Davis addresses PEDs issue straight on

[blid]

The Maris year was the 1st year they went to the 162 game schedule. Traditionalists of the time of course argued that Ruth's record still holds because he did it in a 154 game schedule. Maris almost did it within 154 games but got stuck on 59 HR. He finally tied and broke the record after the 154 game record was safely preserved.

Yes, and Ruth's 60 is of course more impressive than Maris's 61, so I get why people argued that at the time. If you want, there are two records: the Ruth record for the 154-game season, and the Maris/Bonds/whoever you like record for the 162-game season. But we have 162 games now, and we can't very well just ignore home runs hit in the final stretch of the season, so the 162-game record is the only one that's currently relevant.

[blid]

How many roid driven diva performances have we seen from Crush?

Does this count?

[CA-ORIOLE]

Does this count?

Yeah, he's had a few of those now. Can't say it's roid driven like Bautista though.

[Spoonless]

I disagree with his thoughts about the record.

I don't agree with him about the record, but I respect his belief, and I respect the way he's been handling things with regards to steroid speculation.

[Redskins Rick]

He doesn't even bat flip or anything. He's a class act.

If Ripken Jr. got mad once in awhile, and he was one of the classiest guys in the sport.

[isestrex]

Unfortunately, Davis could pee in a cup, while having his blood drawn on live TV; pass all tests regarding it and it still won't matter. There are still going to be fans and guys like Rick Reilly that want to cheapen his amazing season by dismissing it to PED use.

Much like Shakespeare writing "The sins of the father are to be laid upon the children", the sins of players in the steroid era are being laid upon today's players.

It's a biblical quotation. It didn't originate from Shakespeare

[El Gordo]

It's a biblical quotation. It didn't originate from Shakespeare

Agreed, it's a quote from the Merchant of Venice, which is citing Biblical wisdom. A central issue of the play is old testament vs new testament idea of justice.

[DrungoHazewood]

Yes, and Ruth's 60 is of course more impressive than Maris's 61, so I get why people argued that at the time. If you want, there are two records: the Ruth record for the 154-game season, and the Maris/Bonds/whoever you like record for the 162-game season. But we have 162 games now, and we can't very well just ignore home runs hit in the final stretch of the season, so the 162-game record is the only one that's currently relevant.

I don't think the season length thing holds a lot of water. If you want to start drawing lines you're going to have about 28 single season home run records. Ruth played in a league that was absolutely inferior to today's major leagues. It drew from a small fraction of the player pool today's league does - no minorities, primitive scouting, no draft, no systematic way to make sure the best players ended up in the majors, primitive farm systems, counterproductive strategies. My guess is that the MLBs didn't eclipse today's Japanese Leagues in quality of play until sometime after WWII, maybe later. Maris' era had many of the same things, just to a lesser extent than Ruth (and Ruth to a lesser extent than, say, Cap Anson). Maybe Gavvy Cravath should get some love for his 24 homers in 1915, often facing lopsided spitballs and parks with 500 foot fences.

Both Ruth and Maris played half their games in a park that was 296 down the RF line.

Over time you have all kinds of changes, like different balls, radically different bats, radically different gloves. Several of Ruth's early homers bounced over fences before they changed those kind of hits to doubles. Just the fact that today's batters have to face fresh relievers from the 6th or 7th inning on is massive. If you took someone like Aroldis or Kimbrel and put them in the AL in 1920 most of the league would just give up and go home.

I just don't think eight additional games is a particularly bright dividing line given all the other changes in the game.

[Guest rochester]

Love CD right now. He's totally right about the HR record. It's still Maris in my mind. Great that he would talk about this so honestly.

I would like to add that Hank Aaron is still the HR King as well.. in my mind

[primetime]

Are you saying the notion that Bonds, McGwire, and Sosa, were on steroids, is whimsical? ,

No and I don't even know where you're getting this from.

I didn't mention any of those guys.

[primetime]

It's a biblical quotation. It didn't originate from Shakespeare

I've read more Shakespeare than I have the Bible. My bad.

[Living_Legend]

I think Brady Anderson holds the real record for MLB of all time.

[Redskins Rick]

I think Brady Anderson holds the real record for MLB of all time.

Wouldnt surprise me, if he did, he lead the AL in 96, 97 & 99.

[El Gordo]

I don't think the season length thing holds a lot of water. If you want to start drawing lines you're going to have about 28 single season home run records. Ruth played in a league that was absolutely inferior to today's major leagues. It drew from a small fraction of the player pool today's league does - no minorities, primitive scouting, no draft, no systematic way to make sure the best players ended up in the majors, primitive farm systems, counterproductive strategies. My guess is that the MLBs didn't eclipse today's Japanese Leagues in quality of play until sometime after WWII, maybe later. Maris' era had many of the same things, just to a lesser extent than Ruth (and Ruth to a lesser extent than, say, Cap Anson). Maybe Gavvy Cravath should get some love for his 24 homers in 1915, often facing lopsided spitballs and parks with 500 foot fences.

Both Ruth and Maris played half their games in a park that was 296 down the RF line.

Over time you have all kinds of changes, like different balls, radically different bats, radically different gloves. Several of Ruth's early homers bounced over fences before they changed those kind of hits to doubles. Just the fact that today's batters have to face fresh relievers from the 6th or 7th inning on is massive. If you took someone like Aroldis or Kimbrel and put them in the AL in 1920 most of the league would just give up and go home.

I just don't think eight additional games is a particularly bright dividing line given all the other changes in the game.

For my money the best era of baseball was the 60's, with a lot of the best pitchers and best hitter's playing against each other. Name the best SP all time and the names Koufax, Drysdale, Gibson, Marachal, Spahn, come quickly to mind, as do Mays, Mantle, Musial, Aaron, and Williams, with the bat. Since then we have had changes in the mound, K zone, ball, PED's, parks, and expansion. I wonder after all that noise, how todays' level of play compares to that of the 60's.

[olehippi]

I disagree with his thoughts about the record.

So you think PED induced records are legitimate? Like Davis, I was fascinated by the HR heroics of Bonds, McGuire, and Sosa, but the PED use, rightfully IMO, made their feats much less heroic. Obviously, those stats can't be undone by ignoring them, but they can be, and I believe should be, categorized, noted as PED influenced, and be held separate from the legitimate baseball records.