Stand Pat

[incubus]

I think there are marginal upgrades that they could make but I concur that a blockbuster is unnecessary. I would be pretty happy to see Kurt Suzuki come in. It might be worth it to get Kennedy...he is probably only a slight upgrade over some of our current options but it would be really nice to keep him out of the hands of the Yankees. I definitely wouldn't break the bank on him though.

I was going to say the same thing about Suzuki. Maybe they'd take Headley and a prospect...

[fastball]

We need a BAT.

[oriole]

I think it's funny that everyone wants to keep ALL of Bundy, Harvey, and Gausman.

Let's put this in perspective. Let's say we traded Bundy and a player or two that wasn't Gausman or Harvey.

Our rotation would have consisted of:

Tillman

Jimenez

Samardjiza

Gausman

That leaves the fifth spot for Harvey, Chen, Gonzo.

So where are all these pitchers going to fit?

Some of you act like if we give up one of those three then we are mortgaging or entire future. It's ridiculous.

If JS was 35 id understand. But he's 26 and has plenty of years left. Tillmans numbers aren't great but ppl think/expect he will get better. Some think JS can't get better, why not?

Some downgrade JS because he played for the Cubs in the NL, well he had been a better pitcher in the AL so far.

But you know what let's sit on all these pitchers, that way, when Chris Davis, Nelson Cruz, Hardy, and Wieters are all previously gone in two yearsrwe will be in the same spot but trying to trade for a bat rather than a pitcher.

And I hate sounding like I'm crying over spoiled grapes because we can't do anything about JS now, but I'm trying to prove this point for possible future moves when ppl are still in the same mindset that trading prospects will demolish our future. I think just the opposite.

In two years when we have Gausman, Jimenez, Tillman, Bundy, Harvey. We could very easily be looking for replacements for Davis, Cruz, Wieters, Hardy, possibly Markakis. Joe good are we going to be then?

A rotation of Tillman, Gausman, Jimenez, Bundy, and Harvey sounds good to me. We could go from being an offensive minded team to a pitching one. Right now we're winning without Wieters and with Davis hitting below average for a first basemen. Other players will come up or we'll sign different position players but if our pitching prospects pan out we will be an even better club than right now. Jones is here for awhile, Machado is here for awhile...all is not lost without our current crop of players. I see no reason to jump the gun.

[PA724_Oriole]

A rotation of Tillman, Gausman, Jimenez, Bundy, and Harvey sounds good to me. We could go from being an offensive minded team to a pitching one. Right now we're winning without Wieters and with Davis hitting below average for a first basemen. Other players will come up or we'll sign different position players but if our pitching prospects pan out we will be an even better club than right now. Jones is here for awhile, Machado is here for awhile...all is not lost without our current crop of players. I see no reason to jump the gun.

Let's not get it twisted. Wieters is a big.lose in more ways than one. I consider the Os lucky with the play they are getting out of the catcher by committee.

Also don't be fooled by CDs average. Last week it was said that Davis ranked 17th in the ML In RBIs per AB. He is still being productive and helping even though he isn't paying like he was last year.

[oriole]

Let's not get it twisted. Wieters is a big.lose in more ways than one. I consider the Os lucky with the play they are getting out of the catcher by committee.

Also don't be fooled by CDs average. Last week it was said that Davis ranked 17th in the ML In RBIs per AB. He is still being productive and helping even though he isn't paying like he was last year.

Guys are always going to be coming and going. A truly successful team will set themselves up to be competitive on a consistent basis. You don't do that by trading away your potential future stars for inflated contracts that will hinder your flexibility in the long run. At least one, and a good possibility of both, of Davis and Wieters will be gone after next year. If we are to see continued success we will see rising stars come from the farm (making league minimum) and they will accompany a mixture of guys making their way through the arbitration process and free agents/extensions...meaning guys who will be paid. To have long standing success you're going to need both of these types players. We can't make up a team of guys through free agency...we're not the Yankees. We need Bundy, Gausman, and Harvey...not all three are going to be superstars but I like our odds of finding one in three at least and then continuing to build on that.

[PA724_Oriole]

Guys are always going to be coming and going. A truly successful team will set themselves up to be competitive on a consistent basis. You don't do that by trading away your potential future stars for inflated contracts that will hinder your flexibility in the long run. At least one, and a good possibility of both, of Davis and Wieters will be gone after next year. If we are to see continued success we will see rising stars come from the farm (making league minimum) and they will accompany a mixture of guys making their way through the arbitration process and free agents/extensions...meaning guys who will be paid. To have long standing success you're going to need both of these types players. We can't make up a team of guys through free agency...we're not the Yankees. We need Bundy, Gausman, and Harvey...not all three are going to be superstars but I like our odds of finding one in three at least and then continuing to build on that.

So if we could have got away with trading Bundy n a another mediocre product fire JS abd still kept Harvey abd Gaus you wouldn't have don't it?

I'm not saying trade all three for 3 aging vets. JS is in his prime abd could be fir the next six years. At least with what he is showing this year he is capable of being that abd being consistent.

Like I said (and you agreed) it's possible we don't have Hardy Chris and Cruz next year. So why not give one good prospect up for a bit who could help accomplish our goals this year instead of going things work out?

I understand how good teams stay good. You don't have to break it down.

There's also a chance that all three end up like Jake Arrieta, Hunter or Britton.

All I'm saying that the Os have a prime.chance to go far this year. And instead of taking advantage and trying to get better we want to hope that it pans out that those guys become number ones or twos at the very least.

Boston and the Yanks wont stay down for long.

[webbrick2010]

but I'm not sure that I'm sold on any of the options.

The rumor is that we are in on Suziki, but he is having a career year with the bat (likely to regress) and seems to be worse than Joseph defensively.

