Adam Jones' slightly improved plate discipline from last year has disappeared.

[isestrex]

I think right now I might go with McClouth-Machado-Davis-Markakis-Jones-Wieters-Hardy-Flaherty-DH. At least this way Davis gets some protection. I trust Markakis to put up solid at bats if Davis is walked. It'd be nice if Wieters was the offensive juggernaut we dreamed of right?

Trying to chase your tail by giving everyone "protection" is one of the few way to destroy a lineup (and it's not that easy to do either).

[LookinUp]

Since there isn't a substantial increase in plate discipline and pitch recognition as a player accrues MLB service time I think we can state that they are difficult skills to master.

I'll bite. Do you have a citation for this? My unscientific assumption would be that if one were to create a statistical measure for plate discipline during a professional's career, with years as pro on the x axis and plate discipline on the y, it would look something like a distribution with a skew to the left.

[El Gordo]

And that would be a bad thing? <a href="http://photobucket.com/" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1106.photobucket.com/albums/h367/isestrex/Emoticons/huh.gif" border="0" alt=" photo huh.gif"/></a>

Yes. He's our best hitter. I want him to hit a few more HR this year. If they start walking him and to K Jones we don't get squat.

[NickM21]

Well Detroit bats Cabrera 3rd. Davis was getting good protection early in the year when Jones was actually hitting well.

[Can_of_corn]

I'll bite. Do you have a citation for this? My unscientific assumption would be that if one were to create a statistical measure for plate discipline during a professional's career, with years as pro on the x axis and plate discipline on the y, it would look something like a distribution with a skew to the left.

Nope and I will hide behind my use of the modifier substantial.

[Can_of_corn]

Well Detroit bats Cabrera 3rd. Davis was getting good protection early in the year when Jones was actually hitting well.

This may come as a shock but 68 year old Jim Leyland isn't exactly on the cutting edge of modern Baseball strategy.

As for Davis, he is still OPSing 1.090 over the last 28 days. His numbers are down slightly due to a 6 game or so slump where his strikeouts were up.

[anrynike]

This might be over simplifying things, but Jones seems to me like he wants so badly to be the star of the team. When other players are doing good like Davis, he pushes himself even harder and it clouds his approach at the plate. He just wants to kill the ball so bad, he simply can't help himself.

The frustrating thing is he already is the star of the team. He just needs to relax, slow down and stop pressing.

[tntoriole]

Now I come to an important feature of batting. Every player should learn to pick out good balls. Never hit at a bad one because, in this way, you are giving the pitcher an advantage, and every time you come to the bat it is a contest of wits between the pitcher and you. Good batters do not let the pitcher get them into the hole—that is, with more strikes than balls—by hitting at everything that he throws them. When you make a pitcher work to the limit every time you bat you are not only helping yourself but your club. If a twirler finds that a man will offer at a ball off the outside of the plate, he will keep them there and the batter will never get a hit... Therefore, it is very important that a batter become a good judge of a strike, and this knowledge can only be obtained by practice and self-confidence.

McGraw, John Joseph. How to Play Baseball : a Manual for Boys (1913)

Some things don't change much.

[Can_of_corn]

This might be over simplifying things, but Jones seems to me like he wants so badly to be the star of the team. When other players are doing good like Davis, he pushes himself even harder and it clouds his approach at the plate. He just wants to kill the ball so bad, he simply can't help himself.

The frustrating thing is he already is the star of the team. He just needs to relax, slow down and stop pressing.

So you think Jones' ego is so out of control he can not handle other players doing well?

[anrynike]

Someone earlier in the season said the same thing and what we learned then was, Jones isn't going to change. Why should he?

He is a Major league player and this "flawed" approach has not only got him there but ,also got him paid. He has no incentive to ever change his approach at the plate.

This makes no sense. He's in the big leagues cause he's insanely competitive. Trust me, he is not rolling over cause he's already been paid. He wants to be the best.

[anrynike]

So you think Jones' ego is so out of control he can not handle other players doing well?

I'm not saying out of control. He's just trying to hard. It clouds his judgement. He's probably stubborn as hell to.

[NickM21]

This may come as a shock but 68 year old Jim Leyland isn't exactly on the cutting edge of modern Baseball strategy.

As for Davis, he is still OPSing 1.090 over the last 28 days. His numbers are down slightly due to a 6 game or so slump where his strikeouts were up.

Fair enough. What is the order of most important batting positions again?

[Can_of_corn]

I'm not saying out of control. He's just trying to hard. It clouds his judgement. He's probably stubborn as hell to.

Well if he can't control it then it must be out of control.

It is kinda one or the other.

[anrynike]

Plus there is no question at this point Jones and Davis should be switched in the order, but who would want to mess with anything that could potentially mess up what Davis is doing right now? Not me.

[Can_of_corn]

Fair enough. What is the order of most important batting positions again?

#1, #4, #2, #5, #3, #6, #7, #8, #9

Of course the regular disclaimers about lineup order not being a huge factor on offense and the unknown effects of player comfort apply.