Can't win with a bunch of # 3 # 4 types

[ChuckS]

What do you think the FO should do? As a mid market team what are the options when coveted free agents hit the market?

Choose wisely. Always risk involved.

But I rather risk being great than play it safe and hope to get lucky and sneak into the playoffs. We have the core in place, but no help on the way. NOW is the time to spend. SP and Corner OF are the two biggest areas of need so fill those with impact players. Some combination of Walker/Mancini/Pearce can man 1B.

[TINSTAAPP]

We have to draft TOR guys.

We have a guy with TOR talent and Buck and Dan completely screwed up his development.

[ChuckS]

We have a guy with TOR talent and Buck and Dan completely screwed up his development.

I don't buy this. SP are at their biggest advantage when they first come into the league and no one has seen them. Very hittable fastball (kind of like Nathan Eovaldi), his command is spotty, and his breaking ball is a work in progress. Maybe he can develop into a reliable TOR guy but the real good ones tend to be dominate from the start (Jose Fernandez, Matt Harvey, Sonny Grey, and the like). Have we seen Gausman even string together two or three starts where he has completely shut down the opposition?

If you want to see a guy that was yo-yo'd around look at what the Twins did to Johan Santana early in his career. He turned out alright.

[25 Nuggets]

Choose wisely. Always risk involved.

But I rather risk being great than play it safe and hope to get lucky and sneak into the playoffs. We have the core in place, but no help on the way. NOW is the time to spend. SP and Corner OF are the two biggest areas of need so fill those with impact players. Some combination of Walker/Mancini/Pearce can man 1B.

I'd rather have Davis back instead of the new corner OF in that I think Walker/Mancini/Pearce would create an area of need at 1B. But I agree, now is the time to spend. If the Orioles try to address their needs in-house, they go backwards in 2016. If they don't invest, they should rebuild.

[MemorialStadKid]

What do you think the FO should do? As a mid market team what are the options when coveted free agents hit the market?

We should throw a good chunk of our resources into revamping our scouting and development system. Then we should hit the international markets hard.

There's DR, Cuba (soon), Puerto Rico, Venezuela, Columbia, Netherlands, Japan, China, Taiwan, Korea and plenty of college options in NCAA division II and III.

If they don't want to spend the big bucks on proven free agents, they should do whatever they can to identify cheap talent and pack the farm solid so they can make some serious trades when the time comes (like Toronto just did).

Why didn't we make any real moves on the trade market? We needed pitching. Parra is a good player but he's a RF, not a SP.

Sure, we don't have NYY or Boston money, but neither does the Cardinals and they make things happen year after year. Does KC have a lot of money? I don't think so. But they went and got the right talent at the right time.

WE did not.

So in the end, if we can't spend money on FAs, we need to develop talent slowly but surely. That isn't happening either.

Something's gotta give.

MSK

[MDtransplant757]

I'd rather have Davis back instead of the new corner OF in that I think Walker/Mancini/Pearce would create an area of need at 1B. But I agree, now is the time to spend. If the Orioles try to address their needs in-house, they go backwards in 2016. If they don't invest, they should rebuild.

Idk if we should resign davis. I think Christian walker can be good at 1B, steve pearce shouldn't be playing here next year, and Mancini needs 1 more year at AAA IMO.

[Tryptamine]

Trying to build through pitching is an act of futility. The highest success rate in the amateur draft is college bats. It's much easier to build a farm drafting bats and then using any excess bats to trade for mlb proven pitchers.

[SteveO]

Idk if we should resign davis. I think Christian walker can be good at 1B, steve pearce shouldn't be playing here next year, and Mancini needs 1 more year at AAA IMO.

I would take 1 Steve Pearce over 5 Christian Walkers.

Walker is barely doing a credible job at AAA. .252/.321/.412 with an OPS of .733 . Nothing about him screams to me those numbers get much better at the next level. Steve Pearce on the other hand can certainly exceed them. No problem giving him a look or letting him compete in ST but Walker is not a MLB 1st basemen solution IMO. He is a guy you could plug in for a week or two if you have an injury at best to me.

[Frobby]

At the end of the day, we have no choice but to try to develop our own starters, even if we've had some bad experience with it. We just don't have the budget to build a staff through free agent acquisitions. At most we can pay 1-2 guys at FA prices. One of those spots went to Ubaldo, who has underproduced his contract so far. We're losing Chen, who has been a huge bargain for us. That leaves us in a tight spot. I want them to replace Chen with someone as good or better, but that's going to cost more than $15 mm/yr compared to the $4-5 mm we've been paying Chen. And the price of Tillman and Gonzalez will increase even though neither is having a good year.

We need to hope Gausman continues to develop and that we get some value from Wright, Wilson and Bundy. It'd be nice to have EdRod and Davies in the fold, but that's water under the bridge.

