At What Point, Do You Hold DD Accountable, If Any?

[Rene88]

Last offseason was putrid (most of us realize why).

This offseason is NOT over.

However, let's discuss how you feel as a fan if little else is done. Would you be happy? Disappointed? Apathetic? What would make you be critical of DD? Would you like to see his contract extended? What say you?

No point in being critical of DD since ultimately his hands are tied by the owner?

[paulcoates]

DD? Not much really. The owner must approve too. If Pete told DD to go sign whoever it took, I am sure DD would oblige. DD is just living within the owner's wishes

[El Gordo]

Last offseason was putrid (most of us realize why).

This offseason is NOT over.

However, let's discuss how you feel as a fan if little else is done. Would you be happy? Disappointed? Apathetic? What would make you be critical of DD? Would you like to see his contract extended? What say you?

No point in being critical of DD since ultimately his hands are tied by the owner?

Name a GM that was ever able to get PA to change his mind. Not even Pat Gillick.

[WEAVERMAN]

Last offseason was putrid (most of us realize why).

This offseason is NOT over.

However, let's discuss how you feel as a fan if little else is done. Would you be happy? Disappointed? Apathetic? What would make you be critical of DD? Would you like to see his contract extended? What say you?

No point in being critical of DD since ultimately his hands are tied by the owner?

I hold him and Angelos accountable every day. You have to question the credibility of a GM who doesn't even bother to negotiate to retain our best starter.

[NCRaven]

Accountable for? One AL East title, another playoff appearance, and no losing seasons in the last four years? That incompetent rat b*st*rd! I'm not thrilled with the void of progress since adding Trumbo and keeping O'Day, but this is silly.

[Moose Milligan]

Accountable for? One AL East title, another playoff appearance, and no losing seasons in the last four years? That incompetent rat b*st*rd! I'm not thrilled with the void of progress since adding Trumbo and keeping O'Day, but this is silly.

This is pretty much where I'm at. I don't forget how dark the times were before DD, he's a large part of what's happened since.

DD strikes me as a guy who's happy to stand pat when he doesn't like what he sees on the table. That sucks as a fan because there's not much else to get excited about....but if he believes that to be the best strategy moving forward, that's fine. I can't fault someone for not wanting to make what they perceive to be a not smart move.

[LookitsPuck]

DD? Not much really. The owner must approve too. If Pete told DD to go sign whoever it took, I am sure DD would oblige. DD is just living within the owner's wishes

Ehhh, Peter Angelos didn't gut the farm system. Peter Angelos didn't try running to Toronto with more than half his contract still in effect. Peter Angelos didn't sign Ubaldo Jimenez for 4 years. Peter Angelos didn't say that OBP is a top priority of this club...only not make a dent into it whatsoever over his tenure.

Now, what Peter Angelos didn't do? Invest properly in the Cuban market. We have a bunch of dimes when everyone else is getting dollars. If you're going to screw the farm system...you need to do whatever possible to infuse the minors (and eventually the majors with impact talent. The Cubs do this. Why the hell can't the O's?

Also, what Peter Angelos isn't doing is drafting top starting pitcher prospects...only to have every.single.one.of.them fizzle out and/or never make it (or get traded away for relievers or blah outfielders). The last bastion of hope at this point is Kevin Gausman. So what is Duquette doing to do a better job there? Stock it full of AAAA pitchers? Because we don't have any impact arms that aren't hurt or have huge question marks surrounding them because of injury.

Listen, I love that we had 4 years of .500 or better ball under Dan Duquette. But this club was largely architected by Andy MacPhail. I don't want to sell Duquette short as he's done a fine job of finding some diamonds in the rough over the years...but his drafts have been so-so, development under him has been so-so, trades have been bad and his free agent signings have been all over the map.

This offseason and draft is going to define Duquette going forward. It's going to show the baseball world what he can/can't do a mediocre core and a bunch of draft picks with a payroll well over $100m. Because it looks damn bleak right now.

This offseason is a $9m DH in Trumbo, a who knows OF in Kim, a resign of O'Day and a dammitican'tbelieveheacceptedtheQO Matt Wieters....oh and Vance Worley. And a bunch of fringey mehs. I am worried about this club. As constructed they're lucky to win 72.

[Roll Tide]

Ehhh, Peter Angelos didn't gut the farm system. Peter Angelos didn't try running to Toronto with more than half his contract still in effect. Peter Angelos didn't sign Ubaldo Jimenez for 4 years. Peter Angelos didn't say that OBP is a top priority of this club...only not make a dent into it whatsoever over his tenure.

Now, what Peter Angelos didn't do? Invest properly in the Cuban market. We have a bunch of dimes when everyone else is getting dollars. If you're going to screw the farm system...you need to do whatever possible to infuse the minors (and eventually the majors with impact talent. The Cubs do this. Why the hell can't the O's?

