This weekend or Bust??????

[BaltimoreTerp]

I for one have bought into the rebuilding idea, as much has it hurt to admit we are not going to have a snowballs chance this season because of it. One of the things that has to be dealt with is holes don't matter one bit. The difference in having Redmond or Cpatt in CF is virtually meaningless on a rebuilding team. The difference between having the greatest pinch hitter of all time and having Fahey for your hitter off the bench is just as meaningless. Don't chase one or two extra wins this season. Secure as much premuim talent as possible for our blue chip pieces (Bedard, Brob, Ramon, Walker, Bradford) get the best younger players we can regardless of position for our Junk and use 08 to sort out what we have.

BTW there is a very, very good reason the Roberts and Bedard deals have to be worked out first. Those are the deals that you are going to get additions to our future core from. There has to be roster space available. After those moves a guy like millar might bring a real good prospect back but with him you would be willing to assume more risk, IMO, on a young non-roster guy that is a long way off. If you have space maybe you get a valuable peice for the ML club but it is not and should not be the objective.

I expect some (read SG) to poo poo this line of thought. This is the same reason I said in the summer that it was important that AM got Weiters to sign a Mil deal. I was right then and I think I am right now. While we still have guys that can be shed for nothing there comes a point where even the O's run out of that type of guy. The junk on our roster is not going to give you young ML ready guys that are going to help you when the time comes that we don't stink. We are not missing opportunities. The guys we should be looking at for our junk are not in any teams ML plans for this season.

Somebody deserves a standing ovation.

[Three Run Homer]

I expect some (read SG) to poo poo this line of thought.

Good stuff Flosman...but I think it's "pooh pooh"...your spelling isn't something that I'd accuse SG or anyone else of doing to your line of thought!

[BaltimoreTerp]

Just to add some actual analysis to my above praise:

We are not going anywhere next year, so making lateral deals for guys like Jack Wilson, or trading Hernandez for the sake of signing Rod Barajas when Weiters is still a year away, makes little sense.

Most of the guys we are talking about are deadline bait anyway. Guys like Millar or Payton or the bullpen guys or even Huff (if he actually has a decent first half) would probably all get more from a team looking for an extra boost for the last two months then as full-season players now.

What is the harm of letting Ramon Hernandez catch for four months and dumping him on a contender? If he hits well we will get more for him, and if not we just pay a little more in eating the contract.

What is the harm in letting Luis Hernandez play shortstop for the season, assuming we don't get a better option out of a bigger trade? If he sucks, like he is 99.9% likely to do, then you replace him once you actually need to fill the hole. If not, then it isn't a real hole anymore.

The only reason to want to make moves for the sake of moves is to get a couple extra wins, which is not the goal of a rebuilding team.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Good stuff Flosman...but I think it's "pooh pooh"...your spelling isn't something that I'd accuse SG or anyone else of doing to your line of thought!

Then you don't know who you are talking about

[Roll Tide]

We are not going anywhere next year, so making lateral deals for guys like Jack Wilson, or trading Hernandez for the sake of signing Rod Barajas when Weiters is still a year away, makes little sense

I have tell you I find it funny that people here talk about Wieters being a year away! IMO he's proved even less than Triunfel & Tillman. The Orioles would be fools to rush this guy through our system. While I'm excited about how good he MIGHT be someday. I am talking a realistic point of view. He's not done anything yet. I wish him the best!

[Sports Guy]

I for one have bought into the rebuilding idea, as much has it hurt to admit we are not going to have a snowballs chance this season because of it. One of the things that has to be dealt with is holes don't matter one bit. The difference in having Redmond or Cpatt in CF is virtually meaningless on a rebuilding team. The difference between having the greatest pinch hitter of all time and having Fahey for your hitter off the bench is just as meaningless. Don't chase one or two extra wins this season. Secure as much premuim talent as possible for our blue chip pieces (Bedard, Brob, Ramon, Walker, Bradford) get the best younger players we can regardless of position for our Junk and use 08 to sort out what we have.

BTW there is a very, very good reason the Roberts and Bedard deals have to be worked out first. Those are the deals that you are going to get additions to our future core from. There has to be roster space available. After those moves a guy like millar might bring a real good prospect back but with him you would be willing to assume more risk, IMO, on a young non-roster guy that is a long way off. If you have space maybe you get a valuable peice for the ML club but it is not and should not be the objective.

I expect some (read SG) to poo poo this line of thought. This is the same reason I said in the summer that it was important that AM got Weiters to sign a Mil deal. I was right then and I think I am right now. While we still have guys that can be shed for nothing there comes a point where even the O's run out of that type of guy. The junk on our roster is not going to give you young ML ready guys that are going to help you when the time comes that we don't stink. We are not missing opportunities. The guys we should be looking at for our junk are not in any teams ML plans for this season.

