Orioles have talked to Tigers about Porcello...

[theobird]

I can get behind this as well, except you lost me with the Valencia/Flaherty platoon. I imagine the combination of taking on Hardy and JJ's payroll would necessitate that Jhonny Peralta be included in the deal. He's got 1 yr/6MM left and would make a much better stopgap than those two. He had an atrocious year with the bat last year, but he can play some defense and has some pop. He'd be a solid bet to be an average 3B, and if he put up anything like his 2011 numbers at the plate, potentially better.

So something like Hardy and JJ for Porcello, Castellanos, Peralta, and Crosby might work. I'd want another prospect coming back our way if that were the case, but the problem is the Tigers system is pretty barren outside of Castellanos, Garcia, and Rondon at the top. For instance, they just sold their #10 prospect (by Sickels) to a Japanese team. Maybe we could get Rondon, but the best targets for that last prospect are probably SS Eugenio Suarez and OF Tyler Collins, who put up very good OBPs in A in their age 21 and 22 seasons, respecitively. For reference, Sickels has them #6 and #7; Crosby is #8.

OK, fair enough. I am not a big Peralta fan, but I suppose I could take him back if it were needed to make a deal. JJ and Hardy for Porcello, Castellanos, Peralta, Crosby and Suarez. I would do that trade.

[CaptainRedbeard]

What makes Porcello attractive is our superior infield defense. Why trade the most important part of that to get him'

Detroit needs back end BP help and loves hard throwing relievers. I would offer Strop and Avery or Hoes and see if that works

I think that trade is pretty even in value but with the interest Porcello is generating, they can probably get more.

I agree 100% that one of the main reasons Porcello is attractive is that we currently have amazing infield defense. But as I said in my other post, any trade that we give up Hardy probably brings us Peralta back, and I think he could play a solid 3B.

His UZR there is pretty bad from 2009 and 2010 but he's put up two very good seasons at SS since then. Over 2010-12, a fairly long sample, he has been very sure-handed and has made very few errors (he made a lot in his first season at 3B in 2009, which is unsurprising). My very amateur scouting report from watching him play is that he has a decently strong arm but limited range because he's on the hefty side for a SS. Those are the skills that translate well to 3B.

An infield defense of Peralta, Machado, and Casilla isn't as good as our current arrangement with Hardy, but that's still a plus defensive infield IMO.

[mattman0182]

I would not include Hardy in any trade for Porcello. We would not realize how important his defense is until it is no longer there.

[CaptainRedbeard]

OK, fair enough. I am not a big Peralta fan, but I suppose I could take him back if it were needed to make a deal. JJ and Hardy for Porcello, Castellanos, Peralta, Crosby and Suarez. I would do that trade.

I love Hardy, and as I said before I don't like weakening the defense while acquiring Porcello, but I also think moving Machado to SS now would be beneficial for his continued development and maximize his current and future value. That's very important to the fate of our team. That's the deciding factor that I think I would probably get me to go for this trade. I'm not sure the Tigers would do it, and I know a lot of Orioles fans would be against it. Probably means it's an even deal.

Acquiring Porcello also gives the ability to trade one of our SP. I've mentioned this before, but I'd love to get Danny Espinosa from the Nats. Considering we'd be losing Hardy's D, that'd make getting Espinosa even more valuable. Especially if we get Sanchez and Castellanos, I'd be more comfortable dealing Schoop to get him (or Sanchez himself). Something like Arrieta/Schoop/Matusz or Tillman/Sanchez/Patton for Espinosa and Morse would fit very nicely with the Tigers trade, and would probably be reasonable for the Nats. Maybe Crosby could be included as well.

[wildcard]

I think Porcello is the Schlerholtz of the Saunders negotiations.

[crawjo]

Porcello could be a nice fit. Going from Detroit's defense to Baltimore's would do wonders for his ERA.

[isestrex]

I would love to see Porcello with the Orioles infield behind him.

...and so would Porcello's agent to be honest...

[ChaosLex]

Jeremy (who used to post on here) said he heard a rumor that the Tigers wanted Jim Johnson, Jonathan Schoop and one more. If true, no thanks!

[Dark Helmet]

Jeremy (who used to post on here) said he heard a rumor that the Tigers wanted Jim Johnson, Jonathan Schoop and one more. If true, no thanks!

If true, i'd imagine talking is all the two clubs will be doing.

[Three Run Homer]

Porcello may be the most overrated pitcher in baseball. If he had come up at age 23 and posted the exact same numbers for his career, he would be regarded as a generic innings-eater. The only thing that sustains his supposed value is that he came to the majors at age 20, so people think he must have the upside of a front line starter. He's had four full seasons and he hasn't progressed; he still doesn't strike anyone out and he hasn't had an ERA below 4 since his rookie season despite playing in a pitchers park.

[crowmst3k!]

Jeremy (who used to post on here) said he heard a rumor that the Tigers wanted Jim Johnson, Jonathan Schoop and one more. If true, no thanks!

Vomit. No thanks, Detroit.

[isestrex]

Porcello may be the most overrated pitcher in baseball. If he had come up at age 23 and posted the exact same numbers for his career, he would be regarded as a generic innings-eater. The only thing that sustains his supposed value is that he came to the majors at age 20, so people think he must have the upside of a front line starter. He's had four full seasons and he hasn't progressed; he still doesn't strike anyone out and he hasn't had an ERA below 4 since his rookie season despite playing in a pitchers park.

He's a ground ball pitcher who has played with a progessively horrific infield for his entire career. The more he learns about the art of pitching, the worse his defense gets behind him. He may not be worth giving up anything significant, but I have high faith that he'll put up career numbers with Machado/Hardy/Castilla behind him instead of Cabrera/Peralta/Rayburn *shudders*

[Tryptamine]

Porcello 2012

ERA 4.59 FIP 3.91 xFIP 3.89 SIERA 4.00 babip .344

Really bad luck(.344 babip) and his team's god awful infield defense make him look so much worse than he is. His FIP, xFIP and SIERA have also improved every single year he's been in the majors.

[joe42]

He's a ground ball pitcher who has played with a progessively horrific infield for his entire career. The more he learns about the art of pitching, the worse his defense gets behind him. He may not be worth giving up anything significant, but I have high faith that he'll put up career numbers with Machado/Hardy/Castilla behind him instead of Cabrera/Peralta/Rayburn *shudders*

Absolutly agree with this. I would think quite posibly a bullpen arm may net you Porcello. imo.

[srock]

Jeremy (who used to post on here) said he heard a rumor that the Tigers wanted Jim Johnson, Jonathan Schoop and one more. If true, no thanks!

Too much to give up? Yes.

But if this is what the Tigers are asking right off the bat, I think we got a starting point. I'd counter with Strop, Hoes, and a low prospect and see where it takes us.