I haven't heard any 2B options, giving one of our AAA guys a chance might be the best bet.

I think DD will sign a bullpen arm and hopefully trade Matusz

[MrOrange82]

but I'm not sure that I'm sold on any of the options.

The rumor is that we are in on Suziki, but he is having a career year with the bat (likely to regress) and seems to be worse than Joseph defensively.

I haven't heard any 2B options, giving one of our AAA guys a chance might be the best bet.

I think DD will sign a bullpen arm and hopefully trade Matusz

The least disruptive options for improving the team are getting bullpen and/or rotation help, IMO. 2B defense has been very good, same with the catchers. Whatever offensive upgrade the O's might get out of those positions would likely be washed by a defensive hit.

I'll continue to bang the "move Chen to the bullpen and get rid of Matusz" drum until it's 100% clear that it'll never happen, but I agree that DD's most obvious move would be adding to the bullpen at this point. There aren't many, if any, starters out there who both make sense from a cost perspective and represent substantial upgrades over what the O's already have.

[oriole]

So if we could have got away with trading Bundy n a another mediocre product fire JS abd still kept Harvey abd Gaus you wouldn't have don't it?

I'm not saying trade all three for 3 aging vets. JS is in his prime abd could be fir the next six years. At least with what he is showing this year he is capable of being that abd being consistent.

Like I said (and you agreed) it's possible we don't have Hardy Chris and Cruz next year. So why not give one good prospect up for a bit who could help accomplish our goals this year instead of going things work out?

I understand how good teams stay good. You don't have to break it down.

There's also a chance that all three end up like Jake Arrieta, Hunter or Britton.

All I'm saying that the Os have a prime.chance to go far this year. And instead of taking advantage and trying to get better we want to hope that it pans out that those guys become number ones or twos at the very least.

Boston and the Yanks wont stay down for long.

All of what you said makes sense but I guess it all comes down to how much faith you have in the current team. I'm of the opinion that we don't need any major upgrades. Sure 2B and C stink and the bullpen could use some more depth but I don't see the need being pressing enough anywhere that you have to throw around future assets to continued contention.

If we could grab Suzuki and a LH reliever I think that would help tighten the screws on an already fairly well functioning machine and that way we don't need to give up anything substantial. I'd also be fine parting with B-prospects like Wright or EdRod or whoever else played themselves into that tier of players. It's just my personal preference to hold on to the big pieces.

[mdbdotcom]

Over the last 10 games, the O's have gone 6-4. That's very good. Should they continue at that pace through the rest of the year they would win 92 games.

However, during that time the Rays have gained two games in the standings and the Yankees have gained one. Should all three teams continue at the paces they are on, the O's would finish behind the Rays and the Yankees.

The O's have to keep getting better. The Yankees will not stand still, and neither should we. The Rays, the best team in the AL East right now, will get better when Myers comes off the DL.

I can't tell you what improvements we will make, but there will be some. There will have to be if we are to finish in first place.

[PA724_Oriole]

All of what you said makes sense but I guess it all comes down to how much faith you have in the current team.

Right. So if I'm understanding you right, you would have more faith in the team in the future because of those prospects with all the potential loses going forward, than the team we currently have?

Because Idc if all Gaus, Bundy, and Harvey alll become solid number two type pitchers, id think.we would have a better chance this year at a WS by trading one for a JS type more than our chances in two years just due to the fact that our offense wont be close to what it is currently.

[DrungoHazewood]

I'll continue to bang the "move Chen to the bullpen and get rid of Matusz" drum until it's 100% clear that it'll never happen...

I'm curious why Chen? There's not a whole lot of spread between the numbers of all of the O's starters, but Chen has a 4:1 K:BB ratio, is 2nd on the team in innings, starts, tied with Tillman and (essentially) Gonzalez in ERA, better than everybody but Gausman in FIP. I just don't see it.

Also, he's on pace for 17 or 18 wins. Completely separate from the wisdom of this move, I wonder if any team in MLB history has moved a healthy, regular starter who's 11-3 in late July (or anything like that) to the bullpen? Not that long ago the 11-3 mark would have meant he was considered the best starter on the team, no questions asked, and people would look at you like you had snakes coming out of your eye sockets for suggesting he should be turned into a reliever. The only thing I can think of sort of like this is Dave Righetti - in '83 he was 14-8, 3.44 as a starter, then in '84 he was moved to the pen and had 31 saves.

[Palmoripken]

Over the last 10 games, the O's have gone 6-4. That's very good. Should they continue at that pace through the rest of the year they would win 92 games.

However, during that time the Rays have gained two games in the standings and the Yankees have gained one. Should all three teams continue at the paces they are on, the O's would finish behind the Rays and the Yankees.

The O's have to keep getting better. The Yankees will not stand still, and neither should we. The Rays, the best team in the AL East right now, will get better when Myers comes off the DL.

I can't tell you what improvements we will make, but there will be some. There will have to be if we are to finish in first place.

In our defense, we've been playing Oakland, Anaheim, and now Seattle. All 500+

teams and on the road no less.The Yankees had the Reds who aren't a bad team

but aren't as good as those 3 and the Rangers who are terrible all at home. I think we just have to keep doing our thing. We're in a good spot entering the trade

deadline.

[DrungoHazewood]

Over the last 10 games, the O's have gone 6-4. That's very good. Should they continue at that pace through the rest of the year they would win 92 games.

However, during that time the Rays have gained two games in the standings and the Yankees have gained one. Should all three teams continue at the paces they are on, the O's would finish behind the Rays and the Yankees.

Are you actually projecting standings and performance based on the last 10 games?

[weams]

Hammel wasn't a mid-season move. You left off KRod, however.

Mike Morse and Jim Thome.