Childs Walker BaltSun: How Much is Dan Worth?

[weams]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baltimore-sports-blog/bal-how-much-are-dan-duquette-and-other-top-execs-really-worth-20150123-story.html

I reached out to ESPN analyst Keith Law, who worked in the Blue Jays' front office once upon a time and knows the prospect landscape as well as anyone. I've discussed Duquette with Law in the past, and he holds him in high regard. But he told me via text, "I wouldn't give up a top prospect for any executive. I think Dan's done a great job but the value of a top prospect can run into the tens of millions of dollars."

[Moose Milligan]

Uh, no? Not really?

How invaluable is a guy who can bring in scrap heap guys and help construct a winner? Guys like Steave Pearce, for example. Are we as good of a team last year without Dan's insight to bring on a guy like that who ends up hitting 21 homers? I bet Dan would tell you that he didn't expect that but felt that Pearce would provide value. How invaluable is a guy that can manipulate the 40 man roster like he can? It's amazing how he shuffles players between Norfolk, Bowie and Baltimore

Having the insight to build a team and figure out how an organization should be run is worth way more than a prospect. And it's not like Dan is just some one hit wonder, he's been doing this since the Montreal days. 1994 Expos anyone? He got Boston on track. He got us on track. It's not a coincidence, he has to have his methods and things he takes into account to produce results. He sets the tone and, IMO, it's worth a lot more than just a pitching prospect who may or may not pan out.

They're getting a guy that can mold and shape their roster and get their minor leagues on track. And all we're getting is a player or two? Whatever.

[weams]

Jim Duquette says "There are a lot of guys who could partner with Buck Showalter and do a good job with the Orioles. It's not like Dan is the only one."

[Can_of_corn]

Jim Duquette says "There are a lot of guys who could partner with Buck Showalter and do a good job with the Orioles. It's not like Dan is the only one."

As long as Jim isn't one of the ones being considered.

[SouthRider]

Jim Duquette says "There are a lot of guys who could partner with Buck Showalter and do a good job with the Orioles. It's not like Dan is the only one."

There are a lot of guys who could be CEO of the Blue Jays and do a good job. it's not like Dan is the only one.

[AlbionHero]

They're getting a guy that can mold and shape their roster and get their minor leagues on track. And all we're getting is a player or two? Whatever.

Thats what a GM is worth. Friedman is the highest paid GM in the game and he's paid like a 1 WAR player per year. Thats how much they are worth on the market.

[Beast]

Thats what a GM is worth. Friedman is the highest paid GM in the game and he's paid like a 1 WAR player per year. Thats how much they are worth on the market.

The market is pretty irrelevant to the present situation. Dan is worth whatever Angelos decides he is worth to him, in a situation where he has all the leverage. You would think Toronto would have backed away from this negotiation long ago, given Angelos' demands. The fact they haven't means either Ed Rogers is out to prove he can "get his man" regardless of cost, or that he is seriously concerned about the impact on his team and his own reputation of tampering charges, or both. The O's come away either with an extraordinary haul or with Duquette, who would have to remain committed to do a good job for the O's given his own professional reputation. Angelos gets to determine price here, not the market. Rogers has stumbled his way into this hole, and as far as we can tell he's still digging.

[AlbionHero]

The market is pretty irrelevant to the present situation. Dan is worth whatever Angelos decides he is worth to him, in a situation where he has all the leverage. You would think Toronto would have backed away from this negotiation long ago, given Angelos' demands. The fact they haven't means either Ed Rogers is out to prove he can "get his man" regardless of cost, or that he is seriously concerned about the impact on his team and his own reputation of tampering charges, or both. The O's come away either with an extraordinary haul or with Duquette, who would have to remain committed to do a good job for the O's given his own professional reputation. Angelos gets to determine price here, not the market. Rogers has stumbled his way into this hole, and as far as we can tell he's still digging.

Thats fine if Angelos tries to get as much as he can. I'm just saying what he's asking is far beyond market value, so people shouldn't be surprised when most national media people say that a GM isn't worth a top prospect.

[Can_of_corn]

Thats fine if Angelos tries to get as much as he can. I'm just saying what he's asking is far beyond market value, so people shouldn't be surprised when most national media people say that a GM isn't worth a top prospect.

And I will say that it is currently a shifting market with managers and front office talent perceived value rising.

I have thought for some time that non-player personnel assets are undervalued.

[AlbionHero]

And I will say that it is currently a shifting market with managers and front office talent perceived value rising.

