Bryce Harper is a BEAST!

[Tony-OH]

Was annoyed then that we didn't lose enough to pick him #1 overall. Still annoyed now, especially since he's playing in my backyard.

I don't hate the Nats or anything, I'm happy to see them doing well and I love watching Harper play. Just wish he was ours.

Yeah, I'm kinda like that as well. We would be ecstatic to have a guy like Harper on the team with the kind of start we've had already. He might be cocky, but he plays hard and honestly, that's what I really care about when I watch the game as a fan.

[Can_of_corn]

Clearly he should go back to AA and AAA and prove he can play there.

OPS in the low 700's, self inflicted head wound, missing cut off men, error on a routine play.

He is definitely a finished product that clearly doesn't have anything else to learn in the minors.

I said it last night and I meant it, I would rather have Trout.

[xKHx]

OPS in the low 700's, self inflicted head wound, missing cut off men, error on a routine play.

He is definitely a finished product that clearly doesn't have anything else to learn in the minors.

I said it last night and I meant it, I would rather have Trout.

Hah yeah Harper looks lost in all aspects of the game right now.

[Stotle]

OPS in the low 700's, self inflicted head wound, missing cut off men, error on a routine play.

He is definitely a finished product that clearly doesn't have anything else to learn in the minors.

I said it last night and I meant it, I would rather have Trout.

I don't remember everything everyone posts, but I've currently been operating under the belief that you are generally a pretty reasonable poster with some good insights. Rather than throwing that out the window, I'll pretend this was a tongue in cheek attempt at humor.

EDIT -- outside of the trout comment, obviously. That's an opinion many share, and Trout is certainly a very talented baseball player.

[Can_of_corn]

I don't remember everything everyone posts, but I've currently been operating under the belief that you are generally a pretty reasonable poster with some good insights. Rather than throwing that out the window, I'll pretend this was a tongue in cheek attempt at humor.

Feel free to throw it out if you like. He is an immensely talented young man that could use some more time in the minors to hone his craft. If you feel like that is an unreasonable view to hold then go ahead and condemn me for it.

[Stotle]

Feel free to throw it out if you like. He is an immensely talented young man that could use some more time in the minors to hone his craft. If you feel like that is an unreasonable view to hold then go ahead and condemn me for it.

Got it. And to be clear, your reasoning is some struggles at the plate, an error and an overthrow. Makes perfect sense...

And Wieters obviously would have been better served in the minors in 2010 rather than OPSing .695 for a full season.

[Can_of_corn]

Got it. And to be clear, your reasoning is some struggles at the plate, an error and an overthrow. Makes perfect sense...

And Wieters obviously would have been better served in the minors in 2010 rather than OPSing .695 for a full season.

More then one overthrow, and don't forget letting his frustrations get the better of himself with his injury.

Like I said before I am not doubting his talent, but he has been playing outfield for less then two seasons. I think he needs some reps. Can he learn in the majors? Sure, and the O's could put Bundy in the Bullpen, or Machado at third. That doesn't mean it is the best move for the player.

I also know you are not comparing offensive production at catcher with a corner outfielder.

Edit- BTW I am not saying he needs to spend all year in the minors. More like till after the all star break.

[Stotle]

More then one overthrow, and don't forget letting his frustrations get the better of himself with his injury.

Like I said before I am not doubting his talent, but he has been playing outfield for less then two seasons. I think he needs some reps. Can he learn in the majors? Sure, and the O's could put Bundy in the Bullpen, or Machado at third. That doesn't mean it is the best move for the player.

I also know you are not comparing offensive production at catcher with a corner outfielder.

Edit- BTW I am not saying he needs to spend all year in the minors. More like till after the all star break.

I mean, you aren't even discussing developmental issues. I don't think this is a discussion worth having.

And to recap the discussion that ACTUALLY took place when Harper was called up, I commented that I was excited that he was recalled because I think so highly of him and really enjoy watching him play. I also noted that I could understand why Washington made the decision, considering the circumstances.

I have never campaigned for Harper to be called up, nor have I said one way or the other when he should be on the MLB roster -- be it the begininng of the year, Septmber, or anywhere in between. I definitely think he can hold his own right now, and I definitely don't think there are holes in his game that require MiLB time.

