAM A CONTENDER. That's the goal, isn't it? To contend? Your emphasis on instant gratification through the FA market, which you harp on EVERY OFFSEASON would have long since sunk the Orioles with horrible contracts for declining players. Your philosophies should be kept as far away from the Orioles decision-making process as possible.

Tex was still a 4.0+ fWAR player last year, and he's only been worth a few million less than his contract thus far.

And look at all the money that was wasted to sign sub replacement players. It pretty much equals Tex's salary, so don't tell me his contract would have hamstrung the club in anyway. They would have had to commit to winning around Tex, something they obviously weren't willing to do so had they actually done that, we would have been a competitive team instead of just treading water.

Resource allocation has been a big problem for this club. I think Duquette will fix that.

As long as you don't waste money on positions or players that provide the least value as the Orioles have done, you can afford a couple of premium contracts.

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