Adam Jones 2nd worst in MLB at swinging at Ball Four

[Can_of_corn]

He'll get himself out. He's proven enough that he's a sucker for a dirtball.

I think you underestimate the skill level present.

He's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life. He's better at this than you'll ever be, at anything. My son has a gift. He has a gift, and when you acknowledge that, then maybe we will have something to talk about.

[25 Nuggets]

Vladimir Guerrero was known for swinging at anything and everything, but the problem facing pitchers was that he made contact with pretty much any ball he wanted. Now Adam Jones is no Vladdy Guerrero with the bat, but if his contact rate (with power) comes from being a free swinger, so be it. He won't be the lynchpin of the lineup, but he helps.

[weams]

Vladimir Guerrero was known for swinging at anything and everything, but the problem facing pitchers was that he made contact with pretty much any ball he wanted. Now Adam Jones is no Vladdy Guerrero with the bat, but if his contact rate (with power) comes from being a free swinger, so be it. He won't be the lynchpin of the lineup, but he helps.

He's a magician with the bat.

[25 Nuggets]

Similar Batters through age 27:

1) Reggie Smith

2) Andre Dawson

3) Dave Winfield

4) Harold Baines

5) Jack Clark

6) Vernon Wells

7) Shawn Green

8) Jeff Francoeur

9) Carlos Beltran

10) Grady Sizemore

...I think that's a very good list. Andre Dawson is an interesting comparison. He never walked much, had power, played CF but moved to corner OF. Perennial all-star for a while. Played in a neutral era like Jones is now.

[weams]

Similar Batters through age 27:

1) Reggie Smith

...I think that's a very good list. Andre Dawson is an interesting comparison. He never walked much, had power, played CF but moved to corner OF. Perennial all-star for a while. Played in a neutral era like Jones is now.

1966	21	BOS	AL	6	27	26	1	4	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	5	.154	.154	.192	.346	-5	5	0	0	1	0	0	/8	1967	22	BOS	AL	158	629	565	78	139	24	6	15	61	16	6	57	95	.246	.315	.389	.704	100	220	7	1	2	3	11	*8/4	RoY-21968	23	BOS	AL	155	632	558	78	148	37	5	15	69	22	18	64	77	.265	.342	.430	.772	127	240	10	4	1	5	13	*8/7	GG1969	24	BOS	AL	143	607	543	87	168	29	7	25	93	7	13	54	67	.309	.368	.527	.895	142	286	14	1	1	8	7	*8/7	AS,MVP-221970	25	BOS	AL	147	640	580	109	176	32	7	22	74	10	7	51	60	.303	.361	.497	.857	127	288	13	4	0	5	1	*8	MVP-261971	26	BOS	AL	159	692	618	85	175	33	2	30	96	11	3	63	82	.283	.352	.489	.840	129	302	15	5	1	5	4	*89	MVP-171972	27	BOS	AL	131	543	467	75	126	25	4	21	74	15	4	68	63	.270	.365	.475	.840	143	222	8	4	0	4	12	*9/8	AS,MVP-261973	28	BOS	AL	115	495	423	79	128	23	2	21	69	3	2	68	49	.303	.398	.515	.913	150	218	11	1	0	3	7	8/D3	1974	29	STL	NL	143	598	517	79	160	26	9	23	100	4	3	71	70	.309	.389	.528	.917	155	273	16	1	1	8	10	*9/3	AS,MVP-111975	30	STL	NL	135	550	477	67	144	26	3	19	76	9	7	63	59	.302	.382	.488	.870	137	233	16	3	0	7	9	93/58	AS1976	31	TOT	NL	112	430	395	55	100	15	5	18	49	3	2	32	70	.253	.312	.453	.765	116	179	8	2	0	1	6	935/8	1976	31	STL	NL	47	185	170	20	37	7	1	8	23	1	2	14	28	.218	.281	.412	.693	95	70	4	1	0	0	2	359/8	1976	31	LAD	NL	65	245	225	35	63	8	4	10	26	2	0	18	42	.280	.335	.484	.819	133	109	4	1	0	1	4	9/5	1977	32	LAD	NL	148	603	488	104	150	27	4	32	87	7	5	104	76	.307	.427	.576	1.003	168	281	5	3	1	7	11	*9/8	AS,MVP-41978	33	LAD	NL	128	531	447	82	132	27	2	29	93	12	5	70	90	.295	.382	.559	.942	162	250	5	1	0	13	8	*9/8	AS,MVP-41979	34	LAD	NL	68	270	234	41	64	13	1	10	32	6	5	31	50	.274	.359	.466	.825	125	109	5	2	0	3	3	9/8	1980	35	LAD	NL	92	362	311	47	100	13	0	15	55	5	6	41	63	.322	.392	.508	.900	151	158	4	1	0	9	1	9/8	AS1981	36	LAD	NL	41	44	35	5	7	1	0	1	8	0	0	7	8	.200	.318	.314	.632	83	11	4	0	0	2	3	/3	1982	37	SFG	NL	106	398	349	51	99	11	0	18	56	7	0	46	46	.284	.364	.470	.834	134	164	9	0	0	3	9	3	17 Yrs	1987	8051	7033	1123	2020	363	57	314	1092	137	86	890	1030	.287	.366	.489	.855	137	3439	150	33	8	86	115		

