Minor Leaguers as the Working Poor

[DrungoHazewood]

This is such liberal cocktail party crap. MLB has no competition within the baseball world, to imply otherwise is stupid.

You know why? Because MLB has taken players from all over the world, removed them from domestic leagues and paid them to play in MLB. If you stop that the talent will start to go elsewhere.

I've never been to a liberal cocktail party, but if it's like this I might start!

You can try and make the implication that this is a racial issue. It is not and you are less of a person then I thought you were to imply such. It is a business issue. A marketing issue. A marketing issue as it pertains MLB's core fan base. Which happens to be American at this time.

It's a marketing issue? In what way? American baseball has more revenues and paying customers than at any time in its history. Over the last ~50 years as more and more foreign-born players have flooded into the game the popularity and revenues of the sport have gone up exponentially.

Your Polly Anna view, lets all sing cum-by-ya, wearing our beret's is complete an utter hogwash. There is one reason for the influx in foreign born players in MLB. One. Cheap Labor. That is how it started. To deny it, would make me lose even more respect for you.

I'm sure that's part of the reason. Businesses always look for ways to improve their bottom line. When MLB tightly controlled the domestic player market through the draft obviously teams with resources were going to go places where they could more freely compete for talent.

But if you're going to simplistically attribute the influx of foreign talent to one reason, I'd pin it on winning baseball games. There were good players available without any cumbersome draft process, an advantage could be had over the competition, and smart teams took it. And they won more games. Teams like the Orioles focused on the draft at the expense of international signings and became laughing stocks.

Your Polly Anna view, lets all sing cum-by-ya, wearing our beret's is complete an utter hogwash.

That's one of the great sentences in OH history. It really is!

[NJ BIRD FAN]

Who's force feeding you anything? Are you saying that foreign players are being promoted through the minor leagues despite being out-performed by Americans?

Im saying they are cheaper to sign. Will work for nothing and be happy about it. You know as well as I do, that most rookie and low A ball are DR players. The owners are just taking shots with cheap labor.

[Plutarch]

NJ Bird Fan: Your Polly Anna view, lets all sing cum-by-ya, wearing our beret's is complete an utter hogwash.

DH: That's one of the great sentences in OH history. It really is!

Drungo...you not only Own a beret but you Wear it as well?

[DrungoHazewood]

Im saying they are cheaper to sign. Will work for nothing and be happy about it. You know as well as I do, that most rookie and low A ball are DR players. The owners are just taking shots with cheap labor.

Maybe the Delmarva Shorebirds of 2013 aren't representative of most A ball teams, and maybe I missed one or two, but I counted three Dominicans among the 46 players who appeared on their roster. That's about 20 shy of most. My quick look indicated at least 75% were native-born Americans.

[DrungoHazewood]

NJ Bird Fan: Your Polly Anna view, lets all sing cum-by-ya, wearing our beret's is complete an utter hogwash.

DH: That's one of the great sentences in OH history. It really is!

Drungo...you not only Own a beret but you Wear it as well?

Unfortunately I don't own a beret. It's awful, I go to these liberal cocktail parties wearing an O's hat, or a stocking cap, or maybe that old Cody Nite Rodeo cap of mine and everyone just kind of averts their eyes and shakes their heads. It's depressing, really.

[Hallas]

I think the AAA lifers like Darnell McDonald or Rick Short make $50k or $75k a year by their 30s and can live on that. The iffy conditions are really the 21-year-old 17th-round picks making $1000 a month in low A, eating McDonalds three meals a day and sleeping six to an apartment.

What makes it really hazy to me is that teams can offer $100,000 signing bonuses to players even in rounds 11+. I think that $100K + 8-15K per season for 6 seasons with a chance to strike it big in the Majors if you do really well is an acceptable amount of money (marginally.) If you were dumb enough to sign a terrible contract then it's a bad situation, but one that you (and your agent) got yourself into. Ideally I would probably like for the yearly rate to be slightly higher for the lowest level of players, because there is no guarantee that a player can negotiate the full bonus money. If a player hits his 6 seasons and he's good enough for AA+ then he can probably make a living for about 50-80K a year, with a good chance to get a cup of coffee in the right situation. If he hits his MiL free agency period and he's still in low-A then he probably should be re-evaluating his career choices.

