TT: The most productive Oriole in their history could surprise you!

[Just Regular]

It's fun to look at Rochester from this era for another angle on how amazing our talent was in those days.

At age 20, he destroys AAA in half a season to the tune of 383/503/570. He does get some 1970 callup and has Troutian scuffle.

So what happens next year? Davey Johnson's still around, so Grich repeats AAA.

One of the soft arguments in Edgar Martinez's HOF case is the Mariners kept him down too long - Grich advocates can say the same thing.

[DrungoHazewood]

Drungo is having an orgasm right now.

Have you been dipping into the Christmas punch early?!?

It's a horrendous oversight that he isn't in the HOF.

It's... well... they didn't know any better until after he was dropped from the BBWAA ballot. His triple crown numbers and counting stats weren't awesome, and his combination of OBP and defense was under-appreciated. I hope some kind of Vet's Committee will eventually put him in, while he's still alive.

Derek Jeter is worried about his first ballot coronation. Same careers.

Same career if all you're looking at is on-field value during the regular season. Kind of like how you can be a little underwhelmed by some of Cal's numbers if you totally ignore his streak and his character and personality and leadership and defensive metrics.

I can't think of a player whose WAR totals are so far out of line with his conventional stats. Grich never batted over .278 in a full season with us, never had more than 19 homers, had only one season over 60 RBI, and never scored 100 runs.

It really comes down to his value is driven by on-base skills and defense, which can be overlooked or just missed. Rabbit Maranville had 43 rWAR but a .658 OPS compiled mostly in a hitter's era. Lou Whitaker has more rWAR than Grich despite never hitting 30 homers, never driving in 100, hit .276, didn't steal many bases, only had 30 doubles three times. Alan Trammell had almost the same value as Grich with a .767 OPS, no 30-homer seasons, one 100 RBI season.

Or for that matter Brooks. Let's say Brooks played for the A's or the Cubs or somebody, never had his World Series performances. Does his .267 average, .723 OPS and 268 homers get him to waltz into Cooperstown, even with 78 rWAR?

[Tx Oriole]

Well this one got weird pretty quick.

It sure did. I do remember him.

[tntoriole]

Bobby Grich was one of my absolute favorite overall Orioles and he took over second base after Davey Johnson was traded along with Pat Dobson for Earl Williams. Johnson was another favorite of mine and he went to Atlanta and hit 43 HRs in one of the most bizarre turnarounds in one season ever. But Grich was a money clutch hitter and second base was his territory. Great player.

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[weams]

Bobby Grich was one of my absolute favorite overall Orioles and he took over second base after Davey Johnson was traded along with Pat Dobson for Earl Williams. Johnson was another favorite of mine and he went to Atlanta and hit 43 HRs in one of the most bizarre turnarounds in one season ever. But Grich was a money clutch hitter and second base was his territory. Great player.

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I really enjoyed Grich.

[brianod]

Grich was one of the best 2bs of all time, adjusted to era. By my evaluation, he ranks 11th. As for SS, he never played to my knowledge and the comparison to Jeter is specious.

[weams]

Grich was one of the best 2bs of all time, adjusted to era. By my evaluation, he ranks 11th. As for SS, he never played to my knowledge and the comparison to Jeter is specious.

Just prior to the start of spring training, Grich tried to lift a heavy air conditioner. He hurt his back and was immediately put into traction; the back problems limited him to 52 games at shortstop and a .392 slugging percentage. He continued to struggle with back pain the following season, giving Angels fans ample reason to consider him a flat-out bust.

With his career at the crossroads, Grich worked his way to a comeback. After undergoing successful spinal disk surgery—and after moving back to his accustomed position at second base—he played in 153 games.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/cooperstown-confidential-stories-of-bobby-grich/

[brianod]

Actually he ranks 10th.

Those better: Hornsby, e collins, morgan j rob, gordon, biggio, alomar and gehringer

Those just below tony phillips, sandberg, frisch, whiltaker and carew

[brianod]

http://www.hardballtimes.com/cooperstown-confidential-stories-of-bobby-grich/

like I said, he played 50+ games unsuccesfully at ss, you can't compare him to ss's but he was an awewome, underrated player at his position

[weams]

like I said, he played 50+ games unsuccesfully at ss, you can't compare him to ss's but he was an awewome, underrated player at his position

I, like many others, think Jeter was a horrible shortstop.

[FR500]

I always smiled when Chuck Thompson ALWAYS referred to him as "the young good looking Bobby Grich".

[brianod]

I, like many others, think Jeter was a horrible shortstop.

And you, like many others are wrong. Jeter was an ok ss, slightly better than average

[brianod]

And you, like many others are wrong. Jeter was an ok ss, slightly better than average

defensively that is

[Il BuonO]

And you, like many others are wrong. Jeter was an ok ss, slightly better than average

He was atrocious. DRS has him at -159 for his career. You couldn't be any more misinformed. Handing out awards to a guy doesn't make him better. He had awful range, but was often the most most popular guy on his team. A clutch performer but not even "ok" at SS.

He was better than average with the stick for most of his career, but he was no Bob Grich with the glove.

[wildcard]

I would take Frank over Grich as the most productive Oriole in history regardless of the stats.