TT: The Orioles should let Duquette walk

[SteveO]

The bottom line is winning at the major league level.

1. The O's didn't win for 14 years before DD arrived and they have won the last three years with him.

2. It took Peter Angelos 22 years be find a VP of Baseball Operation that he liked and that could win. It will probably be very hard to find that combination again.

3. I think DD has demonstrated that he would like a promotion and raise if it offered to him. I don't blame DD for that. He hasn't shown that needs to be in Toronto. If the O's offer something attractive he would probably be glad to stay.

All the internal back story is minutiae to me. The O's are producing winners under DD. That is the bottom line to me.

That ship has likely sailed. I have a hard time believing that the DD-PA relationship would ever be what it once was after this fiasco.

Thinking it would be is just not understanding PA as person. That is not a slam but Peter is a proud man who values loyalty and ethics. At the very least his pride has to be smarting, he can't be viewing DD as all that loyal (though I think DD has good reason to want the job).

Its sad but I doubt that relationship would last even if DD did stay.

[24fps]

There would be no story if DD simply said he had no interest in talking to TOR. Why wouldn't PA be happy with that?

Once it became public it was no longer Duquette's call if Peter Angelos decided it wasn't, he's an employee after all. Evidently a long standing protocol was violated. Tampering could possibly be an issue. Peter Angelos' relationship with the new commissioner is less than ideal. This circus wasn't exactly something that was needed at this particular time.

I think it's likely that DD is complicit in this mess to some degree, but that hasn't been established yet. Until it is, the "Blue Jays as loose cannons" rationale is as plausible as any other and if it were me, I would take as much time as was necessary to make sure other parts of the business didn't become collateral damage even to a small degree.

[SteveO]

What you can get is a couple washed up and injured minor leaguers. Are you saying to settle for that?

Yes. What else can you do Weams? The damage is done. Maybe Peter can go after monetary damages for tampering after the fact.

I think it does the team and organization no good to be fractured and splitting into camps as multiple multiple sources are starting to describe.

I want the focus back on baseball and frankly I want to see the warehouse get back to focusing on that instead of this silliness.

Honestly I believe Toronto has been by MLB and in particular the old and new commissioners so as to stick it to the Orioles over the whole MASN fiasco. At the end of the day PA might and prob is on the correct side of the MASN fight. Problem is though sometimes you can win battle but lose the war. MLB guidelines are written in such a way that any owner who decides to go to war with MLB is likely to find themselves getting the shaft in a number of ways. PA is a great lawyer but don't think for a second that MLB does not have an army of them who can find ways to make the O's miserable.

[weams]

Yes. What else can you do Weams? The damage is done. Maybe Peter can go after monetary damages for tampering after the fact.

I think it does the team and organization no good to be fractured and splitting into camps as multiple multiple sources are starting to describe.

I want the focus back on baseball and frankly I want to see the warehouse get back to focusing on that instead of this silliness.

Honestly I believe Toronto has been by MLB and in particular the old and new commissioners so as to stick it to the Orioles over the whole MASN fiasco. At the end of the day PA might and prob is on the correct side of the MASN fight. Problem is though sometimes you can win battle but lose the war. MLB guidelines are written in such a way that any owner who decides to go to war with MLB is likely to find themselves getting the shaft in a number of ways. PA is a great lawyer but don't think for a second that MLB does not have an army of them who can find ways to make the O's miserable.

I believe that things will work out ok. I'm not worried about lawyers or Dan. Besides, it will all be over this week.

[SteveO]

Once it became public it was no longer Duquette's call if Peter Angelos decided it wasn't, he's an employee after all. Evidently a long standing protocol was violated. Tampering could possibly be an issue. Peter Angelos' relationship with the new commissioner is less than ideal. This circus wasn't exactly something that was needed at this particular time.

I think it's likely that DD is complicit in this mess to some degree, but that hasn't been established yet. Until it is, the "Blue Jays as loose cannons" rationale is as plausible as any other and if it were me, I would take as much time as was necessary to make sure other parts of the business didn't become collateral damage even to a small degree.

Oh I think its far worse than that.

I personally think that MLB let Toronto essentially tamper and reach out to DD via the media.

Once DD pretty much made it know via his own statements he was interested, I am sure that MLB has told DD to just be quiet and let play out.

I guess the difference here is that I actually think that the reason that DD is being quiet has nothing to do with Peter Angelos, I think it has to do with the fact that MLB has told him to keep his yap shut. MLB would love to see the Orioles a team that is fighting them in court and not cow towing to their whims were it comes to MASN feel their wrath in a way that there is really very little that PA can do about.

IF PA were to force DD to stay the FO becomes a fractured messy freak show. If they let him go, they lose a bright baseball mind that has had a lot to do with their resurgence. This whole thing to me is about MLB flexing its muscles in ways that PA is likely not going to be able to do much about.

[El Gordo]

What you can get is a couple washed up and injured minor leaguers. Are you saying to settle for that?

What makes you think that? If that's all TOR is offering then they can forget about it. If hey really don't value DD any more than that why would he even want to go there.