At the end of the day, the salary is low but the pay structure in the farm system is a little more complicated than just a yearly amount. No one is going to decry Hunter Harvey making 8K a season when he signed a contract that came with a $2m signing bonus. Even for mid-rounders the slot signing bonus is well into the 6 figures for many players.

But if you're a 17 year old and you took less than 100K as a late round draft pick instead of a college scholarship...........

[Can_of_corn]

What makes it really hazy to me is that teams can offer $100,000 signing bonuses to players even in rounds 11+. I think that $100K + 8-15K per season for 6 seasons with a chance to strike it big in the Majors if you do really well is an acceptable amount of money (marginally.) If you were dumb enough to sign a terrible contract then it's a bad situation, but one that you (and your agent) got yourself into. Ideally I would probably like for the yearly rate to be slightly higher for the lowest level of players, because there is no guarantee that a player can negotiate the full bonus money. If a player hits his 6 seasons and he's good enough for AA+ then he can probably make a living for about 50-80K a year, with a good chance to get a cup of coffee in the right situation. If he hits his MiL free agency period and he's still in low-A then he probably should be re-evaluating his career choices.

At the end of the day, the salary is low but the pay structure in the farm system is a little more complicated than just a yearly amount. No one is going to decry Hunter Harvey making 8K a season when he signed a contract that came with a $2m signing bonus. Even for mid-rounders the slot signing bonus is well into the 6 figures for many players.

But if you're a 17 year old and you took less than 100K as a late round draft pick instead of a college scholarship...........

Money for college doesn't count against the slot money. If you are 17 and don't sign for big money, get money for school.

[El Gordo]

What makes it really hazy to me is that teams can offer $100,000 signing bonuses to players even in rounds 11+. I think that $100K + 8-15K per season for 6 seasons with a chance to strike it big in the Majors if you do really well is an acceptable amount of money (marginally.) If you were dumb enough to sign a terrible contract then it's a bad situation, but one that you (and your agent) got yourself into. Ideally I would probably like for the yearly rate to be slightly higher for the lowest level of players, because there is no guarantee that a player can negotiate the full bonus money. If a player hits his 6 seasons and he's good enough for AA+ then he can probably make a living for about 50-80K a year, with a good chance to get a cup of coffee in the right situation. If he hits his MiL free agency period and he's still in low-A then he probably should be re-evaluating his career choices.

At the end of the day, the salary is low but the pay structure in the farm system is a little more complicated than just a yearly amount. No one is going to decry Hunter Harvey making 8K a season when he signed a contract that came with a $2m signing bonus. Even for mid-rounders the slot signing bonus is well into the 6 figures for many players.

But if you're a 17 year old and you took less than 100K as a late round draft pick instead of a college scholarship...........

Why is it necessary for any 17 YO bonus or not, to eat 3 meals a day at McDonalds, and sleep 6 in an apartment and depend on the kindness of strangers, when rectifying that situation isn't all that costly? Is it some necessary rite of passage?

[Can_of_corn]

Why is it necessary for any 17 YO bonus or not, to eat 3 meals a day at McDonalds, and sleep 6 in an apartment and depend on the kindness of strangers, when rectifying that situation isn't all that costly? Is it some necessary rite of passage?

It isn't, but when you want cable, and a couple game systems, and a smart phone...

[Hallas]

Why is it necessary for any 17 YO bonus or not, to eat 3 meals a day at McDonalds, and sleep 6 in an apartment and depend on the kindness of strangers, when rectifying that situation isn't all that costly? Is it some necessary rite of passage?

