Not signing Miler and Cruz is going to haunt this team and it's fans for years to come......

[waroriole]

The Orioles problem is the starting pitchers have sucked. Cruz/Miller wouldn't solve this.

Yep. SP and defense.

[tntoriole]

I would just like an honest and factual reason as to why, when this team is about to be torn apart next year, and we came within a few plays going the other way against the Royals from going to the WS last year, why this team could not spend a few extra milliion to sign TWO ELITE PLAYERS that arguably could be the best at what they do TODAY. That is hit homeruns and get people out. Why is it this team needed to go into turtle/conservative mode and regress? And I don't care what anyone says, replacing Cruz, Miller, and Cakes with castoffs is regression. I also heard a lot this winter about how getting Wieters, Davis, and Machado back full time will offset losing those players. How is that working out so far?

When you have a golden and last shot opp to win a WS and to give Oriole fans something they have not had in 30 years, you go for it. You do your best to win. You don't revert back to old ways and methods and HOPE things work out. You put the best team out there and if it doesn't work? At least you tried. We didn't try. We capitulated.

Have you actually watched any of the last three seasons? And come away with no appreciation for the tremendous work done by the organization to get there, though? None? Zero? No possible thought that maybe DD and Buck know a little bit more about building a long term winning organization than you do? When the injured players come back and start burning it up, and the starting pitching is straightened a bit, and we are winning games hand over fist, then we likely won't be hearing much of these kinds of sentiments.

[Can_of_corn]

I am not sure how giving two expensive, but not otherwordly expensive, contracts to two elite players is a bad thing?? Miller imo for sure will live up to every penny of that contact and then some. Cruz? I think he has this year and for sure next year to be as good as he has been, and after that it is more or a crapshoot. But his contract isn't that bad. Certainly not bad enough where you could say it would prevent the team from doing anything those last two years as far as free agents, trades, or signing their own. That is an excuse that I do not buy.

Have you ever looked at Miller's career numbers?

Had you even heard of Miller before last season?

[weams]

Well, I agree.

It only takes one. Thanks.

[DrungoHazewood]

I am not sure how giving two expensive, but not otherwordly expensive, contracts to two elite players is a bad thing?? Miller imo for sure will live up to every penny of that contact and then some. Cruz? I think he has this year and for sure next year to be as good as he has been, and after that it is more or a crapshoot. But his contract isn't that bad. Certainly not bad enough where you could say it would prevent the team from doing anything those last two years as far as free agents, trades, or signing their own. That is an excuse that I do not buy.

You keep saying that Cruz and Miller are elite players. That's an extremely subjective term. And it's hard for me to accept when Cruz was worth about 4 wins total from 2011-13, and Miller has been worth (by the more optimistic methods of valuation) 5 wins for his entire career. To me elite means MVP candidate, Cy Young candidate, 5, 6, 7-win players. Even last year Cruz + Miller was worth about as much as Adam Jones, and far less than real MVP candidates.

[weams]

Have you ever looked at Miller's career numbers?

Had you even heard of Miller before last season?

I was and am a huge Andrew Miller fan. Off and on over a couple years I found him to be devastatingly effective. For a brief spell. Injury and regression prevented him from being a star. He is now paid as one. And is performing as one.

[DrungoHazewood]

Have you ever looked at Miller's career numbers?

Had you even heard of Miller before last season?

There really are a lot of folks who weight last seasons' performance at about 95% when projecting things forward. And we know guys on this board who see otherworldly spike years as just a interim stop to immortality.

[weams]

You keep saying that Cruz and Miller are elite players. That's an extremely subjective term. And it's hard for me to accept when Cruz was worth about 4 wins total from 2011-13, and Miller has been worth (by the more optimistic methods of valuation) 5 wins for his entire career. To me elite means MVP candidate, Cy Young candidate, 5, 6, 7 players. Even last year Cruz + Miller was worth about as much as Adam Jones, and far less than real MVP candidates.

A much better choice for those words would be Joe Nathan and Josh Hamilton from 2013. Absolutely Elite.

[Can_of_corn]

I was and am a huge Andrew Miller fan. Off and on over a couple years I found him to be devastatingly effective. For a brief spell. Injury and regression prevented him from being a star. He is now paid as one. And is performing as one.

