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This is A Mess (Mega RANT Thread)


eddie83

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Can we blame him for doing stuff like spending 3.2 million on Matusz?

Playing devils advocate... just about $20m just this year alone on Webb (well, the comp pick) Wright, DeAza, E. Cabrera, Matusz, Hunter, Young. I feel like I'm forgetting somebody...

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Demand seemed low.

Yeah, that was my general impression as well. I just don't think an 8.8 mil BOR guy with questionable stuff and peripherals was going to have people knocking down the doors with valuable players in return. 15 wins and career year or not. As much as I was for trading him off myself in the offseason, GM's just aren't as dumb as they used to be.

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Playing devils advocate... just about $20m just this year alone on Webb (well, the comp pick) Wright, DeAza, E. Cabrera, Matusz, Hunter, Young. I feel like I'm forgetting somebody...

I do feel better about that, than, say being stuck with a Ryan Howard type contract

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Yeah, that was my general impression as well. I just don't think an 8.8 mil BOR guy with questionable stuff and peripherals was going to have people knocking down the doors with valuable players in return. 15 wins or not. As much as I was for trading him off myself in the offseason. GM's just aren't as dumb as they used to be.

As strange as it sounds, I was and still am more frustrated with the $20m I mentioned above, and to an extend the Hardy extension, than Buds $8.8M

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As strange as it sounds, I was and still am more frustrated with the $20m I mentioned above, and to an extend the Hardy extension, than Buds $8.8M

Well, I didn't care for Young and Matusz. I guess I was in the minority being fine with De Aza. Ok with Cabrera as I think most people were and indifferent about Hunter. Definitely goof with Hardy though.

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I believe DD is an above average GM who has had a bad year. We probably should have let him go to Toronto. Demanding players or management stay where they are when they want to be somewhere else never works. Do I believe he is distracted or tanking? No. But do I believe he's pissed at Orioles ownership and isn't going the extra mile, beating the bushes, working 16 hours a day? Ya. The really bad thing about this situation is that if we don't provide Buck with a competitive team next year, at his age, he might just decide to retire. So, where are we then? Back to the dark ages?

The real bottom line is that this organization has never been fully committed to winning. If they were, they would have laughed at Toronto, given DD more money and the same title as was offered. As part of doing that, they would have committed to him that we'll also match Toronto's budget. But, we are looking at losing Chen, Weiters, Davis, DD and Buck. The fish rots from the head.

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We're missing an impact bat and a bullpen arm and it shows. With the starters on this team you need 3 All Star level relievers to contend. We're one short.

Wasn't there a pressbox article like 10 days ago that declared that every complaint about the offseason was a rash decision? Boy does that look dumb.

DD had a horrible offseason. You could have sold me on not bringing back any of the FA's but not when Travis Snider is your big acquisition. And that trade looks horrible now. Tarpley is killing.

This team needs a "professional hitter" that has gap to gap power and works the pitcher. Also another reliever to pair with O'day and Britton.

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DFA Norris, call up Michael Bowden (1.96 ERA, 1.036 WHIP at AAA)

DFA Hunter, call up Oliver Drake (0.64 ERA, 0.821 WHIP at AAA)

DFA Matusz, call up Cesar Cabral (2.22 ERA, 1.192 WHIP at AAA)

Relegate Roe to mop up duty until he gets his act in order again. If not, he needs to be dropped. His last few outings:

5 IP, 6 ER, 7 SO, 3 BB, 8 H over 4 outings good for a 10.80 ERA.

As for offense, we have too many platoon members at this point.

Reimold and Snider

Pearce and Parmelee

Paredes and ???

It's really hindering our roster flexibility. I also don't think Schoop is going to be much for the O's offensively. Think we rushed him back and he's now causing a roster crunch.

For Kevin Gausman, Duquette and Buck royally screwed him up. He should have never been in the pen this year. We stunted his growth and already lost nearly 4 months of development time. He doesn't have a useful curve or slider. So when his fastball control suffers he really can't rely on anything .

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Yeah, that was my general impression as well. I just don't think an 8.8 mil BOR guy with questionable stuff and peripherals was going to have people knocking down the doors with valuable players in return. 15 wins and career year or not. As much as I was for trading him off myself in the offseason, GM's just aren't as dumb as they used to be.

That's funny and true!

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I believe DD is an above average GM who has had a bad year. We probably should have let him go to Toronto. Demanding players or management stay where they are when they want to be somewhere else never works. Do I believe he is distracted or tanking? No. But do I believe he's pissed at Orioles ownership and isn't going the extra mile, beating the bushes, working 16 hours a day? Ya. The really bad thing about this situation is that if we don't provide Buck with a competitive team next year, at his age, he might just decide to retire. So, where are we then? Back to the dark ages?