As was the case when Wieters came up, and through his first two full seasons, I'll continue to preach patience with an incredibly talented baseball player that is adjusting to his final bump in competition. That doesn't mean I don't expect people to make silly statements based on 20 games, of course.

[Can_of_corn]

So throwing to the correct base isn't a developmental issue?

I recall the discussion that took place, I quoted you later saying that he obviously did not need to return to the minors, an observation you made in a lot less then 20 games.

In reality there isn't a large gulf of disagreement here. I just think a couple months more in the minors would do him good and you think that is an unreasonable view to hold.

[Stotle]

So throwing to the correct base isn't a developmental issue?

I recall the discussion that took place, I quoted you later saying that he obviously did not need to return to the minors, an observation you made in a lot less then 20 games.

In reality there isn't a large gulf of disagreement here. I just think a couple months more in the minors would do him good and you think that is an unreasonable view to hold.

I am thinking maybe you haven't been watching him regularly. No, making an incorrect in-game decision is not a developmental issue in the context of Harper's game. He can clearly play MLB quality outfield, and has actually shown flashes of potential above-average defense in center field.

The bolded is asinine, but frames your general tone in this "convo" appropriately.

[Can_of_corn]

I am thinking maybe you haven't been watching him regularly. No, making an incorrect in-game decision is not a developmental issue in the context of Harper's game. He can clearly play MLB quality outfield, and has actually shown flashes of potential above-average defense in center field.

The bolded is asinine, but frames your general tone in this "convo" appropriately.

I was ready to shelve this but I have a question based off this post. I hope it isn't an "asinine" question.

How is making incorrect in-game decisions not a developmental issue? I am not even talking about Harper here. Shouldn't part of the developmental process be insuring the players make the correct in-game decisions?

[Stotle]

I was ready to shelve this but I have a question based off this post. I hope it isn't an "asinine" question.

How is making incorrect in-game decisions not a developmental issue? I am not even talking about Harper here. Shouldn't part of the developmental process be insuring the players make the correct in-game decisions?

Apologies -- it's my fault the convo devolved, as I should have just put a full post together in response to your first post. I honestly wasn't that interested in having the convo, so I did a half-assed job of actually partaking in it.

To answer your question, throwing to the wrong base, generally, is something you address throughout the developmental process. But, as is the case with all things development, you need to place specific issues in the greater context of the player having the issues. In this context, if you as an org believe a player is ready for a level, you don't hold him back because of of a couple of bad in-game decisions. In Harper's case, I think it's particularly inappropriate to treat this as if it's an indication of further minor league development being required. His first steps have been very good, his arm has generally been accurate and is among the best in the game right now. He tracks well and has shown athleticism making some diving and leaping plays on balls. His total defensive package, to me, seems pretty clearly to be worthy of final refinement at the MLB level, even if you believe some of his in-game decisions have been incorrect.

More broadly, I dismissed your comments off-hand primarily because you are treating an OPS after 20 games as if it is something that matters. It obviously doesn't. You point out that I made a comment about him looking ready well before the 20-game mark. That's true, but my comments were based off of observation. I may be incorrect in my opinion, but I observed plenty of Harper playing before making my comment, and certainly enough to form a valid opinion on the matter. 20 games is not a large enough sample to draw a valid opinion on a player's performance, outside of extreme examples (say, OPSing .350 and striking out 50% of the time).

Summary, yes, throwing to the right base is a developmental issue in that you are trying to "develop" a player such that he makes the correct decision. It is not a developmental issue in that you would weigh those plays in context of a player's full game and determine that is evidence for him not being developmentally prepared for his current level (whatever the level is). It's also faulty logic to assume that development can only occur (or even should preferably occur) at the minor league level. There are countless examples where you'd love a player to finish smoothing out the rough edges at the MLB level.

Again, sorry for not simply laying out my thoughts initially. It's generally a complicated issue, and I think the cursory manner in which you addressed it turned me off to even discussing with you (especially since you decided to be pithy while singling me out and making a point which I considered borderline silly). I hope I've clarified my points here.

[Can_of_corn]

Thanks for the well thought out and articulate post.

[Slappy]

So you send Harper down and play Xavier Nady? Does that give your team, widely considered a contender, a better chance to win? I don't think it does. And that doesn't even add in the fact that the kid is only going to get better.