No News on International Signings

[hoosiers]

Sorry to those who feel this does not deserve its own thread, but there has been no news on Orioles International prospect signings in over a year since we signed Diaz and Reyes and Peralta before that. I expect that FredF has been very active and that we've signed a lot of guys we like, but the lack of news is very disappointing - especially since it speaks of a lack of involvement at the highest levels of international prospects.

[MurphDogg]

The Orioles signed 18 year-old Miguel Gonzalez from the DR in July 2014 for $400,000. That was within the 2014-15 signing period.

[MurphDogg]

They also signed pitcher Lazaro Leyva and outfielder Elier Leyva, both out of Cuba (and unrelated) in September and December for $725,000 and $180,000.

[Big Ben]

Here is a (probably woefully) incomplete list of international signing bonuses from 2006 -2012 handed out by Major League teams. I arbitrarily set a cap of $10M at the upper end, and $200K at the lower end. This excludes the truly marquee guys - the Puigs, Chapmans, Solers, Moncadas, etc. So far, these type of prospects/players reside in a upper stratosphere that the Orioles have shown NO inclination to ascend to (financially). Until they break that mold, I don't consider the Orioles as "players" for that breed of international signee. So this is more a list of international signees that the Os could potentially have been in on. A few may have even BEEN signed by the Birds -- Hector Veloz at least caught my eye at first glance.