The real bottom line is that this organization has never been fully committed to winning. If they were, they would have laughed at Toronto, given DD more money and the same title as was offered. As part of doing that, they would have committed to him that we'll also match Toronto's budget. But, we are looking at losing Chen, Weiters, Davis, DD and Buck. The fish rots from the head.

The fish does not rot from the head. Our GM has burned through plenty of resources in his time here from our farm system and the draft for guys like Norris, Snider, Miller rental, dumping Webb and spent $Ms this offseason on guys like De Aza, Cabrera, etc. Our GM has not lacked for assets or ownership support.

IMO, in his time here, DD has failed to supplement the core he inherited (Manny, Hardy, Jones, Davis, Tillman, Britton, O'Day, Schoop, Wieters, etc) with any quality long term contributors besides Chen and MiGon. And he failed to deal guys like Hardy, Wieters, Davis when they were at peak value (as requested by some posters) - there have been no moves where DD took advantage of any offer to deal a major leaguer for a quality minor league prospect - all moves (save dealing JJohnson and letting Cruz and Markakis walk) have been done moving the talent on the 25 man roster forward.

DD hit pure short term gold with guys like McClouth, Pearce, Paredes and signing Cruz though he was incredibly lucky the Balfour signing fell apart. Bundy should have contributed in his time here so DD has been unfortunate with that injury - a big under-rated loss for DD IMO.

Still, if not for a terrible first half from Tillman (I believe Norris numbers in Baltimore are near his below average career numbers before Bmore), this team could be several games better and not far off the pace despite the collection of moves involving De Aza, ECab, DYoung, Webb and Snider not panning out well at all (at a cost of $Ms and a high draft pick and essentially a couple of third rounders!). We'll see what happens from here, but the issues facing the organization during this poor streak of results is not because DD has been wanting for assets (the fish does not rot at the head).

Hopefully, the SP gets things together and team can turn this around. If not, and additional losing continues, I hope our GM can take advantage of the lack of sellers in the market to deal Chen and Wieters. I wonder what Seattle would give up for Wieters to replace Zunino.

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The fish does not rot from the head. Our GM has burned through plenty of resources in his time here from our farm system and the draft for guys like Norris, Snider, Miller rental, dumping Webb and spent $Ms this offseason on guys like De Aza, Cabrera, etc. Our GM has not lacked for assets or ownership support.

IMO, in his time here, DD has failed to supplement the core he inherited (Manny, Hardy, Jones, Davis, Tillman, Britton, O'Day, Schoop, Wieters, etc) with any quality long term contributors besides Chen and MiGon. And he failed to deal guys like Hardy, Wieters, Davis when they were at peak value (as requested by some posters) - there have been no moves where DD took advantage of any offer to deal a major leaguer for a quality minor league prospect - all moves (save dealing JJohnson and letting Cruz and Markakis walk) have been done moving the talent on the 25 man roster forward.

DD hit pure short term gold with guys like McClouth, Pearce, Paredes and signing Cruz though he was incredibly lucky the Balfour signing fell apart. Bundy should have contributed in his time here so DD has been unfortunate with that injury - a big under-rated loss for DD IMO.

Still, if not for a terrible first half from Tillman (I believe Norris numbers in Baltimore are near his below average career numbers before Bmore), this team could be several games better and not far off the pace despite the collection of moves involving De Aza, ECab, DYoung, Webb and Snider not panning out well at all (at a cost of $Ms and a high draft pick and essentially a couple of third rounders!). We'll see what happens from here, but the issues facing the organization during this poor streak of results is not because DD has been wanting for assets (the fish does not rot at the head).

Hopefully, the SP gets things together and team can turn this around. If not, and additional losing continues, I hope our GM can take advantage of the lack of sellers in the market to deal Chen and Wieters. I wonder what Seattle would give up for Wieters to replace Zunino.

Really good thoughts here.

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The fish does not rot from the head. Our GM has burned through plenty of resources in his time here from our farm system and the draft for guys like Norris, Snider, Miller rental, dumping Webb and spent $Ms this offseason on guys like De Aza, Cabrera, etc. Our GM has not lacked for assets or ownership support.

IMO, in his time here, DD has failed to supplement the core he inherited (Manny, Hardy, Jones, Davis, Tillman, Britton, O'Day, Schoop, Wieters, etc) with any quality long term contributors besides Chen and MiGon. And he failed to deal guys like Hardy, Wieters, Davis when they were at peak value (as requested by some posters) - there have been no moves where DD took advantage of any offer to deal a major leaguer for a quality minor league prospect - all moves (save dealing JJohnson and letting Cruz and Markakis walk) have been done moving the talent on the 25 man roster forward.

DD hit pure short term gold with guys like McClouth, Pearce, Paredes and signing Cruz though he was incredibly lucky the Balfour signing fell apart. Bundy should have contributed in his time here so DD has been unfortunate with that injury - a big under-rated loss for DD IMO.

