Koji trade better than Bedard trade?

[isestrex]

Tommy Hunter has started a World Series game. Do the Orioles have anyone in their rotation that has done that? Maybe Garcia?

Garcia was a part of that crazy White Sox pitching staff in 2005. Along with Buehrle, Garland and Contreras. Talk about a list of an unlikely dominant rotation....

[theobird]

Yeah, I've thought that too. MacPhail really is the main architect of the team that made the playoffs last year.

There really is no question about that in my mind. Andy did one heck of a job for this franchise, and sadly, it seems as if he gets very little credit. His trades were off the charts. You can argue all day long about which one was best, but the guy made great trades for this team. Did he make a bad trade?

[skanar]

There really is no question about that in my mind. Andy did one heck of a job for this franchise, and sadly, it seems as if he gets very little credit. His trades were off the charts. You can argue all day long about which one was best, but the guy made great trades for this team. Did he make a bad trade?

Arguably, the trade for Mark Reynolds, though I'd say it was more of a wash, and there are plenty of people who will defend it.

Either way, his strategy of waiting until a deal was clearly in the O's favor paid off whenever a deal took place. He added a lot of talent to the organization. I do think he gets a good amount of credit though.

[Grt 2BA FL Gator]

Arguably, the trade for Mark Reynolds, though I'd say it was more of a wash, and there are plenty of people who will defend it.

Either way, his strategy of waiting until a deal was clearly in the O's favor paid off whenever a deal took place. He added a lot of talent to the organization. I do think he gets a good amount of credit though.

I think the Koji trade is helping him. There were quite a few MacPhail nay sayers at the end of his tenure, but I definitely think he laid the foundation for DD and did a good job with what he had, just like DD is doing (not spending big in FA).

Biggest knock to me is the lack of presence internationally, but we did have our eye on Chen under his watch.

[skanar]

I think the Koji trade is helping him. There were quite a few MacPhail nay sayers at the end of his tenure, but I definitely think he laid the foundation for DD and did a good job with what he had, just like DD is doing (not spending big in FA).

Biggest knock to me is the lack of presence internationally, but we did have our eye on Chen under his watch.

Schoop? Ed Rodriguez? All the guys who were given a shot but ultimately washed out, like Dudley Leonora?

In hindsight, it's become clear that MacPhail had more going on internationally than he was given credit for, perhaps due to the lack of splashy, high-$ signings. On the one hand, that meant no Yu Darvish. On the other, it meant not spending $100MM on Daisuke Matsuzaka. Still, he could've done more there, I suppose.

My biggest discontents with AM were the reports about player development in the minors and the apparent lack of communication/integration between the minor league teams. But there's a lot I don't know, and a lot I don't know I don't know. It could even be that things had gotten so bad that it would have taken anyone more time than AM was in Baltimore to turn things around in that department.

[weams]

Yes, it's a bit reactionary to the first of half of this season, but Chris Davis is that MOO bat we needed and Hunter is lights out right now. And we didn't even have to give up an ace like Bedard, we gave up a solid reliever.

Think about it.. Either way, Andy Macphail deserves kudos. Great trades.

It was pretty good.

[Beef Supreme]

It was a fine trade. Plus, they removed the pathogen from the clubhouse that was Erik Bedard.

[Can_of_corn]

It was a fine trade. Plus, they removed the pathogen from the clubhouse that was Erik Bedard.

I never heard a word about him being an issue in the clubhouse. The press box maybe but not the clubhouse.

[Il BuonO]

I never heard a word about him being an issue in the clubhouse. The press box maybe but not the clubhouse.

This. He wasn't a problem on the team.

[Beef Supreme]

I never heard a word about him being an issue in the clubhouse. The press box maybe but not the clubhouse.

I remember hearing that Orioles' management felt he had "quit on the team" in 2007. His last start that year was August 26. He took the loss that day to bring the Orioles' record to 58-71, en route to a 69-93 season mark and a fourth place finish in the AL East. Turns out, another team felt that he quit on them twice. Wrote, "It?s no coincidence that (Mariners' GM Bill) Bavasi was fired following a horrible weekend that Bedard could?ve helped prevent. But for the second straight start, Bedard left a game Saturday because of fatigue.

He only wants to throw 100 pitches, and then he feels his job is done, regardless of the score, regardless of the situation. He?s a 9-to-5er. Don?t you dare ask him to work overtime.... I asked Bavasi on Monday about Bedard?s pitch-count threshold. After bouncing between defending and explaining Bedard, the axed GM ? clearly exasperated ? said I needed to ask the pitcher. 'You gotta ask him,' Bavasi said. 'You gotta ask him. Good luck. And he?s gonna have some stupid answer, some dumbass answer.'" Then there's this from Jeff Sullivan of the USS Mariner, "Departing coaches, in the past, have taken parting shots at Bedard, accusing him of not giving enough or caring enough." And there is this bit of ugliness from something called The Sports Pig's Blog: "If you were to poll them, 99% of Seattle fans believe Bedard simply quit on his team two years in a row and there isn?t anything wrong with him physically... Seattle fans HATE Erik Bedard. Even the Seattle Times let a comment run referring to Bedard as ?a 99-pitch *****.? It refers to Bedard?s refusal to throw over 100 pitches in any start in order to protect his arm. No other Major League pitcher puts his manager and pitching coach under such constraints.

If my understanding of what management though of him is incorrect, please forgive me. That's just the impression I have been given.

