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Zach Britton - No need for a closer

brianod

By brianod
in Orioles Talk

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gpolee Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

gpolee

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He set that pitch up on a tee for Donaldson.

Might have been his worse executed pitch all season.

You make a good point. That was the single worst pitch I have seen Britton throw this season. He's pitched extraordinarily well.

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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He's pitched extraordinarily well.
Overall he has certainly exceeded expectations.

Are you making a distinction there? Expectations for Britton weren't very high, considering his track record coming into this season. I'd say he's pitched extraordinarily well by almost any standard.

At the same time, there are a ton of closers having very good seasons. There are 7 guys with at least 20 saves and a 90% save rate. There are 10 who have 20 saves and a sub-1.00 WHIP. There are 12 who have at least 20 saves and 10 K/9. There are 9 with at least 20 saves and a sub-.200 BAA. There are 7 with at least 20 saves and an ERA under 2.00. Greg Holland and Huston Street are doing all of those things.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Are you making a distinction there? Expectations for Britton weren't very high, considering his track record coming into this season. I'd say he's pitched extraordinarily well by almost any standard.

At the same time, there are a ton of closers having very good seasons. There are 7 guys with at least 20 saves and a 90% save rate. There are 10 who have 20 saves and a sub-1.00 WHIP. There are 12 who have at least 20 saves and 10 K/9. There are 9 with at least 20 saves and a sub-.200 BAA. There are 7 with at least 20 saves and an ERA under 2.00. Greg Holland and Huston Street are doing all of those things.

The bar for extraordinarily well keeps getting higher as league wide offensive numbers continue to drop.

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NickM21 Major Leaguer

NickM21

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The bar for extraordinarily well keeps getting higher as league wide offensive numbers continue to drop.

Exactly, which is why I never understood those defending JJ last year. IMO Holland and Kimbrel are the top dogs right now. Those guys are just filthy.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Exactly, which is why I never understood those defending JJ last year. IMO Holland and Kimbrel are the top dogs right now. Those guys are just filthy.

I didn't understand why folks were claiming JJ was anything special after his 2012 season. How you could look at his peripherals with an unbiased eye and not see the coming regression...

And before anyone gets on me, his 2012 season was special, not him.

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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The bar for extraordinarily well keeps getting higher as league wide offensive numbers continue to drop.
Exactly, which is why I never understood those defending JJ last year. IMO Holland and Kimbrel are the top dogs right now. Those guys are just filthy.

Those defending JJ last year never said he was doing extraordinarily well, just that he hadn't been as awful as his detractors insisted.

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NickM21 Major Leaguer

NickM21

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Those defending JJ last year never said he was doing extraordinarily well, just that he hadn't been as awful as his detractors insisted.

Well that doesn't really change the fact that he shouldn't have been the closer, no?

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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I didn't understand why folks were claiming JJ was anything special after his 2012 season. How you could look at his peripherals with an unbiased eye and not see the coming regression...

And before anyone gets on me, his 2012 season was special, not him.

First, I don't think anyone in his right mind should have expected JJ to repeat his 2012 season, in terms of his 94.4% save percentage. That said, 2012 was not that much of an outlier for JJ in other ways. In 2011 he had a 2.67 ERA, 1.11 WHIP, 5.7 K/9, 2.76 K/BB. 2012 was not much different, 2.49, 1.09, 5.4 and 2.73. In 2008, he had 2.23, 1.19, 5.0, 1.36. Even 2013 was not that far off in those terms, 2.94, 1.28, 7.2, 3.11.

Overall, JJ was a solid above average reliever in his time with the O's. He did a solid job as our closer during the period he had that job, obviously better in 2012 than in 2013, but overall, solid despite having a tremendous workload in terms of save opportunities over a two year period. I certainly didn't see his 2014 disaster coming, but at the same time, it was pretty obvious that he wasn't worth $10 mm. I'm glad we avoided being part of his 2014 train wreck.

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bobmc Hangout Grand Counsel

bobmc

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The bar for extraordinarily well keeps getting higher as league wide offensive numbers continue to drop.

And yet Brett (Freaking) Gardner goes deep twice off Yu last night (in a SSS). Melky had two also.....btw - BG's at bats were special not Brett.....;)

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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And yet Brett (Freaking) Gardner goes deep twice off Yu last night (in a SSS). Melky had two also.....btw - BG's at bats were special not Brett.....;)
I just blame the parents of Brett Gardner. I just blame them for creating a great hitter.

Gardner is 5 for 11 with four homers against Darvish for his career.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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It was in a very good place to hit. Still, a first pitch 95-97 mph fastball to get ahead in the count isn't the worst pitch in the world. Donaldson got all of it and it went out. It happens. The two hits before that were a dribbler down to 3B for an infield single and a handle shot into RF for a soft single. With a little luck, Donaldson's shot would have been a 2 out solo homer and the O's still would have been up a run.

I wasn't discussing the outing as a whole, just that pitch. Donaldson is a top player in the league and he is one of those guys on my "He will not beat me" list.

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