JJ Hardy is ridiculously underpaid - And a Silver Slugger- And third in the Platinum glove voting.

[calmunderfire]

Sorry, but I do not believe this works at the MLB level.

That's the way it is in the MLB so you are right. Probably because of it's archaic system and nobody wants their feelings hurt. The point is for example if Casilla or Machado want to challenge Hardy I'd see no real problem with it. Same with McLouth challenging Jones.

[Redskins Rick]

That's the way it is in the MLB so you are right. Probably because of it's archaic system and nobody wants their feelings hurt. The point is for example if Casilla or Machado want to challenge Hardy I'd see no real problem with it. Same with McLouth challenging Jones.

Feelings hurt?

There teams are multi-billion dollar organizations, success brings more way more money than failure.

I suspect if the system was archaic and broken like you suggest, they would consider something else.

[calmunderfire]

Feelings hurt?

There teams are multi-billion dollar organizations, success brings more way more money than failure.

I suspect if the system was archaic and broken like you suggest, they would consider something else.

So are you saying the MLB and players don't deserve the opportunity to challenge for defensive spots?

[OFFNY]

I was responding to the OP in which Frobby had already noted the extension.

I know that you were.

You said that he (Andy) made great deals, and I wanted to make it clear that it was the deal (the trade) AND the extension which were both done on MacPhail's watch.

[Redskins Rick]

I know that you were.

You said that he (Andy) made great deals, and I wanted to make it clear that it was the deal (the trade) AND the extension which were both done on MacPhail's watch.

Thanks for putting us back on point.

[calmunderfire]

Thanks for putting us back on point.

Do players deserve the opportunity to challenge for defensive spots? I'll ask again.

[Tx Oriole]

Question, would you rather have Miguel Cabrera or Hardy play SS for your team?

Well I take Hardy.

[calmunderfire]

Do players deserve the opportunity to challenge for defensive spots? I'll ask again.

Never mind. I'll create a thread about it.

[Barnaby Graves]

Do players deserve the opportunity to challenge for defensive spots? I'll ask again.

They do that in Spring Training but I'm really not sure what you want because the player turnover is not as strong in baseball as it is in football and you simply aren't going to see, for example, Machado push out JJ Hardy. The money doesn't work that way.

[Tx Oriole]

I agree. So if I'm somebody who could potentially beat out Hardy defensively at SS I'm going full force at it. Alpha Male, best man wins. If I was Buck, I'd listen to Machado and Casilla would could potentially beat him out.

Sure glad you aren't Buck.

[DrungoHazewood]

In this situation I would do this. Have Davis and Cabrera compete for the 1B job. Loser moves to DH. Have Machado, Casilla and Hardy compete for the SS position. Winner takes SS. Losers have to settle for 3B and 2B.

If I was the manager I'm having open competitions among the starting players. It's just that simple. I'd have competitions at 1B and losers take DH. I'd have competitions at SS. Losers take 3B or 2B. Same in the outfield. If McLouth thinks he beat out Jones for CF then show me.

What, in spring training? During the season? What if Manny "wins" your shortstop competition (and I'm having giant problems trying to figure out how you'd even judge) and he's so much better than Hardy at third that your optimal alignment is still with Manny playing third? I think it's naive to assume that a guy who's played one position in the majors for years would smoothly move over to another if he loses some spring competition.

This would also preclude you from signing anything but desperate free agents. Imagine telling an all star who's being bid for by multiple top teams that he's going to have to go through a competition and if he doesn't look all that great in 15 or 20 spring games he's going to have to switch positions. The response would be "thanks, that's nice, I'll be signing with a team that's not crazy unless you offer me A LOT more cash than anyone else."

Edit: And you know, they already have a setup like this. It's just that by far the most heavily weighted criteria are 1) past performance, 2) some combination of health and age used to project how well they'll do compared to their recent performance. Spring training performance is but a tiny fraction of the data they use in most cases.

[Tx Oriole]

In this situation I would do this. Have Davis and Cabrera compete for the 1B job. Loser moves to DH. Have Machado, Casilla and Hardy compete for the SS position. Winner takes SS. Losers have to settle for 3B and 2B.[/

What? Why would you want to do that? Davis is great at first. Manny is great at

third. Davis can't play third in your world. That has been tried I believe. The O's

are having Davis at first and Manny at third. I don't understand why you would

want to something that would create problems for the O's.

[DrungoHazewood]

Do players deserve the opportunity to challenge for defensive spots? I'll ask again.

Yes. And in the vast majority of cases the evidence is so lopsided that there's no need to go through the motions of some kind of competition. There is literally nothing Alexi Casilla could do in spring training to cause me to give him Manny Machado's job. Well... short of actually breaking Manny's leg. If hit .500 in the spring and fielded 1.000 while Manny put up .100/.850 marks Manny gets the job. Because 50 spring at bats adds almost nothing meaningful to our body of knowledge on these players.

[Tx Oriole]

That's the way it is in the MLB so you are right. Probably because of it's archaic system and nobody wants their feelings hurt. The point is for example if Casilla or Machado want to challenge Hardy I'd see no real problem with it. Same with McLouth challenging Jones.

The players the O's have at 3rd, CF and SS is successful for the team. You don't

change when what is being done is successful.

[Redskins Rick]

Yes. And in the vast majority of cases the evidence is so lopsided that there's no need to go through the motions of some kind of competition. There is literally nothing Alexi Casilla could do in spring training to cause me to give him Manny Machado's job. Well... short of actually breaking Manny's leg. If hit .500 in the spring and fielded 1.000 while Manny put up .100/.850 marks Manny gets the job. Because 50 spring at bats adds almost nothing meaningful to our body of knowledge on these players.

The only way Flacco got the job as early as he did, the guy broke his leg, or maybe it was just getting hurt.