Buck's decisions tonight

[waroriole]

You and I both know that the only reason he stayed in the game is that the O's increased the lead to four runs.

He had Hunter up and was going to use him.

Yep. If anything, that is aggravating. He was just saying how we needed to save the pen for a 4 game series and he planned to waste Hunter on a 3 run save.

[Roll Tide]

I've seen verlander get pulled in the 4th with a lead multiple times, especially earlier in his career when he wasted a ton of pitches trying to strike out every batter he faced.

A good manager makes the correct call, saves his starters arm and the lead for the team.

I still think Buck is a good manager, but even though it worked out for us tonight, no one will ever convince me that was the RIGHT decision.

Tillman didn't have it and it nearly cost us the lead, nevermind any possible long term negative effects.

There is a big difference pulling a guy with a high pitch count in the 4th and with two outs in the 5th. Most managers will give the starter the opportunity to pick up the win. I'm not overly concerned about the pitch count thing either.

[weams]

There is a big difference pulling a guy with a high pitch count in the 4th and with two outs in the 5th. Most managers will give the starter the opportunity to pick up the win. I'm not overly concerned about the pitch count thing either.

Chris Tillman said he did not know how many pitches he had thrown, but that it was probably a lot. He did not have his curveball last evening because of the cold. He was SITTING 92 in the fifth inning. If he had coughed up the lead, this is your ace. A guy who has gutted out wins when his team was behind by 6 runs early. This is the guy you extend. Especially on six days rest.

[MrOrange82]

Yep. If anything, that is aggravating. He was just saying how we needed to save the pen for a 4 game series and he planned to waste Hunter on a 3 run save.

Why are we convinced of this?

[weams]

There is a big difference pulling a guy with a high pitch count in the 4th and with two outs in the 5th. Most managers will give the starter the opportunity to pick up the win. I'm not overly concerned about the pitch count thing either.

This is not like screaming for Buck to pull Chen at 80 pitches because he has obviously lost it. Some of Chris Tillman's best work occurs after 100 pitches.

[waroriole]

Why are we convinced of this?

He was warming in the pen in the top of the 9th.

[weams]

Why are we convinced of this?

I think preservation of the bullpen had a lot to do with Tillman staying in the game as long as he did. The bullpen will get work in Fenway during a four game four day series.

[MrOrange82]

He was warming in the pen in the top of the 9th.

He might have been brought in if O'Day got into trouble, but I didn't get the sense that he was starting the inning. Given how miserable the weather was, it made sense to have Hunter warming up well in advance, in case he was needed.

[weams]

He was warming in the pen in the top of the 9th.

Maybe only if O'Day gave up another hit and was facing a one run game. It is Fenway, stranger things have happened in the ninth.

[Frobby]

IMO, Tillman finished the inning on his last batter. I don't think he was staying out there to finish it come Hell or high water.

Oh, I agree. But I didn't like him facing Bradley, and even the batter before that was debatable IMO. Let's look at that inning.

- Tillman goes in at 91 pitches, already averaging nearly 23 pitches.

- By the time he gets to Pierzyinski, he has thrown 20 pitches in the inning to bring his total to 111, and he's already given up a double, a single and a walk in the inning (the walk on the most recent batter and it only took four pitches). For me, that's enough on this particular night.

- Pierzynsnki singles on two pitches and now it's 113. Enough, already!

- He finally gets Bradley, but not before a 9-pitch battle. This isn't Ty Cobb here.

[waroriole]

He might have been brought in if O'Day got into trouble, but I didn't get the sense that he was starting the inning. Given how miserable the weather was, it made sense to have Hunter warming up well in advance, in case he was needed.

Then why get him up then? Get him up to start the 9th, or if O'Day allows a baserunner.

[Can_of_corn]

He might have been brought in if O'Day got into trouble, but I didn't get the sense that he was starting the inning. Given how miserable the weather was, it made sense to have Hunter warming up well in advance, in case he was needed.

You don't honestly believe that do you? We both know it is within the realm of possibility but how likely is it?

How often has Buck chosen not to use an effective and rested "closer" in a save opportunity?

Hunter got up because it was a three run lead and he sat down when it became a four run lead.

[waroriole]

You don't honestly believe that do you? We both know it is within the realm of possibility but how likely is it?

How often has Buck chosen not to use an effective and rested "closer" in a save opportunity?

Hunter got up because it was a three run lead and he sat down when it became a four run lead.

Exactly. If that's why he got up, why sit him back down when it's a 4 run lead. O'Day's potential implosion doesn't become less likely because we scored another run.

[MrOrange82]

You don't honestly believe that do you? We both know it is within the realm of possibility but how likely is it?

How often has Buck chosen not to use an effective and rested "closer" in a save opportunity?

Hunter got up because it was a three run lead and he sat down when it became a four run lead.

He went with Matusz for almost three innings. I don't think there's any way Buck would've made O'Day warm up in those conditions, come into the game for one hitter, and then sit back down right away simply because he had a ready "closer" with a three run lead. I do think O'Day would have gotten the hook almost immediately after issuing a walk to Carp if the lead was three runs, rather than four, but I would have been shocked to see Hunter start that inning.

[Can_of_corn]

He went with Matusz for almost three innings. I don't think there's any way Buck would've made O'Day warm up in those conditions, come into the game for one hitter, and then sit back down right away simply because he had a ready "closer" with a three run lead. I do think O'Day would have gotten the hook almost immediately after issuing a walk to Carp if the lead was three runs, rather than four, but I would have been shocked to see Hunter start that inning.

I politely disagree. Buck is a pretty fervent follower of the save rule.