[Beef Supreme]

I remember hearing that Orioles' management felt he had "quit on the team" in 2007. His last start that year was August 26. He took the loss that day to bring the Orioles' record to 58-71, en route to a 69-93 season mark and a fourth place finish in the AL East. Turns out, another team felt that he quit on them twice. Jerry Brewer of the Seattle Times wrote, "It's no coincidence that (Mariners' GM Bill) Bavasi was fired following a horrible weekend that Bedard could've helped prevent. But for the second straight start, Bedard left a game Saturday because of fatigue.

He only wants to throw 100 pitches, and then he feels his job is done, regardless of the score, regardless of the situation. He's a 9-to-5er. Don't you dare ask him to work overtime.... I asked Bavasi on Monday about Bedard?s pitch-count threshold. After bouncing between defending and explaining Bedard, the axed GM ? clearly exasperated ? said I needed to ask the pitcher. 'You gotta ask him,' Bavasi said. 'You gotta ask him. Good luck. And he's gonna have some stupid answer, some dumbass answer.'" Then there's this from Jeff Sullivan of the USS Mariner, "Departing coaches, in the past, have taken parting shots at Bedard, accusing him of not giving enough or caring enough." And there is this bit of ugliness from something called The Sports Pig's Blog: "If you were to poll them, 99% of Seattle fans believe Bedard simply quit on his team two years in a row and there isn?t anything wrong with him physically... Seattle fans HATE Erik Bedard. Even the Seattle Times let a comment run referring to Bedard as ?a 99-pitch *****.? It refers to Bedard?s refusal to throw over 100 pitches in any start in order to protect his arm. No other Major League pitcher puts his manager and pitching coach under such constraints.

If my understanding of what management though of him is incorrect, please forgive me. That's just the impression I have been given.

The first quote was by Jerry Brewer of the Seattle Times.

[Can_of_corn]

I remember hearing that Orioles' management felt he had "quit on the team" in 2007. His last start that year was August 26. He took the loss that day to bring the Orioles' record to 58-71, en route to a 69-93 season mark and a fourth place finish in the AL East. Turns out, another team felt that he quit on them twice. Wrote, "It?s no coincidence that (Mariners' GM Bill) Bavasi was fired following a horrible weekend that Bedard could?ve helped prevent. But for the second straight start, Bedard left a game Saturday because of fatigue.

He only wants to throw 100 pitches, and then he feels his job is done, regardless of the score, regardless of the situation. He?s a 9-to-5er. Don?t you dare ask him to work overtime.... I asked Bavasi on Monday about Bedard?s pitch-count threshold. After bouncing between defending and explaining Bedard, the axed GM ? clearly exasperated ? said I needed to ask the pitcher. 'You gotta ask him,' Bavasi said. 'You gotta ask him. Good luck. And he?s gonna have some stupid answer, some dumbass answer.'" Then there's this from Jeff Sullivan of the USS Mariner, "Departing coaches, in the past, have taken parting shots at Bedard, accusing him of not giving enough or caring enough." And there is this bit of ugliness from something called The Sports Pig's Blog: "If you were to poll them, 99% of Seattle fans believe Bedard simply quit on his team two years in a row and there isn?t anything wrong with him physically... Seattle fans HATE Erik Bedard. Even the Seattle Times let a comment run referring to Bedard as ?a 99-pitch *****.? It refers to Bedard?s refusal to throw over 100 pitches in any start in order to protect his arm. No other Major League pitcher puts his manager and pitching coach under such constraints.

If my understanding of what management though of him is incorrect, please forgive me. That's just the impression I have been given.

Even if all of this is true it doesn't say anything about him in the Clubhouse.

To me a clubhouse issue is an issue with his teammates.

No doubt he had issues, but I have never heard of them being with his teammates.

As for the 100 pitch thing, he had an OPS+ of 197 with a 971 OPS allowed from pitch 101 on, so maybe he knew what he was talking about.

[DrungoHazewood]

Even if all of this is true it doesn't say anything about him in the Clubhouse.

To me a clubhouse issue is an issue with his teammates.

No doubt he had issues, but I have never heard of them being with his teammates.

As for the 100 pitch thing, he had an OPS+ of 197 with a 971 OPS allowed from pitch 101 on, so maybe he knew what he was talking about.

The unwritten rule appears to be that you have to be talked or forced out of pitching in situations where you're pretty obviously going to get shelled. You don't make that call yourself. Your ego needs to be such that you believe that precedent and evidence are just things to be overcome.

[Beef Supreme]

Even if all of this is true it doesn't say anything about him in the Clubhouse.

To me a clubhouse issue is an issue with his teammates.

No doubt he had issues, but I have never heard of them being with his teammates.

As for the 100 pitch thing, he had an OPS+ of 197 with a 971 OPS allowed from pitch 101 on, so maybe he knew what he was talking about.

We may have different interpretations of "pathogen in the clubhouse," and I might have chosen a different word. But I do believe that one person can rub off on other players and negatively impact their attitudes. Plus, if he was a "quitter" like some have described, might that be considered "an agent that causes illness to its host?"

[Beef Supreme]

As for the 100 pitch thing, he had an OPS+ of 197 with a 971 OPS allowed from pitch 101 on, so maybe he knew what he was talking about.

A lot of pitchers could learn from him, we might say. I loved watching Bedard pitch -- that was "must-see TV" (though I watched all the other games, too). I am wondering now whether I am alone in thinking that rumors leaked from Orioles' management portraying him as "quitting on the team" in 2007.