My point is that the 17-18 year old kids who get the bonus money have a chance to live an ok life if you take the bonus money into account. An 'ok' life means they can actually afford to eat right and not take 2nd jobs unless they really want to. You can't separate the bonus money from the compensation as a whole, because it's the difference between 8-10K a year being acceptable (for a player with a decent bonus) and 8-10K a year being akin to modern-day slavery.

One concern about this system is whether teams equip an 18 year old kid with the tools to make that money last as long as possible. (financial advisors, etc.)

Generally I do agree that you want your minor league players to have access to good nutrition and training facilities during the season, and be able to afford these things during the offseason. There are all sorts of ways to make that possible, but these are things that are in the team's best interest if its goal is to develop prospects, and have nothing to do with the ethics of paying them paltry wages. That being said, kids with good bonuses and the wherewithal to use them correctly are in a more advantageous position do have all these things.

[weams]

Your Polly Anna view, lets all sing cum-by-ya, wearing our beret's is complete an utter hogwash.

That's one of the great sentences in OH history. It really is!

[DrungoHazewood]

My point is that the 17-18 year old kids who get the bonus money have a chance to live an ok life if you take the bonus money into account. An 'ok' life means they can actually afford to eat right and not take 2nd jobs unless they really want to. You can't separate the bonus money from the compensation as a whole, because it's the difference between 8-10K a year being acceptable (for a player with a decent bonus) and 8-10K a year being akin to modern-day slavery.

One concern about this system is whether teams equip an 18 year old kid with the tools to make that money last as long as possible. (financial advisors, etc.)

Generally I do agree that you want your minor league players to have access to good nutrition and training facilities during the season, and be able to afford these things during the offseason. There are all sorts of ways to make that possible, but these are things that are in the team's best interest if its goal is to develop prospects, and have nothing to do with the ethics of paying them paltry wages. That being said, kids with good bonuses and the wherewithal to use them correctly are in a more advantageous position do have all these things.

Aren't most of the players in the minors either lower-rounders or undrafted free agents (domestic or international) whose bonus consisted mainly of a plane ticket to spring training?

[Plutarch]

Aren't most of the players in the minors either lower-rounders or undrafted free agents (domestic or international) whose bonus consisted mainly of a plane ticket to spring training?

A vast majority of those in the minors are essentially there to serve as 'cannon fodder' for those who are thought to have a chance at the show. By 'cannon fodder' I mean that you have to have enough people and enough teams so that an organization 'prospect' gets enough really game work to improve. There is really no incentive to pay 'cannon fodder' any more than necessary because, as the constant supply of players to the minors show, there is always another player ready to step into the line for low pay and miserable living conditions.

[Guest rochester]

Why is it necessary for any 17 YO bonus or not, to eat 3 meals a day at McDonalds, and sleep 6 in an apartment and depend on the kindness of strangers, when rectifying that situation isn't all that costly? Is it some necessary rite of passage?

Sounds almost as bad as the military.... but they protect us. I may be wrong but am not sure if baseball players do the same.

[Guest rochester]

To be clear I was talking about the ML owners when calling them greedy and shortsighted. The ML owners are who own the players and ultimately are the ones that reap the huge reward for their development.

I think it is funny that in this tread there have been arguments that the antitrust exemption is not a big deal and later on talk about how there should be an international draft. Something that really can't work without the exemption.

As to those that keep chiming in that the players agree to the low pay and it is no different than any other person entering the work force. I know when I got done with college I was not subject to being drafted and the employers that recruited me had no ability to limit in any way where I earned my paycheck. Simply put the current system is abusive and should be corrected. Posters keep citing free market principles in reference to a market that is not free and probably does not work well as a free market system. MLB owners have a absolute sweetheart deal and situations like this one really make their true colors show.

Honestly, I don't remember if I was answering something you said. However, the analogy you use re: after you graduated college is an excellent one and gives me reason to rethink this - thank you. The money is still not a problem to me - the fact that the players do not get to pick who their employers are is a problem.