When do you consider benching Markakis?

[mark_beckens]

Not really calling for it

Yet you felt the need to start this thread?

[Barnaby Graves]

I have a better chance of starting in RF as Nick does getting benched.

It has to be the wrist. Before that dum@#$% hit him last year he was on pace for one of his better offensive years. 192 hits, 20HR, 43 doubles, slugged .471. Ever since then it has been straight downhill, it isn't a coincidence.

Bad news is that if the wrist ain't better by now, it probably never will be.

But he was hitting a bit earlier in the year.

His ground balls are up, his LD% is down but solid at around 23%. His infield flyball rate is WAY up, to 13.3%, with a career rate of 7.9%. That indicates to me he's missing the ball more than he usually does, and making weak contact... but his HR/FB is also way way down.

The HR/FB and the lack of speed make me think it's general physical decline and maybe some kind of health issue along the lines of some sort of full-body... metabolic disorder, PED withdrawal, not eating his green beans, you could make a thousand guesses to fit such a lack of solid evidence but the bottom line is he is not very athletic anymore.

[blid]

The Yankees did bench A-Rod last playoffs. That seemed equally unthinkable, but it shows such moves are possible. It really bums me out. I love Markakis.

I must say though, I don't understand the comments about the wrist. When is he supposed to have hurt his wrist? Sabathia's pitch broke his thumb.

[xKHx]

Yet you felt the need to start this thread?

Yes I did. You have anything else to add?

[jjnono]

You need more than singles from your rightfielder. Markakis is not contributing to this team's success. The solution: bench him a game or two. It worked for Weiters.

Last season I suggested benching Wieters during a brutal inoffensive stretch and was roundly criticized for the very thoughts, ostensibly because his pitch calling and defense was enough to carry the "slump." To this day, Wieters is rarely an offensive threat, although he does have his moments, but he's always in there. But I'd bench Markakis if I thought his trials were correctable by such an action. Unfortunately - and I say this as a fan who's favorite player is NIck - I think Nick is either hurt and trying to lay through it, or it's just over for him. Some guys never recover.... But he's a Buck favorite, and he's not going anywhere for the rest of the season. He's already been demoted to seventh. What more do people want?

[jjnono]

Last season I suggested benching Wieters during a brutal inoffensive stretch and was roundly criticized for the very thoughts, ostensibly because his pitch calling and defense was enough to carry the "slump." To this day, Wieters is rarely an offensive threat, although he does have his moments, but he's always in there. But I'd bench Markakis if I thought his trials were correctable by such an action. Unfortunately - and I say this as a fan who's favorite player is NIck - I think Nick is either hurt and trying to lay through it, or it's just over for him. Some guys never recover.... But he's a Buck favorite, and he's not going anywhere for the rest of the season. He's already been demoted to seventh. What more do people want?

I should point out that Nick is merely a convenient scapegoat. He's not solely the reason this team isn't achieving it's potential. He's a part of it, but focusing solely on Nick isn't fair. He's hitting .286. It ain't like he's hitting .230....

[Ommaculate]

Gee, I can't imagine why you got neg rep previously, if your criticism of Markakis was delivered as tactfully and intelligently as this.

Who could possibly think that Markakis is somehow enjoying the fact that he's struggling? When did people stop thinking before they post?

You can neg rep me all you want. I don't care.

You can place me on ignore. I don't care.

I am simply making the point that Markakis is stinking up the joint while collecting 15 million. I'm sorry if that hurts your feelings.

[SerenityNow]

I should point out that Nick is merely a convenient scapegoat. He's not solely the reason this team isn't achieving it's potential. He's a part of it, but focusing solely on Nick isn't fair. He's hitting .286. It ain't like he's hitting .230....

He is hitting .275 this season with 8 hr in over 500 at bats. Interesting that you add .11 points to his BA. Also he is the highest player on the team this season by over 5 million. I think you calling him a convienient scapegoat shows your intense bias in the situation as you such a big fan.

[jjnono]

You can neg rep me all you want. I don't care.

You can place me on ignore. I don't care.

I am simply making the point that Markakis is stinking up the joint while collecting 15 million. I'm sorry if that hurts your feelings.

From the AS break until the time he got hit by CC last year, Nick hit .370. Without a ton of power. And he was hitting in the leadoff spot. HIs regression this year looks bad in light of the weighted end of his contract, but there is/was value there. I'm as mystified and upset about this year as you are, but I'm not willing to throw in the towel. I'll give him next year before judgment. But I don't disagree with your point, though I think .275 isn't exactly stinking up the joint...

[mark_beckens]

Yes I did. You have anything else to add?

I could but that would probably get me in trouble.

[jjnono]

He is hitting .275 this season with 8 hr in over 500 at bats. Interesting that you add .11 points to his BA. Also he is the highest player on the team this season by over 5 million. I think you calling him a convienient scapegoat shows your intense bias in the situation as you such a big fan.

Is it .275? I'll stand corrected. I'm a passive stat monger... So hitting seventh isn't all that wrong, right?

[SerenityNow]

Is it .275? I'll stand corrected. I'm a passive stat monger... So hitting seventh isn't all that wrong, right?

I'm sorry if you think this is rude but I would say very passive. You say "it's not like Markakis is stinking up the joint" as if he is hitting ok. Yet Wieters is "rarely an offensive threat", yet Wieters is OPSing about 30 points higher this year and making 10 million less.

[jjnono]

He is hitting .275 this season with 8 hr in over 500 at bats. Interesting that you add .11 points to his BA. Also he is the highest player on the team this season by over 5 million. I think you calling him a convienient scapegoat shows your intense bias in the situation as you such a big fan.

I should also point out that I don't think our issues are offensive, no matter how bad Nick is going (and that's why I think he's an easy scapegoat). The bullpen has killed our season, plain and simple. For all of Nick's regression, there is Davis and Jones and McClouth and Machado and Hardy going gangbusters for the most part. Without running through every game, I'd say the bullpen has cost us - conservatively - 7-8 games.

[jjnono]

I'm sorry if you think this is rude but I would say very passive. You say "it's not like Markakis is stinking up the joint" as if he is hitting ok. Yet Wieters is "rarely an offensive threat", yet Wieters is OPSing about 30 points higher this year and making 10 million less.

It's not rude, and I don't take it that way. I was wrong. Wieters is OPSing higher due to his ability to time a slow bat and a 6' 4" frame on a fastball now and then. Agreed. Nick isn't the Nick we've known, in whatever guise. Look, I have a 4 year old kid I take care of every day. I watch the O's when I can. I don't obsessively read every box score and team stats page everyday. I'm fallible. And yes, Nick is my favorite player. It's hard to watch him this year. He deserves criticism. I just have a hard time taking my eyes off of everything else that has gone wrong this year and blaming Nick. He's a part of it, for sure. He's just not the target of my overall reasoning.

[mark_beckens]

I'd say the bullpen has cost us - conservatively - 7-8 games.

You don't think the offense has cost us any games? Easy to blame JJ and the bullpen when they give up a lead late. You can also look back to earlier in the game at lost opportunites to tack on runs so the bullpen has more room to play with. Example, O'Day didn't cost us the game today. The offense scoring one run helped us lose the game.