Roch: Showalter comments on Bourn's availability

[Dark Helmet]

This is my most current incarnation as Santa.

As to your agenda, usually when people project they do it subconsciously. I would suspect you are one of the PA is a miserly old skinsflint/DD is handcuffed by his budgetary constraints/Buck wants to win but can't because we wont spend, people. Why would you think Bourn would be a help to this team? Why do you think Buck thinks so?

Thats a pretty nifty costume. Yes, I do not like Mr Angelos's lack of spending. However, that had nothing to do with my comment. Buck seems to atleast be considering outside help to where DD seems set on what we have. You got some pretty iffy question marks as options for the top of the order. Buck values speed, defense, and the ability to get on base. aBourn provides all three and has stayed healthy. If he had the choice between an OF of Jones, Bourn, Markakis with McLouth as a 4th OF and Reimold at DH or an OF of McLouth, Jones, Markakis with Reimold as the 4th OF and one of Pierce, Valencia, or Jackson at DH, what option would he realistically choose? Buck would love a guy like Bourn batting leadoff. A guy with a .345 OBP and the ability to steal 40+ bases? Agree to disagree, but I can't see how Buck could prefer McLouth/Reimold over Bourn/McLouth. Maybe i'm wrong.

[Frobby]

Thats a pretty nifty costume. Yes, I do not like Mr Angelos's lack of spending. However, that had nothing to do with my comment. Buck seems to atleast be considering outside help to where DD seems set on what we have. You got some pretty iffy question marks as options for the top of the order. Buck values speed, defense, and the ability to get on base. aBourn provides all three and has stayed healthy. If he had the choice between an OF of Jones, Bourn, Markakis with McLouth as a 4th OF and Reimold at DH or an OF of McLouth, Jones, Markakis with Reimold as the 4th OF and one of Pierce, Valencia, or Jackson at DH, what option would he realistically choose? Buck would love a guy like Bourn batting leadoff. A guy with a .345 OBP and the ability to steal 40+ bases? Agree to disagree, but I can't see how Buck could prefer McLouth/Reimold over Bourn/McLouth. Maybe i'm wrong.

As I said earlier in this thread, I would read nothing at all into what Showalter said. A fan sent a tweet into Wall to Wall Baseball asking if Michael Bourn would be a good fit. To me, Buck gave a very general answer and then quickly changed the subject to the confidence he has in his own players. If I recall, he also fielded a question about Michael Morse and gave a similar style answer. All he really said, in both instances, was "we think about and discuss various players who might fit here all the time." It's not like he singled out Bourn as someone to discuss -- that was the fan's question. Having heard it live, I certainly didn't come away with any impression at all that Bourn is someone Buck would like to be pursuing -- he didn't telegraph that at all.

[El Gordo]

Over the past 4 seasons, excluding his first full season, Bourn has nearly a .350 OBP. But that's beside the point.

If Roberts is good he will play. If he is not he won't. All that matters for if Roberts gets cut is if he is better than Casilla. It has nothing to do with his lineup position and whether or not Bourn is on the team.

Do you think that if we don't sign Bourn, Roberts will be leading off? I don't see it with McLouth and Markakis on the team. Unless he tears apart ST, I think Roberts is starting OD batting ninth, or not starting at all.

Bottom line is that you think lineup position is extremely important, apparently. Showalter probably agrees with you more than I would like. Agree to disagree.

If Roberts is hitting at all, he will be the lead off hitter. His glove isn't good enough to justify batting #9. If he isn't hitting he wont be in the lineup at all. The aren't going av=fter Bourn he costs too much plus the pick and would force too many guys out of position. He isn't a fit for us. I think Buck makes that pretty clear. Much better for TEX or ATL.

[Il BuonO]

If Roberts is hitting at all, he will be the lead off hitter. His glove isn't good enough to justify batting #9. If he isn't hitting he wont be in the lineup at all. The aren't going av=fter Bourn he costs too much plus the pick and would force too many guys out of position. He isn't a fit for us. I think Buck makes that pretty clear. Much better for TEX or ATL.

I agree we aren't going after Bourn, but I don't necessarily see Roberts leading off. I think Buck really liked Nick there and Roberts would be a good candidate for the two spot.

[El Gordo]

I agree we aren't going after Bourn, but I don't necessarily see Roberts leading off. I think Buck really liked Nick there and Roberts would be a good candidate for the two spot.

That's possible but if Brian is getting on base I think he bats Nick #2. Brian's still a threat to steal, and Nick not so much.

[Il BuonO]

That's possible but if Brian is getting on base I think he bats Nick #2. Brian's still a threat to steal, and Nick not so much.

