Joe Saunders update

[wildcard]

Bill Center, reporter for UT San Diego says that there are four teams in on Saunders- O's, Twins, Padres and Mets.

Padres are looking at Marcum, Saunders and Porcello per Centers. Tigers are less certain that they want to trade Porcello.

http://www.utsandiego.com/padres-chat/#

Twins- Star Tribune reporter La Velle E. Neal III says that the Twins will not offer Saunders a two year contract. Twins are also looking at Marcum and Brett Myers

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/blogs/184829411.html

NY Post reporter Ken Davidoff says that the Mets are interested in Pavano, Chris Young and Marcum. They are also discussing trading for Capuano or Harang. No mention of Saunders.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/mets/some_idle_chatter_wvAvPAcfBX3UqDR97PGDWM

Bottom line: The O's and three non contenders have some interest in Saunders. No reports that anyone will offer more than one year but that is not conclusive.

[justcompete]

I will be surprised is he can't get a two year deal after some of the signings we have seen this offseason.

But if he has to take a 1 year deal to build up his value he is better off in the NL.

[OsLuvrInKy]

I would have no problem with Saunders for 1/6-8 with a 2nd year option for 8-10MM that kicks in based on performance. We have seen Buck, basically sit Gregg using him in unimportant situations. If Joe does not perform as well as someone like S.J., Brian, Jake, etc.. he gets stashed in the pen, and the option won't kick in.

[Scrat1]

Thanks for the update. I've got no problem with two guaranteed years for Saunders, especially if we're trading some of the calvary for a bat.

[24fps]

I'd go two guaranteed years as well as long as he doesn't get a no-trade clause.

[Frobby]

My gut tells me Saunders will be an Oriole by the end of next week.

[sevastras]

My gut tells me Saunders will be an Oriole by the end of next week.

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

[centralpaosfan]

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

When you think you have enough pitching.....sign two more.

[sevastras]

When you think you have enough pitching.....sign two more.

I guess so, but I would hate for Saunders to be blocking Johnson. I want to see what he can do for a bit.

[Mayor McCheese]

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

No proven track record of those stats. The thing Joe brings to the rotation is stability in the back end. We could shuffle 2 of Arrieta/Britton/Matusz/SJohnson in the rotation like years past... but its just a broken record.. they pitch one great game and then go on to have a horrible month.

However I do like Matusz running for a spot again, if he can pitch like the end of last season... :hearts:

[Ruzious]

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

After reading that list of candidates, I'm more certain the O's need Saunders - or someone like him.

[24fps]

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

Saunders has pitched 974 innings from 2008-2012 never having had a year where he pitched less than 174.2. That kind of durability would be immensely valuable at the back end of our rotation.

[Frobby]

Why?

Steve Johnson 2.11 ERA over 12 games and yes only 38.1 innings, but looked very good.

Chris Tillman 2.93 ERA over 15 games and 86 innings, also looked good.

Miguel Gonzalez 3.25 over 18 games and 105.1 innings

Jason Hammel 3.43 over 20 games 118 innings

Chen 4.02 over 32 games and 192.2 innings

and then you have Matusz and Britton both trying to fight for a spot. That is 7 real options, plus Arrieta and Bundy on the outside shots. I know you can never have enough pitching, but if the rotation performed any where close to those numbers above(which I know is not entirely realistic with the SSS) then Saunders isnt cracking that rotation and the combined salary would be less than just his. I think if we are going to get another pitcher, then we need someone better than Saunders. I like the guy and he did a good job, but if we arent trading any starters I dont see the point in signing him.

I'm just telling you what I feel is going to happen. Personally, I'd only do it if we had a signed, sealed and ready-to-go trade of a starting pitcher or two for a good hitter. But I think Duquette and Buck like the stability Saunders brings and will sign him up and worry about trades later.

[Dark Helmet]

I guess so, but I would hate for Saunders to be blocking Johnson. I want to see what he can do for a bit.

Going with a rotation that includes Gonzo, Tillman, and SJ is a huge mistake. You know what you will get with Saunders. Basically 3 runs over 6. I don't think SJ will have success as a SP once they see him more. Has Tillman really figured it out? Is Miguel Gonzalez as good as he showed in 2012? Thats just too many questions to have to not have a veteran like Saunders. If 2 of the 3 flop then whos waiting to take those spots? Just more question marks like Arrieta, Britton, and Matusz. I wish I could see the "depth" a pot of folks do. All I see is arms to throw out there. Those are two different things to me. Just my opinion though.

[luismatos4prez]

It'd be great to have one less question mark in the rotation. I'd take 200 innings of 4.40 ERA and say thank you very much. Especially with a strong defense behind him.

I like SJ a lot, too. For whatever reason, hitters just can't pick up on his fast ball. He has a lot of deception in his delivery. But I'm not willing to hand him a starting rotation spot with just the cavalry and Wada behind him to start the year.

The presentation of Joe Saunders as a joke has escalated ever since the Orioles had the gall to name him starter for Friday’s American League Wild Card game. Nobody is accusing Joe Saunders of greatness, but he has made a living on competency. He has a 98 career ERA- — just slightly better than average. Aggressively competent, even.

Still, it’s understandable why Saunders is treated as the kind of pitcher who should be hit hard. In both browsing his statistics and watching his pitches, he has no discernible strengths. He lives in the high 80s with his fastball. He doesn’t throw a curveball with exceptional break. He has a changeup, but he isn’t a changeup artist of the Shaun Marcum or Johan Santana variety.

But in one way, Joe Saunders has been one of the major league’s best pitchers since 2008:

Rk Player GDP GS ERA+

1 Felix Hernandez 121 165 137

2 Mark Buehrle 117 162 113

3 Joe Saunders 117 156 104

4 Paul Maholm 112 151 98

5 Derek Lowe 111 156 92

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used

Generated 10/5/2012.

That's from Fangraphs after we beat Texas. The chart formatting is weird, but Saunders has gotten the 3rd most DPs in the MLB since 2008