Markakis ended up at negative WAR in both rWAR and fWAR this year

[El Gordo]

I remember when Nick was something of a free spirit in the clubhouse, Juggling and balancing chairs on is nose. And then he turned into this guy:

[MurphDogg]

Now's the time where you're supposed to post a picture of, like, Carl Yastrzemski, and after much gnashing of teeth and veiled threats we all settle on the reality that Markakis has been somewhere in between tragically disappointing and HOF-quality.

Hey, I consider myself to be firmly camped in reality. The Ben Grieve thing was something people posted about here when Markakis was a rookie (as was the Yaz stuff). I don't get why it is back after one bad year at a point in Markakis' career when Grieve's career was long over.

[DrungoHazewood]

Hey, I consider myself to be firmly camped in reality. The Ben Grieve thing was something people posted about here when Markakis was a rookie (as was the Yaz stuff). I don't get why it is back after one bad year at a point in Markakis' career when Grieve's career was long over.

All I was really saying is that the modern American method of debate is to stake out two positions far to left/right of whatever is reasonable, appeal to crazy people, then right before something insane happens everyone agrees to play reasonably nice somewhere in the middle for a bit.

So... you start a Markakis debate by claiming he's a Ben Grieve-esque failure, then counter that he's on a HOF track.

[MurphDogg]

All I was really saying is that the modern American method of debate is to stake out two positions far to left/right of whatever is reasonable, appeal to crazy people, then right before something insane happens everyone agrees to play reasonably nice somewhere in the middle for a bit.

So... you start a Markakis debate by claiming he's a Ben Grieve-esque failure, then counter that he's on a HOF track.

Yeah, I just thought it was funny because early on in his career people on this board really were making the Yaz comparisons, I had totally forgotten about that until you mentioned it.

[El Gordo]

I was one who thought he was Stan the man II. And was horrified at the Ben Grieve comps. Then I down graded to Paul O'Neill. Now sadly it seems he is a lot closer to Grieve than Stan or Paul. Nick has lost his bat speed, it's as simple as that and he is compensating by trying to anticipate the pitch and cheating on the FB. That's why he gets fooled so much more than he used to when he could wait on the ball. Maybe he can get it back. Who knows?

[Hallas]

Now's the time where you're supposed to post a picture of, like, Carl Yastrzemski, and after much gnashing of teeth and veiled threats we all settle on the reality that Markakis has been somewhere in between tragically disappointing and HOF-quality.

Stan Musial was the actual comparison that I remember, though Yaz might have also been mentioned. For the record (here's the proof) I was hoping for Paul O'Neill.

edit: By the way, Paul O'Neill posted 1 non-injury, non-AARP season with a WAR under 1, and 1 other season with a WAR under 2, so while Nick's past season was certainly one to forget, he's not alone having an off year. Paul Konerko is another one that comes to mind - he had 1 negative WAR and 1 under-1 WAR season as well, and he clearly bounced back and had a productive career.

[MurphDogg]

Stan Musial was the actual comparison that I remember, though Yaz might have also been mentioned. For the record (here's the proof) I was hoping for Paul O'Neill.

edit: By the way, Paul O'Neill posted 1 non-injury, non-AARP season with a WAR under 1, and 1 other season with a WAR under 2, so while Nick's past season was certainly one to forget, he's not alone having an off year. Paul Konerko is another one that comes to mind - he had 1 negative WAR and 1 under-1 WAR season as well, and he clearly bounced back and had a productive career.

http://www.orioleshangout.com/article/623/history-and-nick-markakis

"The three most comparable players to Markakis on the list are Buddy Lewis (who might be in the Hall if not for WWII), Gary Matthews, and Carl Yastrzemski. The closer you get to Markakis’ performance at his age and the better things start to look."