Amed Rosario 		SS 	Mets 		$1,750,000	2012 	Omar Luis 		P 	Yankees 	$4,000,000 	2012Amaurys Minier 		3B 	Twins 		$1,400,000 	2012Gustavo Cabrera 	OF 	Giants 		$1,300,000 	2012Luis Torrens 		3B 	Yankees 	$1,300,000 	2012Hector Caro 		OF 	Indians 	$1,100,000 	2012Alexander Palma 	OF 	Yankees 	$800,000 	2012Frandi Delarosa 	SS 	Cubs 		$700,000 	2012Julio De La Cruz 	3B 	Pirates 	$700,000 	2012Yancarlos Baez 		SS 	Yankees 	$650,000 	2012Jose Almonte 		P 	Red Sox 	$610,000 	2012Deivy Grullon 		C 	Phillies 	$575,000 	2012Jose Pujols 		OF 	Phillies 	$540,000 	2012Nathanael Javier 	3B 	Giants 		$475,000 	2012Luis Barrera 		OF 	A's 		$450,000 	2012Edmundo Sosa 		OF 	Cardinals 	$425,000 	2012Grofy Cruz 		SS 	Indians 	$400,000 	2012Francisco Mejia 	C 	Indians 	$350,000 	2012Kelvin Esteves 		3B 	Braves 		$300,000 	2012Ignacio Valdez 		OF 	IFA 		$280,000	2012Nomar Mazara 		OF 			$5,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicElier Hernandez 	OF 			$3,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicRonald Guzman 		OF 			$3,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicAdalberto Mondesi 	SS 			$2,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicMarck Malave 		C 			$1,600,000 	2011 VenezuelaYohander Mendez 	LHP 			$1,500,000 	2011 VenezuelaLuis Enrique Acosta 	SS 			$1,100,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicEnrique Acosta 		SS 			$1,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicDorssys Paulino 	SS 			$1,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicHarold Ramirez 		OF 			$1,000,000 	2011 ColombiaJose Ruiz 		C 			$1,000,000 	2011 VenezuelaDawel Lugo 		SS 			$1,000,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicRaimel Flores 		SS 			$900,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicJonathan Perez 		RHP 			$825,000 	2011 VenezuelaManuel Marcos 		OF 			$800,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicFrank Del Valle 	LHP 			$800,000 	2011 CubaCarlos Tocci 		OF 			$759,000 	2011 VenezuelaAdelin Santa 		3B 			$750,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicMiguel Andujar 		3B 			$750,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicLuis Reynoso 		SS 			$700,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicMiguel Gonzalez 	RHP 			$650,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicPedro Payano 		RHP 			$650,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicDeoscar Romero 		RHP 			$600,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicElvis Escobar 		OF 			$570,000 	2011 VenezuelaDewin Perez 		LHP 			$450,000 	2011 ColombiaRougned Odor 		SS 			$425,000 	2011 VenezuelaSimon Mercedes 		P 			$400,000 	2011 D.R.Anthony Santander 	OF 			$385,000 	2011 VenezuelaEric Valdez 		OF 			$325,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicHarold Arauz 		RHP 			$300,000 	2011 PanamaIosif Bernal 		OF 			$230,000 	2011 PanamaArturo Michelena 	SS 			$220,000 	2011 VenezuelaFrancisco Miguel 	OF 			$200,000 	2011 Dominican RepublicAdeiny Hechavarria 	SS 			$10,000,000 	2010 CubaAdonys Cardona 		RHP 			$2,800,000 	2010 VenezuelaAriel Ovando 		OF 			$2,600,000 	2010 D.R.Luis Heredia 		RHP 			$2,600,000 	2010 MexicoRenato Nunez 		3B 			$2,200,000 	2010 VenezuelaPhillips Castillo 	OF 			$2,200,000 	2010 D. R.Carlos Martinez 	RHP 			$1,500,000 	2010 D.R.Jorge Alfaro 		C 			$1,300,000 	2010 ColombiaHumberto Arteaga 	SS 			$1,100,000 	2010 VenezuelaMartin Peguero 		2B 			$1,100,000 	2010 D.R.Rubi Silva 		OF 			$1,000,000 	2010 CubaDanry Vasquez 		OF 			$1,000,000 	2010 D. R.Orlando Caxito 		SS 			$1,000,000 	2010 D.R.Duanel Jones 		3B 			$900,000 	2010 D. R.Jose Torres 		P 			$851,000 	2010 ColombiaJin-Young Kim 		P 			$850,000 	2010 South KoreaVicmal De La Cruz 	OF 			$800,000 	2010 D.R.Yoel Araujo 		OF 			$800,000 	2010 D.R.Gabriel Cenas 		3B 			$700,000 	2010 VenezuelaWilmer Romero 		OF 			$656,500 	2010 D.R.Christopher Tamarez 	SS 			$650,000 	2010 D.R.Luis Pina 		P 			$650,000 	2010 VenezuelaCesar Lopez 		P 			$600,000 	2010 CubanArgenis Raga 		C 			$580,000 	2010 VenezuelaJavier Pimentel 	SS 			$575,000 	2010 D.R.Carlos Penalver 	SS 			$550,000 	2010 VenezuelaYaniel Cabezas 		C 			$500,000 	2010 CubaJeimer Candelario 	3B 			$500,000 	2010 D.R.Jose Rafael De Paula 	P 			$500,000 	2010 D.R.Edwin Moreno 		OF 			$500,000 	2010 D.R.Yordi Calderon 		3B 			$477,500 	2010 VenezuelaEduardo Rivera 		P 			$475,000 	2010 D.R.Joel Payamps 		P 			$465,000 	2010 D.R.Reinier Roibal 		P 			$450,000 	2010 CubaAmaury Capellan 	OF 			$450,000 	2010 D.R.Michael Feliz 		RHP 			$400,000 	2010 D.R.Dan Sanchez 		SS 			$350,000 	2010 D.R.Jeffrey Baez 		OF 			$350,000 	2010 VenezuelaJose Tovar 		LHP 			$350,000 	2010 D.R.Jose Montero 		RHP 			$350,000 	2010 D.R.Milton Gomez 		P 			$350,000 	2010 D.R.Lino Martinez 		LHP 			$325,000 	2010 VenezuelaRonny Mejias 		SS 			$300,000 	2010 VenezuelaHector Veloz 		3B 			$300,000 	2010 D.R.Erick Olivo 		RHP 			$300,000 	2010 D.R.Anderson Gonzalez 	SS 			$300,000 	2010 VenezuelaCarlos Cartagena 	OF 			$300,000 	2010 VenezuelaWilly Garcia 		OF 			$280,000 	2010 D.R.Oviel Florentino 	SS 			$250,000 	2010 D.R.Kelvin Vizcaino 	OF 			$250,000 	2010 D.R.Alberto Mineo 		C 			$225,000 	2010 ItalyMiguel Nunez 		RHP 			$220,000 	2010 D.R.Dilson Herrera 		SS 			$220,000 	2010 ColombiaLuis Marte 		SS 			$215,000 	2010 D.R.Yorman Garcia 		OF 			$200,000 	2010 VenezuelaSergio Beriguete 	P 			$200,000 	2010 D.R.Jean Carlos Batista 	SS 			$200,000 	2010 D.R.Pedro Perez 					$200,000 	2010 ColombiaFrancisco Silva 	SS 			$200,000 	2010 VenezuelaJuan Bautista 		P 			$200,000 	2010 D.R.Jose Iglesias 		SS 			$8,000,000 	2009 CubaNoel Arguelles 		LHP 			$7,000,000 	2009 CubaMiguel Sano 		SS 			$3,150,000 	2009 D.R.Gary Sanchez 		C 			$3,000,000 	2009 D.R.Guillermo Pimentel 	OF 			$2,000,000 	2009 D.R.Jose Vinicio 		SS 			$1,950,000 	2009 D.R.Edward Salcedo 		SS 			$1,600,000 	2009 D.R.Jurickson Profar 	SS 			$1,550,000 	2009 CuracaoCheslor Cuthbert 	3B 			$1,350,000 	2009 NicaraguaJuan Urbina 		LHP 			$1,250,000 	2009 VenezuelaLuis Sardinas 		SS 			$1,200,000 	2009 VenezuelaFernando Perez 		SS 			$850,000 	2009 D.R.Jorge Polanco 		SS 			$750,000 	2009 D.R.Max Kepler 		OF 			$750,000 	2009 GermanySantiago Nessy 		C 			$750,000 	2009 VenezuelaEladio Moronta 		OF 			$570,000 	2009 D.R.Rafael Rodriguez 	OF 			$2,550,000 	2008 D.R.Yorman Rodriguez 	OF 			$2,500,000 	2008 VenezuelaAdys Portillo 		RHP 			$2,000,000 	2008 VenezuelaJulio Morban 		OF 			$1,100,000 	2008 D.R.Gian Arias 		SS 			$950,000 	2008 D.R.Hak-Ju Lee 		SS 			$725,000 	2008 KoreaGustavo Pierre 		SS 			$700,000 	2008 D.R.Carlos Perez 		LHP 			$650,000 	2008 D.R.Domingo Santana 	OF 			$330,000 	2008 D.R.Chia Jen Lo 		RHP 			$250,000 	2008 TaiwanKelvin De Leon 		OF 			$1,100,000 	2007 D.R.Young Il-Jung 		RHP 			$1,000,000 	2007 KoreaJulio Teheran 		RHP 			$850,000 	2007 ColombiaMartin Perez 		LHP 			$580,000 	2007 VenezuelaJefry Marte 		3B 			$550,000 	2007 D.R.Dae-Eun Rhee 		RHP 			$525,000 	2007 KoreaCesar Puello 		OF 			$400,000 	2007 D.R.Rymer Liriano 		OF 			$300,000 	2007 D.R.Jesus Montero 		C 			$1,650,000 	2006 VenezuelaCarlos Triunfel 	SS 			$1,300,000 	2006 D.R.Mario Martinez 		3B 			$600,000 	2006 VenezuelaEngel Beltre 		OF 			$600,000 	2006 D.R.Randall Delgado 	RHP 			$500,000 	2006 PanamaJairo Heredia 		RHP 			$350,000 	2006 D.R.Jose Pirela 		SS 			$300,000 	2006 Venezuela					$160,439,000