[bpilktree]

They are just too inconsistent. We truly caught lightning in a bottle last season. Tillman, Gonzo, and Norris all had career years and were bound for regression.

With no impact SP on the horizon we need to throw some money at one of the aces on the market this offseason. Sign David Price (7/175) and a mid-tier OF like Fowler or Parra (4/45) and call it a day.

Let everyone else walk. With the money coming off the books we would still be under budget with these signings and can work on a long term contract for Manny. No more patch work. Let's fix the holes with some permanent solutions and it starts with filling the biggest one.

I completely disgree with this statement that they all had career years. Norris I do believe did but we saw him as a number 5 and many assumed he would be out of the rotation by July with Gaumsman taking over. However Gonzo and Tilman have been solid each of the last three seasons. This is their worst year for both of them.

Gonzo

2012 105 IP 92 H 13 HR 35 BB 77K 1.21 Whip 3.25 ERA 2.9 War

2013 171 IP 157 H 24 HR 53 BB 120K 1.23 Whip 3.78 ERA 2.0 War

2014 159 IP 155 H 25 HR 51 BB 111K 1.30 Whip 3.23 ERA 2.1 War

2015 131 IP 134 H 23 HR 43 BB 102K 1.35 Whip 4.73 ERA 0.3 War

This year is the outlier not last season.

Tilman

2012 86 IP 66 H 12 HR 24 BB 66k 1.05 WHip 2.93 ERA 1.5 WAr pitched less then half a season

2013 206 IP 184 H 33 HR 68 BB 179K 1.22 WHIp 3.71 ERA 4.4 WAR

2014 207 IP 189 H 21 HR 66 BB 150k 1.23 WHip 3.34 ERA 2.4 War

2015 129 IP 124 H 14 HR 47 BB 91 K 1.32 Whip 4.51 ERA .5 WAr

Again the outlier is this season and the norm is in the middle of the previous three seasons.

[SteveO]

At the end of the day, we have no choice but to try to develop our own starters, even if we've had some bad experience with it. We just don't have the budget to build a staff through free agent acquisitions. At most we can pay 1-2 guys at FA prices. One of those spots went to Ubaldo, who has underproduced his contract so far. We're losing Chen, who has been a huge bargain for us. That leaves us in a tight spot. I want them to replace Chen with someone as good or better, but that's going to cost more than $15 mm/yr compared to the $4-5 mm we've been paying Chen. And the price of Tillman and Gonzalez will increase even though neither is having a good year.

We need to hope Gausman continues to develop and that we get some value from Wright, Wilson and Bundy. It'd be nice to have EdRod and Davies in the fold, but that's water under the bridge.

Agree completely here. I do think there is signs that things are progressing somewhat in terms of pitching development. Its hard to hang the Bundy and Harvey injuries on the team, injuries happen. I still think that both those guys while set back some in terms of development, still have some potential to impact this team at some point. Only time will tell.

Seeing guys like Wright, Wilson, and Givens come up and contribute at times is encouraging to me also. I feel like we are starting to collect the kind of pieces somewhat consistently that you need to surround those TOR guys with, we just lack that TOR type guy. Hopefully KG, Harvey, Bundy or perhaps someone else fills that role.

[sportsfan8703]

I completely disgree with this statement that they all had career years. Norris I do believe did but we saw him as a number 5 and many assumed he would be out of the rotation by July with Gaumsman taking over. However Gonzo and Tilman have been solid each of the last three seasons. This is their worst year for both of them.

Gonzo

2012 105 IP 92 H 13 HR 35 BB 77K 1.21 Whip 3.25 ERA 2.9 War

2013 171 IP 157 H 24 HR 53 BB 120K 1.23 Whip 3.78 ERA 2.0 War

2014 159 IP 155 H 25 HR 51 BB 111K 1.30 Whip 3.23 ERA 2.1 War

2015 131 IP 134 H 23 HR 43 BB 102K 1.35 Whip 4.73 ERA 0.3 War

This year is the outlier not last season.

Tilman

2012 86 IP 66 H 12 HR 24 BB 66k 1.05 WHip 2.93 ERA 1.5 WAr pitched less then half a season

2013 206 IP 184 H 33 HR 68 BB 179K 1.22 WHIp 3.71 ERA 4.4 WAR

2014 207 IP 189 H 21 HR 66 BB 150k 1.23 WHip 3.34 ERA 2.4 War

2015 129 IP 124 H 14 HR 47 BB 91 K 1.32 Whip 4.51 ERA .5 WAr

Again the outlier is this season and the norm is in the middle of the previous three seasons.

Great post. We all know the ceiling of this team is all about Gausman, Bundy and Harvey becoming TOR guys. Even if we just get one we're going to be in the hunt for awhile. Gausman needs to go lights out the rest of the year. No more excuses. No more yanking him around.