Is it too early to be worried about the starting pitching as a whole?

[FanSince88]

When you're a team who has constantly outperformed their pitching peripherals, its going to come back and bite you in the ass eventually. We could finally be seeing the balancing out now, especially with so many defensive injuries.

I was about to make the same point. Four of our five starters (Norris, Tillman, Chen, and Gonzalez) probably have close to replacement-level stuff, but have gotten above replacement-level results out of it the past few years. Much of that is to their credit, but we could see their shortcomings magnified this year especially with Boston and Toronto's lineups upgraded and the Yanks still being a dangerous hitting team at times. Jimenez has high quality stuff but is erratic, and Gausman of course is still green.

Crazy thought: what are the chances that Britton gets stretched out to be a starter? I think things might have to get really bad for it to come to that, but I wouldn't mind seeing it if the SP struggles continue for a couple months. I'd hate for him to become another BJ Ryan or Koji Uehara -- great reliever on a losing team who is clearly the best pitcher on the staff. If the delta between a team's closer and the rest of the pitching becomes wide enough, ironically the closer's role ceases to be meaningful because the team won't get many save situations to begin with.

[birrman54]

Tillman got burned for 3 or 4 runs with that scoring change.

And I expect Tillman to perform better than what he has done so far. But I don't think he can complain that a screaming line drive with the bases loaded resulted in runs.

[Can_of_corn]

He didn't get burned. He deserved those runs. He pitched like crap and that wasn't an error.

I disagree. I don't think a ball should have to hit the fielders glove for it to count as an error.

I think the play should have been made with ordinary effort.

If a ground ball goes through a fielder's legs or a fly ball falls untouched and, in the scorer's judgment, the fielder could have handled the ball with ordinary effort, the official scorer shall charge such fielder with an error.

10.12

If someone wants to pull up the play I will give it another look.

[birrman54]

I was about to make the same point. Four of our five starters (Norris, Tillman, Chen, and Gonzalez) probably have close to replacement-level stuff, but have gotten above replacement-level results out of it the past few years. Much of that is to their credit, but we could see their shortcomings magnified this year especially with Boston and Toronto's lineups upgraded and the Yanks still being a dangerous hitting team at times. Jimenez has high quality stuff but is erratic, and Gausman of course is still green.

Crazy thought: what are the chances that Britton gets stretched out to be a starter? I think things might have to get really bad for it to come to that, but I wouldn't mind seeing it if the SP struggles continue for a couple months. I'd hate for him to become another BJ Ryan or Koji Uehara -- great reliever on a losing team who is clearly the best pitcher on the staff. If the delta between a team's closer and the rest of the pitching becomes wide enough, ironically the closer's role ceases to be meaningful because the team won't get many save situations to begin with.

Britton won't be moved out of his role this year, and I'm doubting ever during the remainder of his O's tenure. I'd love to see him starting in 2016 though. A LHP with a devastating sinker would be tremendously valuable.

[weams]

He didn't get burned. He deserved those runs. He pitched like crap and that wasn't an error.

Absolutely. None of our other recent right fielders would have gotten to it either. And I am a huge Tillman fan.

[TouchemAll]

Norris has to be given at least another two to three starts to right the ship. He will likely be given more than that. I can see him continuing to struggle and not getting removed from the rotation until well into May.

:agree: too but that leash gets shorter with each start

[Can_of_corn]

Let's talk reality. Outfielders don't get errors on balls like that. Nick Markakis had something like zero errors last year. Do you think he didn't misjudge one ball all year that he could have caught with a good break? The rule might say one thing. Reality says another.

Then why call it an error in the first place?

BTW I despise the whole, let's forget about what the rules actually are business.

Just because it is done incorrectly 95 times out of 100 doesn't make the other 5 the mistake. If they don't want it to be an error, change the rule.

[neveradoubt]

It is mostly about the HR allowed. 25th in giving them up. 29th in runs allowed. ERA is last but it is runs that beat you

[weams]

It is mostly about the HR allowed. 25th in giving them up. 29th in runs allowed. ERA is last but it is runs that beat you

Our pitching has stunk.

[TouchemAll]

Our pitching has stunk.

That actually sums it up pretty good!

[Can_of_corn]

It was a mistake to call it an error at the time and I said so. If you want to argue enforcing the rules the way they are written that's another argument. Everyone knows that a play like that is never called an error and that there are much worse plays in the outfield that are not called errors.

In this case that play is ruled a hit 100 out of 100 times. Yes, ruling it an error on the 101th time is a mistake. You, being you, will not back down on this I'm sure.

So if everyone else is doing the wrong thing, you should do the wrong thing because the wrong thing, not the right thing, is now the right thing?

[Aristotelian]

Bottom line, the ball was hit very hard and Tillman deserves credit for that.

Snider should have made they play but it is not an error.

Plays like that will count against his range metrics and DWAR, as they should.

[Can_of_corn]

You being you. Gotta love it.

Well you threw down the gauntlet there so I felt obligated to give you what you wanted.