Guys like Millar, Payton, Huff and Mora can bring us back whatever...It doesn't matter what Bedard, et al bring us back in terms of what these guys bring back.

They aren't bringing back guys that are going to be much impact, especially immediate impact.

They are guys that you just want to get off the roster to allow younger guys, like Scott Moore, to play in their place.

Plus, saving money on their contracts is a good thing...Maybe, even though it shouldn't, it allows us to spend more money in the draft.

I agree with a lot of what you say here but the Orioles still plenty of guys they could drop or include in trades to keep the 40 man situation ok.

BTW, in regards to your first paragraph....There is something to be said about us making the proper roster decisions and making the smart move. Wily Aybar, who was with Atlanta, was dealt for nothing...He has good upside. We should be out there looking for the cheapest talent we can get.

We should be looking to get guys who are blocked, being overlooked or have lost value for various reasons.

We aren't doing that.

[Frobby]

The guys we should be looking at for our junk are not in any teams ML plans for this season.

Right - we should be looking for younger guys with very good upside in exchange for the Moras and Huffs of the world.

[Roll Tide]

Guys like Millar, Payton, Huff and Mora can bring us back whatever...It doesn't matter what Bedard, et al bring us back in terms of what these guys bring back.

They aren't bringing back guys that are going to be much impact, especially immediate impact.

They are guys that you just want to get off the roster to allow younger guys, like Scott Moore, to play in their place.

Plus, saving money on their contracts is a good thing...Maybe, even though it shouldn't, it allows us to spend more money in the draft.

I agree with a lot of what you say here but the Orioles still plenty of guys they could drop or include in trades to keep the 40 man situation ok.

BTW, in regards to your first paragraph....There is something to be said about us making the proper roster decisions and making the smart move. Wily Aybar, who was with Atlanta, was dealt for nothing...He has good upside. We should be out there looking for the cheapest talent we can get.

We should be looking to get guys who are blocked, being overlooked or have lost value for various reasons.

We aren't doing that

.

Makes me wonder if we are doing anything! I know there is speculation about AM being tight to the vest. But is it possible nothing is going on.

[Frobby]

Plus, saving money on their contracts is a good thing...Maybe, even though it shouldn't, it allows us to spend more money in the draft.

The $10 mm we already saved on Tejada should be enough by itself to pretty much pay for the draft. Frankly, this team should have plenty of money for things like that, considering how well MLB did last year.

[Sports Guy]

The $10 mm we already saved on Tejada should be enough by itself to pretty much pay for the draft. Frankly, this team should have plenty of money for things like that, considering how well MLB did last year.

Agree 100% with this...I am just saying that it can't hurt...The money you saved with Miggy could also go to paying some of the money on these deals to move these guys...Or eat a contract like Gibbons.

[NCRaven]

Right - we should be looking for younger guys with very good upside in exchange for the Moras and Huffs of the world.

I agree in principle, but if we can't get Adam Jones for Erik Bedard, I'm not sure what anyone thinks we can get for Huff or Millar. And, I don't think for a minute that AM or Trembley want to trade either Walker or Bradford. So low-ceiling, organizational players are all I would expect to get for any of our tradeable players with the possible exception of Mora, as I think he still has some value - except for that pesky NTC.

[forest leech]

We should be looking to get guys who are blocked, being overlooked or have lost value for various reasons.

We aren't doing that.

Guess who has no idea whether this is true or not? YOU. Also, THE REST OF US.

Or do you have a tap on AM's office phone?

[zff4]

If the M's irritate McPhail sufficiently by being unreasonable, then possibly look for AM to trade on his (and our team's) historical relationship with the Cubs to deal both Roberts and Bedard - just guessing here. Unfortunately, if the M's are out of it, and the Reds won't give us Votto, then that ratchets down the bidding competition. AM is comfortable dealing with the Cubs so I'm predicting both will go there. But when and for what?

[Sports Guy]

Guess who has no idea whether this is true or not? YOU. Also, THE REST OF US.

Or do you have a tap on AM's office phone?

Well, I KNOW and YOU know who we HAVEN'T traded for and who we could have gotten.

Are you going to disagree with that or did guys like Milledge not really get traded?

[Pruke]

If we accept we won't be competitive until 2010, we do have some time. I'm not advocating holding onto all trade chips until 2009, but I only caution against the trade'em now at all costs - once Erik (and perhaps Brian) are gone, we're stuck with what we get back.

If we start the season with Erik and Brian, I'm ok and will focus on the guys who came over from Houston, some of our younger faces - hopefully progressing and stripping the club of all the chipped paint (Mora / Huff / Etc..).

The team may not win much in the next few years, but living just south of Tampa, you really drool when you see all of their young talent - it's worth going to games, even if they lose - they are exciting!