I have thought for some time that non-player personnel assets are undervalued.

If a trade like this does eventually go through, then the price for coaches and execs certainly will skyrocket due to precedent. I also agree that they are a bit undervalued, but the market is all about what people are willing to pay.

[Moose Milligan]

Thats what a GM is worth. Friedman is the highest paid GM in the game and he's paid like a 1 WAR player per year. Thats how much they are worth on the market.

Disagree. Someone that has vision and experience into turning sad sack franchises from losers to winners have to be worth more than a top prospect. DD has a proven track record everywhere he's been. IMO, it's not a matter of if, but when that Toronto becomes better when he takes over and gets everything in place. Can't say whether or not the prospect will ever be of value.

I think thats the problem here, people just want to automatically default to crap like WAR and dollars. DD is going to do a good job no matter where he goes. Can you put a price on winning? I guess you can, but can you put a price on what he did for us as a fanbase, turning this thing around and playing a large part in ending the seasons streak of losing and then helping this team to the playoffs twice.

As a fan, is there a price for that? Can you honestly tell me that some prospect we've never heard of or know nothing about is worth three years of great baseball after the losing crap we went through for over a decade?

[weams]

Disagree. Someone that has vision and experience into turning sad sack franchises from losers to winners have to be worth more than a top prospect. DD has a proven track record everywhere he's been. IMO, it's not a matter of if, but when that Toronto becomes better when he takes over and gets everything in place. Can't say whether or not the prospect will ever be of value.

I think thats the problem here, people just want to automatically default to crap like WAR and dollars. DD is going to do a good job no matter where he goes. Can you put a price on winning? I guess you can, but can you put a price on what he did for us as a fanbase, turning this thing around and playing a large part in ending the seasons streak of losing and then helping this team to the playoffs twice.

As a fan, is there a price for that? Can you honestly tell me that some prospect we've never heard of or know nothing about is worth three years of great baseball after the losing crap we went through for over a decade?

Four Years. Four years.

[AlbionHero]

Disagree. Someone that has vision and experience into turning sad sack franchises from losers to winners have to be worth more than a top prospect. DD has a proven track record everywhere he's been. IMO, it's not a matter of if, but when that Toronto becomes better when he takes over and gets everything in place. Can't say whether or not the prospect will ever be of value.

I think thats the problem here, people just want to automatically default to crap like WAR and dollars. DD is going to do a good job no matter where he goes. Can you put a price on winning? I guess you can, but can you put a price on what he did for us as a fanbase, turning this thing around and playing a large part in ending the seasons streak of losing and then helping this team to the playoffs twice.

As a fan, is there a price for that? Can you honestly tell me that some prospect we've never heard of or know nothing about is worth three years of great baseball after the losing crap we went through for over a decade?

I don't disagree with you about Duquette being important. But that doesn't change the fact that GMs have low market value... look at Theo Epstein, he led the Red Sox to their first World Series is like 80 years and the Red Sox got a fringe AAA reliever for him.

Just because we believe he's done a lot for us doesn't mean other teams would be willing to pay a super high price for him, and as long as that mindset persists GMs will not be valued highly by the league.

[srock]

Worth to whom? There are only 30 jobs in mlb. This isn't macroeconomics.

It appears only two employers want him and the orioles hold all the cards here. He is worth what Angelos wants for him and the Blue Jays are willing to part with. Everything else is irrelevant.

[Frobby]

Disagree. Someone that has vision and experience into turning sad sack franchises from losers to winners have to be worth more than a top prospect. DD has a proven track record everywhere he's been. IMO, it's not a matter of if, but when that Toronto becomes better when he takes over and gets everything in place. Can't say whether or not the prospect will ever be of value.

I think thats the problem here, people just want to automatically default to crap like WAR and dollars. DD is going to do a good job no matter where he goes. Can you put a price on winning? I guess you can, but can you put a price on what he did for us as a fanbase, turning this thing around and playing a large part in ending the seasons streak of losing and then helping this team to the playoffs twice.

As a fan, is there a price for that? Can you honestly tell me that some prospect we've never heard of or know nothing about is worth three years of great baseball after the losing crap we went through for over a decade?

Stotle and I had this discussion in another thread. I think a top executive is very valuable, but their value is harder to measure than players ', so they are underpaid. Heck, the Blue Jays had Roy Freakin' Halladay, and never went to the playoffs. An exec can change a team's fate more than one player can, in the right circumstances.