Still, if not for a terrible first half from Tillman (I believe Norris numbers in Baltimore are near his below average career numbers before Bmore), this team could be several games better and not far off the pace despite the collection of moves involving De Aza, ECab, DYoung, Webb and Snider not panning out well at all (at a cost of $Ms and a high draft pick and essentially a couple of third rounders!). We'll see what happens from here, but the issues facing the organization during this poor streak of results is not because DD has been wanting for assets (the fish does not rot at the head).

Hopefully, the SP gets things together and team can turn this around. If not, and additional losing continues, I hope our GM can take advantage of the lack of sellers in the market to deal Chen and Wieters. I wonder what Seattle would give up for Wieters to replace Zunino.

This is the only point I disagree on. The rest is spot on. Good post!

Trading Chen and Wieters would be huge and we'd esentially be throwing in the towel. I don't think it will come ANYWHERE near that desperate. DD will do something by the deadline. a couple somethings. See where it goes from there. Still the August deadline and September callups.

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The fish does not rot from the head. Our GM has burned through plenty of resources in his time here from our farm system and the draft for guys like Norris, Snider, Miller rental, dumping Webb and spent $Ms this offseason on guys like De Aza, Cabrera, etc. Our GM has not lacked for assets or ownership support.

IMO, in his time here, DD has failed to supplement the core he inherited (Manny, Hardy, Jones, Davis, Tillman, Britton, O'Day, Schoop, Wieters, etc) with any quality long term contributors besides Chen and MiGon. And he failed to deal guys like Hardy, Wieters, Davis when they were at peak value (as requested by some posters) - there have been no moves where DD took advantage of any offer to deal a major leaguer for a quality minor league prospect - all moves (save dealing JJohnson and letting Cruz and Markakis walk) have been done moving the talent on the 25 man roster forward.

DD hit pure short term gold with guys like McClouth, Pearce, Paredes and signing Cruz though he was incredibly lucky the Balfour signing fell apart. Bundy should have contributed in his time here so DD has been unfortunate with that injury - a big under-rated loss for DD IMO.

Still, if not for a terrible first half from Tillman (I believe Norris numbers in Baltimore are near his below average career numbers before Bmore), this team could be several games better and not far off the pace despite the collection of moves involving De Aza, ECab, DYoung, Webb and Snider not panning out well at all (at a cost of $Ms and a high draft pick and essentially a couple of third rounders!). We'll see what happens from here, but the issues facing the organization during this poor streak of results is not because DD has been wanting for assets (the fish does not rot at the head).

Hopefully, the SP gets things together and team can turn this around. If not, and additional losing continues, I hope our GM can take advantage of the lack of sellers in the market to deal Chen and Wieters. I wonder what Seattle would give up for Wieters to replace Zunino.

It makes you wonder about his real motivation for pursuing the Toronto job. Was Duquette interested in the job because it was a promotion or did he just want to get out of dodge before the house of cards falls apart?

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I believe DD is an above average GM who has had a bad year.

I think Duquette executed a reasonable plan that has been hung up at times by underperforming players. It happens. You're not going to win 95 games every year with a set, mid-range budget and a minor league system that's been less than stellar.

But having said that, let's wait until September to indict the plan and the execution.

We probably should have let him go to Toronto. Demanding players or management stay where they are when they want to be somewhere else never works. Do I believe he is distracted or tanking? No. But do I believe he's pissed at Orioles ownership and isn't going the extra mile, beating the bushes, working 16 hours a day? Ya. The really bad thing about this situation is that if we don't provide Buck with a competitive team next year, at his age, he might just decide to retire. So, where are we then? Back to the dark ages?

I tend to throw all that in to the wacky speculation bucket. If Tillman and Norris pitched like it was 2014 there would be little or no discussion about how Duquette doesn't like Baltimore and isn't trying. Setting aside the soap opera stuff and focusing on facts I think '15 looks a lot like '12-14.

The real bottom line is that this organization has never been fully committed to winning. If they were, they would have laughed at Toronto, given DD more money and the same title as was offered. As part of doing that, they would have committed to him that we'll also match Toronto's budget. But, we are looking at losing Chen, Weiters, Davis, DD and Buck. The fish rots from the head.

Of course your definition of "committed to winning" is basically "spending quite a bit more money than they are now." Has nothing to do with maximizing wins within the constraints of reality.

What fish is rotting from what head? The O's are in a slump, a couple games out of first, but positioned to be able to compete late in the year. Machado, Jones, Schoop, Britton, JJ... all here next year and for years after that if they want them. Davis will be gone, but he's on pace for a 2-win season. Wieters is splitting time with Joseph because his production hasn't merited more.

You act like they're 35-55 and losing the core of of the team next year. I guess I've just moved on from the part of my life/fandom where the only two possible states of a team are rotting or celebrating a championship.

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