[SteveO]

I believe that things will work out ok. I'm not worried about lawyers or Dan. Besides, it will all be over this week.

I kinda figure the Orioles will be fine without DD. They still have bright minds in this organization.

My concern is that the Orioles are going to find themselves as a Pinata for MLB to mess with so long as this MASN thing drags out.

[SteveO]

What makes you think that? If that's all TOR is offering then they can forget about it. If hey really don't value DD any more than that why would he even want to go there.

Well lets say Toronto says .... ok you keep him then. We will start looking elsewhere.

Do you really think that the damage that has been done can be undone?

In a weird way no matter what Toronto does we kinda lose IMO. If he goes we lose a baseball mind that has helped us get to the playoffs. If he stays we know have factions, splintering and a bad FO dynamic and who knows what dynamic between PA-DD. Either way Toronto hurts a competitor. Pretty sure that is why they have continued to push the issue, that and I think they have been told off the record that there will be no repercussions from MLB

[weams]

I kinda figure the Orioles will be fine without DD. They still have bright minds in this organization.

My concern is that the Orioles are going to find themselves as a Pinata for MLB to mess with so long as this MASN thing drags out.

Yeah, maybe just give that RSN to the Nats. It's nothing but trouble for us the way it is. Causes unrest.

[Prayin4Reign]

For the life of me I can't understand people knocking Dan because of an opportunity he might be interested in. Who among us wouldn't do the same? If there's someone here that would pass up a huge raise, a much larger stake in a company, and increased responsibility, speak up.

Anyone?

That's what I thought.

In professional sports, contracts are renegotiated and bought out on a regular occurrence. It's a business.

This isn't a matter of Dan not wanting to be here. This isn't a matter of him looking longingly out his window to the north. The oportunity has arisen because another team has take notice of the exceptional manner in which he has performed his job. He's done a phenomenal job (with Buck) and now he has caught the attention of another franchise that wants to give him increased responsibilities and pay him a buttload of money.

On a different but related front, I'm pretty happy with the state of the franchise. I think there are some real interesting players to watch this year. As Frobby alluded, Duquette hasn't had the 'luxury' of having high draft picks! But still players like Walker, Alvarez, Yaz, Sisco, Reyes, Diaz, and Gonzales show a lot of promise and intrigue. I think the team has done well in the position they've been in.

I'd love nothing more than to see Duquette stay put. But I don't wish him any ill will if that doesn't happen. He's earned the right and it's just business. Contract or no contract.

[weams]

Well lets say Toronto says .... ok you keep him then. We will start looking elsewhere.

Do you really think that the damage that has been done can be undone?

In a weird way no matter what Toronto does we kinda lose IMO. If he goes we lose a baseball mind that has helped us get to the playoffs. If he stays we know have factions, splintering and a bad FO dynamic and who knows what dynamic between PA-DD. Either way Toronto hurts a competitor. Pretty sure that is why they have continued to push the issue, that and I think they have been told off the record that there will be no repercussions from MLB

I believe once the situation is resolved, there is no damage to be undone. It is just like the Balfour fiasco.

[weams]

He's earned the right and it's just business. Contract or no contract.

I agree. When his contract is done, I think he deserves every penny he gets. He's done a fabulous job.

[El Gordo]

Well lets say Toronto says .... ok you keep him then. We will start looking elsewhere.

Do you really think that the damage that has been done can be undone?

In a weird way no matter what Toronto does we kinda lose IMO. If he goes we lose a baseball mind that has helped us get to the playoffs. If he stays we know have factions, splintering and a bad FO dynamic and who knows what dynamic between PA-DD. Either way Toronto hurts a competitor. Pretty sure that is why they have continued to push the issue, that and I think they have been told off the record that there will be no repercussions from MLB

I don't think there is any great relationship between DD and PA to begin with. It's between Buck and PA. I don't think much will have changed. Certainly DD is smart enough to realize that he wouldn't be free to negotiate with TOR unless there were adequate compensation. If that is not the case then I am confident the can continue to do the fine job he has been doing for the tem of his contract. He is an adult, a pro, and he likes his current job.

[SteveO]

I believe once the situation is resolved, there is no damage to be undone. It is just like the Balfour fiasco.

I hope your right but I have a hard time believing that Roch, Connolly, Tony and others both national and local who have inside sources are reporting the same kind of things about toxic environments, discontent, and generally an awkward splintered vibe in our front office.

Kinda feels like wishful thinking to think that this has not damage some relationships. Now if you believe they can all kiss and make up, that I can hope is true.

[SteveO]

I don't think there is any great relationship between DD and PA to begin with. It's between Buck and PA. I don't think much will have changed. Certainly DD is smart enough to realize that he wouldn't be free to negotiate with TOR unless there were adequate compensation. If that is not the case then I am confident the can continue to do the fine job he has been doing for the tem of his contract. He is an adult, a pro, and he likes his current job.

And I agree DD will do his job regardless of what happens to the best of his abilities.

Again I ask you though, do you think that the local and national media are making the whole issues and splintering in the warehouse angle up ? Or do you believe that was a dynamic that has been there and as such will have little impact moving forward if DD stays.