Hardball Times: Tommy John

[weams]

Did Wallace and Chiti get out of the meat factory just in time?

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/02/shae-simmons-undergoes-tommy-john-surgery.html

[Can_of_corn]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>LRT: Shoulder injury indicates changed mechanics. I hope the Braves take change in front office as opportunity to change their approach.</p>— Will Carroll (@injuryexpert) <a href="

">February 12, 2015</a></blockquote>

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>The Braves have far, far too many pitching injuries and its something they could fix during this rebuild.</p>— Will Carroll (@injuryexpert) <a href="

">February 12, 2015</a></blockquote>

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[terps19]

I hope that is not a precursor of things to come.

[Frobby]

At first I was thinking, "not Orioles related." But this does call into question whether these injuries are coincidental, or stem from anything Wallace and Chiti were doing in Atlanta that could cause similar issues to arise here. I note, of course, that our pitching staff was remarkably healthy last year and I certainly didn't observe anything about the way our pitchers were used or prepared that would raise an eyebrow about injury risk. Quite the contrary.

[weams]

At first I was thinking, "not Orioles related." But this does call into question whether these injuries are coincidental, or stem from anything Wallace and Chiti were doing in Atlanta that could cause similar issues to arise here. I note, of course, that our pitching staff was remarkably healthy last year and I certainly didn't observe anything about the way our pitchers were used or prepared that would raise an eyebrow about injury risk. Quite the contrary.

I think that this is more an indictment of what they have been doing at the MLB level, and specifically Fredi Gonzalez use of his staff. But maybe we do need to be concerned. From what I could tell about the changes that they made with our guys, they were always quite subtle. And Rick Peterson has been running the program for our MILB pitcher for three seasons now, right?

[weams]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/490638-hiring-florida-marlins-leftover-fredi-gonzalez-huge-mistake-for-atlanta-braves

Secondly, he is horrible at managing pitchers.

Gonzalez is a huge pitch counter and he pulls pitchers out of the game way too soon. When he managed the Marlins, he often yanked the pitchers out early when they were cruising just because they were at 85 pitches or near 100 pitches. Josh Johnson had a no-hitter going at one point and Gonzalez said he would not have allowed Johnson to finish his no-hitter and “wasn’t going to allow him to throw 150 pitches.”

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/is-it-ok-to-blame-fredi-gonzalez-for-eric-oflaherty-and-jonny-venterss-injuries/

The poster boys for Atlanta’s late-inning run prevention were closer Craig Kimbrel and lefties Eric O’Flaherty and Jonny Venters. In 2011, O’Flaherty, Venters, and Kimbrel were first, third, and fifth, respectively, among Braves pitchers in WAR. In 2012, Kimbrel and O’Flaherty were second and fifth. Put another way, in the past two years the Braves had three different relievers post three-win seasons. That’s ridiculous.

Since the start of the 2011 season, O’Flaherty has appeared in 161 regular-season games, 55 of them on less than a day’s worth of rest. Venters appeared in 151 games, 49 of them after having pitched the day before. And last week, we found out that both of them would be headed for Tommy John surgery — in Venters’s case, for a second time.

Braves manager Fredi Gonzalez appears to manage his bullpen under the Starship Troopers doctrine — the government doesn’t give you nuclear weapons so you can bring them home unused.

[Ruzious]

Atlanta's had more problems with Starting pitchers needing surgeries more than relievers. I find it hard to understand the logic of blaming this problem on Gonzales for UNDER-USING his starters. There's definitely a problem, but making Gonzales the scapegoat seems like a lazy conclusion.

[weams]

Atlanta's had more problems with Starting pitchers needing surgeries more than relievers. I find it hard to understand the logic of blaming this problem on Gonzales for UNDER-USING his starters. There's definitely a problem, but making Gonzales the scapegoat seems like a lazy conclusion.

I tend to be lazy occasionally. Maybe it has something to do with the types of pitchers that Atland has gone after?

[Frobby]

It's also a bit dangerous to assume that three young pitchers having TJ surgery in a two year period has a root cause in the organization. Sometimes, stuff just happens. Sometimes when you play roulette, three lemons come up.

[weams]

It's also a bit dangerous to assume that three young pitchers having TJ surgery in a two year period has a root cause in the organization. Sometimes, stuff just happens. Sometimes when you play roulette, three lemons come up.

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2012/11/4/3587834/MLB-tommy-john-surgeries-a-more-complete-list

Plus I think it is 6 or 7 since 2012 as well.

http://www.atlantabaseballtalk.com/why-braves-pitchers-might-be-more-prone-to-tommy-john-surgeries/

[Hank Scorpio]

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2012/11/4/3587834/MLB-tommy-john-surgeries-a-more-complete-list

Plus I think it is 6 or 7 since 2012 as well.

http://www.atlantabaseballtalk.com/why-braves-pitchers-might-be-more-prone-to-tommy-john-surgeries/

Lemons!!!!!

[Ruzious]

I tend to be lazy occasionally. Maybe it has something to do with the types of pitchers that Atland has gone after?

I don't mean you - I mean the folks you quoted. I wouldn't call you lazy; maybe good for nothing but never lazy.

[OFFNY]

I don't mean you - I mean the folks you quoted. I wouldn't call you lazy; maybe good for nothing but never lazy.

Weams is akin to my beloved 1976 Oriole, Reggie Jackson.

Reggie was a HUGE pain in the ass ....... but NEVER lazy.

[weams]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Yu Darvish update: MRI on right triceps muscle showed sprained of UCL in right elbow. Discussing Tommy John surgery.</p>— Jesse Sanchez (@JesseSanchezMLB) <a href="

">March 7, 2015</a></blockquote>

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Do they want a starter?

[Can_of_corn]

Are they realistically competitive with Darvish out?

So is this the same injury he had last season? I forget why they shut him down. I do remember he got grief for not coming back the last few weeks of the season.