[weams]

So he might not quite be a Hall of Famer.

[Can_of_corn]

So he might not quite be a Hall of Famer.

But could he be the player that doesn't go into Cooperstown but does get his number retired by the O's?

(I was actually thinking about this a couple days ago.)

[weams]

But could he be the player that doesn't go into Cooperstown but does get his number retired by the O's?

(I was actually thinking about this a couple days ago.)

Average HOF CF is about 70 WAR. Reggie Smith was about 67.

[25 Nuggets]

Well, Reggie Smith could take walks at a better rate than Jones and also played through the late 60s / early 70s. Consequently his career OPS+ is 137, way higher than Jones. So despite being #1 comparatively on face value I don't think he's really the best comparison. FYI I believe Smith is a HOF caliber player and I don't see that yet from Jones.

This was Adam Jones' best season by rWAR standards (4.3) and that is mainly because his defensive metrics improved to above-average, while keeping his prime swing. Going forward I think that will be the key to maxing out his contribution -- stay a good defender.

[Can_of_corn]

Well, Reggie Smith could take walks at a better rate than Jones and also played through the late 60s / early 70s. Consequently his career OPS+ is 137, way higher than Jones. So despite being #1 comparatively on face value I don't think he's really the best comparison. FYI I believe Smith is a HOF caliber player and I don't see that yet from Jones.

This was Adam Jones' best season by rWAR standards (4.3) and that is mainly because his defensive metrics improved to above-average, while keeping his prime swing. Going forward I think that will be the key to maxing out his contribution -- stay a good defender.

I think the Frenchy comp is a warning shot to anyone who thinks Jones is completely out of the woods. He will have to stay hungry and keep working.

[25 Nuggets]

But could he be the player that doesn't go into Cooperstown but does get his number retired by the O's?

(I was actually thinking about this a couple days ago.)

He'd have to resign again with the team once his current extension runs out. There's a long way to go before considering number retirement. Good news for him is he's already done enough to get a spot in the Orioles HoF.

[weams]

I think the Frenchy comp is a warning shot to anyone who thinks Jones is completely out of the woods. He will have to stay hungry and keep working.

Agreed. Frenchy had 29 home runs once though. Once. And that was seven years ago. Adam has big boy power. For several years.

[25 Nuggets]

Agreed. Frenchy had 29 home runs once though. Once. And that was seven years ago. Adam has big boy power. For several years.

Agreed. Jones is a better version of Francoeur.

OPS+ through age 27

Jones - 108 (per 162: 24 HR, 30 BB, 126 K, .279/.322/.460)

Francoeur - 96 (per 162: 20 HR, 34 BB, 118 K, .270/.313/.433)

Plus I'm pretty sure he'll "stay hungry" like he tweeted.

[Il BuonO]

Remember what Jones says....

"Nobody gets paid to walk"

Plenty of guys are valued for their ability to get on base or OBP and thus are "paid to walk". Jones is under a false perception thinking otherwise and rationalizes his current approach at the plate.

Weams reminded me of a great quote by Weaver,"I'd rather have you walk with the bases loaded." It would be nice if he had some grasp of that concept instead of swinging at every pitch thrown. He would be far more dangerous.

As it is, I'm happy he's one of ours but dream of the day his potential is realized.

[Can_of_corn]

Plenty of guys are valued for their ability to get on base or OBP and thus are "paid to walk". Jones is under a false perception thinking otherwise and rationalizes his current approach at the plate.

Weams reminded me of a great quote by Weaver,"I'd rather have you walk with the bases loaded." It would be nice if he had some grasp of that concept instead of swinging at every pitch thrown. He would be far more dangerous.

As it is, I'm happy he's one of ours but dream of the day his potential is realized.

Is it fair to Jones to say he has that potential? Or is it like me wishing that Wieters would steal 20 bases in a season? What you want for him might be beyond his abilities no manner how he dedicates himself.