Also, what Peter Angelos isn't doing is drafting top starting pitcher prospects...only to have every.single.one.of.them fizzle out and/or never make it (or get traded away for relievers or blah outfielders). The last bastion of hope at this point is Kevin Gausman. So what is Duquette doing to do a better job there? Stock it full of AAAA pitchers? Because we don't have any impact arms that aren't hurt or have huge question marks surrounding them because of injury.

Listen, I love that we had 4 years of .500 or better ball under Dan Duquette. But this club was largely architected by Andy MacPhail. I don't want to sell Duquette short as he's done a fine job of finding some diamonds in the rough over the years...but his drafts have been so-so, development under him has been so-so, trades have been bad and his free agent signings have been all over the map.

This offseason and draft is going to define Duquette going forward. It's going to show the baseball world what he can/can't do a mediocre core and a bunch of draft picks with a payroll well over $100m. Because it looks damn bleak right now.

This offseason is a $9m DH in Trumbo, a who knows OF in Kim, a resign of O'Day and a dammitican'tbelieveheacceptedtheQO Matt Wieters....oh and Vance Worley. And a bunch of fringey mehs. I am worried about this club. As constructed they're lucky to win 72.

I agree with nearly everything you say here except the 1st sentence. The Orioles farm system has sucked nearly the whole time Angelos was owner.

[Crazysilver03]

Ehhh, Peter Angelos didn't gut the farm system. Peter Angelos didn't try running to Toronto with more than half his contract still in effect. Peter Angelos didn't sign Ubaldo Jimenez for 4 years. Peter Angelos didn't say that OBP is a top priority of this club...only not make a dent into it whatsoever over his tenure.

This offseason is a $9m DH in Trumbo, a who knows OF in Kim, a resign of O'Day and a dammitican'tbelieveheacceptedtheQO Matt Wieters....oh and Vance Worley. And a bunch of fringey mehs. I am worried about this club. As constructed they're lucky to win 72.

Since when does trading three pitching prospects over 4 pitching prospects over 3 years constitute a "gutting" of the farm system?

And technically yes, Angelos did sign Ubaldo to a 4 year contract.

[UpstateNYfan]

A quick reminder for all that thrive on negativity. The O's have won more games than any of their AL East opponents over the last 4 years.

[DrungoHazewood]

Accountable for? One AL East title, another playoff appearance, and no losing seasons in the last four years? That incompetent rat b*st*rd! I'm not thrilled with the void of progress since adding Trumbo and keeping O'Day, but this is silly.

From an organization that had zero winning seasons in the 14 years prior to his arrival. I know it's popular to talk about accountability and not accepting failure and expecting excellence and this stuff, but sports is a zero-sum game. But we're fans who have little or no influcence over how the team is run, so us holding Duquette or Angelos accountable is a fiction, it's a conceit. Also, in every year the wins and losses in a league have to equal each other. Half the teams, give or take, are going to have a losing record each and every year. But fans always expect not only wins, but wins the right way that set up more wins in the future.

If you'd asked the Hangout in 2008 what they thought of a future that played out as 2012-2015 did I'd guess 30% of the board would have donated a kidney to science to get to that reality. Now that we're actually there it's a firing offense.

Look, I'm not thrilled about everything, and occasionally confused and perplexed by decisions. But I try to not let pursuit of the ideal stand in the way of enjoying the pretty good. I saw 1985-88 and 1998-2011, I know what bad baseball from a lost organization looks like. It ain't four winning seasons in four years.

[TheDirtyBird]

A quick reminder for all that thrive on negativity. The O's have won more games than any of their AL East opponents over the last 4 years.

That's great and all, but it has only lead to one ALCS where the team was swept. Any momentum they had from that season was killed by DD trying to leave for Toronto and ignoring the team he was employed by

[oriolediehard]

Why was DD not fired last year when he wanted the Toronto job and he did nothing to help the O's last off season because of the distraction?

There is no excuse for neglecting do his job last year?

[Redskins Rick]

That's great and all, but it has only lead to one ALCS where the team was swept. Any momentum they had from that season was killed by DD trying to leave for Toronto and ignoring the team he was employed by

Do you think you put too much into last season on DD?

Seriously, DD dancing with Toronto resulted in Tilly regressing as a pitcher, Hardy getting hurt and every other bad thing that happened last season.

Baseball is sometimes a simple game, and yet, an inch here, a bad hop there, makes all the difference in the world.

[DrungoHazewood]

That's great and all, but it has only lead to one ALCS where the team was swept.

Two playoff teams in four years. Once you get to the playoffs the rest is just hoping for the best. There's no substantitive difference between playoff teams that win and playoff teams that don't.