I don't recall you or anyone else suggesting the O's trade for him at any point before the trade talks starting heating up last season.

And now he is the Kwisatz Haderach.

[DrungoHazewood]

Have you actually watched any of the last three seasons? And come away with no appreciation for the tremendous work done by the organization to get there, though? None? Zero? No possible thought that maybe DD and Buck know a little bit more about building a long term winning organization than you do? When the injured players come back and start burning it up, and the starting pitching is straightened a bit, and we are winning games hand over fist, then we likely won't be hearing much of these kinds of sentiments.

Industrial Light and Magic. The Wizard of Oz. Pixar Studios. It's just a matter of time before someone peels away the curtain and sees that Duquette and Buck are claymation models and the whole gig is up.

[islandecho]

So last night you would have rather brought Matusz in than Miller? Miller has given up 2 hits in 7.1 innings with 15 strikeouts. No earned runs. Miller comes in last night statistics show he is almost a certainty to get out of the inning with no runs. There is no way to quantify it but we can estimate with Miller?s lights out statistics this year we may have 3 to 4 more wins with Miller coming out of the pen. We are paying 1.2 million less for the combined Hunter Matusz combination than Miller. Hunter Matusz is costing us 7.8 million, a whopping 1.2 million less than to would have been to keep Miller. How much more are we going to pay for bullpen help to cover the loss of Miller? We gave up a top prospect for the guy I said had the best stuff of any reliever in O's history. If the O's wanted to go for the ultimate prize you are going to have spend money. Why not spend it on the arguably the best reliever in all of baseball. His statistics are insane. Lastly there is a pattern by the Angelos apologists of personal attacks on posters that disagree with them. Please be professional and try to carry on a logical debate.

Exactly. People think pitchers with stuff like Millers grows on trees. It doesn't. He is worth every penny of that contract. EVERY penny. We win last night and at least one other game this year already with Miller pitching. How much does that effect the teams psyche? Instead of a 5 game losing streak they play have a win and some momo. And having that confidence knowing that if they have a lead going into the 7th inning is HUGE. Just a giant confidence builder and an extreme moral deflator for the opposing team, who knows they have to have a lead going into the late innings or odds are 99% they lose. Do you know what kind of pressure that puts on other teams? How that effects performance? THAT is what I mean about having guys like Miller and Cruz cannot just be measured by pure numbers alone.

[CA-ORIOLE]

The Orioles problem is the starting pitchers have sucked. Cruz/Miller wouldn't solve this.

Chemistry and synergy.

[islandecho]

Have you ever looked at Miller's career numbers?

Had you even heard of Miller before last season?

I've seen Miller pitch last year and this year. That is all I need to see. He is LIGHTS OUT.

[Crazysilver03]

Exactly. People think pitchers with stuff like Millers grows on trees. It doesn't. He is worth every penny of that contract. EVERY penny. We win last night and at least one other game this year already with Miller pitching. How much does that effect the teams psyche? Instead of a 5 game losing streak they play have a win and some momo. And having that confidence knowing that if they have a lead going into the 7th inning is HUGE. Just a giant confidence builder and an extreme moral deflator for the opposing team, who knows they have to have a lead going into the late innings or odds are 99% they lose. Do you know what kind of pressure that puts on other teams? How that effects performance? THAT is what I mean about having guys like Miller and Cruz cannot just be measured by pure numbers alone.

And you simply assume that Miller adds 2 wins to this team. But newsflash, the makeup of this team is vastly different if Miller and Cruz are brought back so their is no true way to judge where we would be this year with them.

[Can_of_corn]

Exactly. People think pitchers with stuff like Millers grows on trees. It doesn't. He is worth every penny of that contract. EVERY penny. We win last night and at least one other game this year already with Miller pitching. How much does that effect the teams psyche? Instead of a 5 game losing streak they play have a win and some momo. And having that confidence knowing that if they have a lead going into the 7th inning is HUGE. Just a giant confidence builder and an extreme moral deflator for the opposing team, who knows they have to have a lead going into the late innings or odds are 99% they lose. Do you know what kind of pressure that puts on other teams? How that effects performance? THAT is what I mean about having guys like Miller and Cruz cannot just be measured by pure numbers alone.

How do they win last night if they have miller? Even if Miller was there and shut down Boston that doesn't mean the O's still would have scored in the eight.