He didn't look like it when he came back last year. Maybe a full ST will help him to get on track physically, but I wouldn't bet on him getting on base more than Nick.

[Frobby]

If Roberts is hitting at all, he will be the lead off hitter. His glove isn't good enough to justify batting #9.

It's a multi-part equation. Casilla had a .282 OBP last year. If he's playing at that level this year, Roberts could have a .315ish OBP and still get most of the playing time -- but in that case it would make more sense to bat him 9th, if McLouth, Reimold and Markakis are all in the lineup. But if Casilla's OBP is more like the .322 he put up in 2011, then BRob could find himself on the bench.

[Frobby]

He didn't look like it when he came back last year. Maybe a full ST will help him to get on track physically, but I wouldn't bet on him getting on base more than Nick.

There's zero chance BRob will get on base more often than Nick. If BRob had a .330 OBP, I'd be delighted. Nick will be in the .350+ range, and hopefully, over .360.

[Il BuonO]

It's a multi-part equation. Casilla had a .282 OBP last year. If he's playing at that level this year, Roberts could have a .315ish OBP and still get most of the playing time -- but in that case it would make more sense to bat him 9th, if McLouth, Reimold and Markakis are all in the lineup. But if Casilla's OBP is more like the .322 he put up in 2011, then BRob could find himself on the bench.

If it's that close I don't see Roberts going to the bench. As much as Casilla's glove would warrant it I see them giving every opportunity to Roberts. He would have to have a complete collapse or breakdown physically to totally lose the job.

[Il BuonO]

There's zero chance BRob will get on base more often than Nick. If BRob had a .330 OBP, I'd be delighted. Nick will be in the .350+ range, and hopefully, over .360.

I really hope Nick isn't moved out of the lead off spot because I think he found his comfort zone and could be above the numbers you posted.

[El Gordo]

He didn't look like it when he came back last year. Maybe a full ST will help him to get on track physically, but I wouldn't bet on him getting on base more than Nick.

It's not a question of getting on base more it's his ability to do it at an above average rate. Roberts is a good base stealer because of his ability to read pitchers tendancies not because he is fast. He hasn't been that fast for some time. If he is healty and gettong on base he will be among our SB leaders.

[El Gordo]

It's a multi-part equation. Casilla had a .282 OBP last year. If he's playing at that level this year, Roberts could have a .315ish OBP and still get most of the playing time -- but in that case it would make more sense to bat him 9th, if McLouth, Reimold and Markakis are all in the lineup. But if Casilla's OBP is more like the .322 he put up in 2011, then BRob could find himself on the bench.

You are giving up a lot on defense keeping Roberts in the lineup even at those numbers for him and Casilla. Plus Casilla has better speed and does the little things with the bat that Roberts doesn't. I would bat him #9 and McLouth #1 even if Roberts had a .330 OBP, but I don't think Buck will.

[Il BuonO]

It's not a question of getting on base more it's his ability to do it at an above average rate. Roberts is a good base stealer because of his ability to read pitchers tendancies not because he is fast. He hasn't been that fast for some time. If he is healty and gettong on base he will be among our SB leaders.

I agree with your assessment of his base stealing ability, however, I was the same type of player but I didn't have the misfortune of seeing what limited speed I did have decline before my eyes. He will not be among our leaders in SB. He doesn't have the speed anymore and you still need that even if you can read a pitchers tendencies.

I'll edit and say I'd be shocked if he had more than 15 SB.

[El Gordo]

I agree with your assessment of his base stealing ability, however, I was the same type of player but I didn't have the misfortune of seeing what limited speed I did have decline before my eyes. He will not be among our leaders in SB. He doesn't have the speed anymore and you still need that even if you can read a pitchers tendencies.

I'll edit and say I'd be shocked if he had more than 15 SB.

If he stays healthy enough to play 130 games he'll have more than 15 SB.

[MachadOboutManny]

Shocked if Bourn has more than 15 steals? Id be more shocked if Bourn has less than 15 steals than I would be if Wieters had 35 steals.

I would love to have Bourn. An Oriole that can run, what a treat it would be. Its interesting to read that anyone would rather have Reimold/Mcclouth than Bourn. The OH value system. I love our guys, but Bourn can play and while I'm sure he's asking for too much, it would be nice to have a leadoff and therefore a #2 in Nick rather than neither.

He is a player that depends almost entirely on his legs and while you cant coach speed, you also cant maintain it forever. Bourn isn't old yet, but having just turned 30 it would be hard to pay a ton for a guy who depends on speed as much as he does into his mid 30s. I think Bourn makes us a much more dangerous lineup in 2013.