That's $160M+ of signing bonuses handed out over a 7-year span to "high-end" international signees. Teheran looks like a front-end starter when healthy. Sano is still a hugely intriguing power prospect. Jose Iglesias is a defensive wizard at SS with a Belanger bat at best (which is still hugely valuable, if underappreciated in today's game). Odor, Profar, Gary Sanchez, and Carlos Martinez all seem likely to carve out decent Major League careers. I'm sure there's plenty of others on the list that I'm missing at a quick glance -- I'll let Stotle or CoC point out my oversights . But to be honest, I don't look at the list as a whole and moan, "Why aren't we in on all the guys?". I look at the list and think, "Wow, a whole lot of buscones are getting paid!".

Clearly, the Orioles think that spreading their limited international budget around to a number of prospects/(suspects) at smaller signing bonuses is the better approach. Quantity over quality, I suppose. Within the financial constraints that they have imposed upon themselves -- and the MLB has now "imposed" on them -- spreading the wealth around probably IS the best approach. I'd rather yield a relatively underpriced and unsung Jonathan Schoop or Miguel Gonzalez every year or two than watch the Os put their entire international signing budget into one bucket named uh, Guillermo Pimental, for instance. (No offense intended, Sr. Pimental).

All signing bonus information was lifted from Matt Garrioch's blog: http://www.mlbprospectguide.com/p/international-signings.html. It's simply where Google led me first

Welp, that's my annual two cents. See y'all next year!

[clapdiddy]

Ugh...look at the career stats (minor league) of one $7M dollar investment Noel Arguelles.

[OriolesMagic83]

Several teams are over the international cap for the coming year. Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers, Arizona, Philly (?), and I'm sure I'm missing someone. With the biggest spenders locked out of the market, I would like to see the O's take a chance on one of the top players.

[MurphDogg]

Several teams are over the international cap for the coming year. Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers, Arizona, Philly (?), and I'm sure I'm missing someone. With the biggest spenders locked out of the market, I would like to see the O's take a chance on one of the top players.

The Dodgers are not over the international cap. They decided to make their big splash this coming July 2nd which is why they tried to convince Moncada to wait until then to sign. The Phillies are $100,000 under the cap for this period. The Rays, Red Sox, Yankees and Angels exceeded the cap by more than 15 percent this period which means they can't sign any international free agents to any deals over $300k for the next two periods (that is until July 2nd, 2017). Prior to this year it was only a one year penalty so the Rangers and the Cubs who went over during the 2013-14 period will have no restrictions when the next period begins this July.

The way the system is set up it makes the most sense for big market teams to do what the Yankees did this year and sign everyone they possibly can and then take the next two years off. As long as you go over the cap by more than 200 percent, you are in a sense, coming out ahead. This is why the Red Sox, Yankees and Angels were the favorites to sign Moncada.

[Redskins Rick]

They also signed pitcher Lazaro Leyva and outfielder Elier Leyva, both out of Cuba (and unrelated) in September and December for $725,000 and $180,000.

Speaking of Leyva the OFer.

http://www.masnsports.com/steve-melewski/2015/03/q-and-a-session-with-elier-leyva-the-newest-os-cuban-outfielder.html

[Stotle]

Ugh...look at the career stats (minor league) of one $7M dollar investment Noel Arguelles.

Shoulder injury and resultant loss of velocity can have that effect.

[BohKnowsBmore]

They also signed pitcher Lazaro Leyva and outfielder Elier Leyva, both out of Cuba (and unrelated) in September and December for $725,000 and $180,000.

He of the interesting, grainy video:

[video=youtube;L45-H2VOaMk]