Pitching Targets

[Answerman]

Here are a few guys I would like to see us consider targeting. I never want to overpay, but I also understand you have to give up something of value.

The first category is really good young pitchers with lots of controllable years. These guys will cost the most, but would bring the most ROI. Here I would like to see us pursue Philly's Nola, Cincy's Finnegan and Atlanta's Teheran. In all three cases, they are the aces of their respective staffs, however trading them for a package of multiple prospects could speed up their rebuilding process. I would probably offer a package of Mancini, Sisco, Yaz, and Mountcastle for either. Not sure there is enough star power in our package to entice them, but we just don't have much in the way of positional prospects.

Next is young-ish pitchers who are not superstars, but could probably be our second best starter upon arrival. Here I'm looking at Milwaukee's Nelson, San Diego's Pomeranz and Philly's Hellickson.

Oakland's Gray is a wildcard for me. I really like him, but his stats this year smell of injury.

[Phantom]

Rebuilding teams are just dying to trade away their 23/4/5 year old aces for middling prospects.

Jimmy Nelson and Hellickson have a 4.91 and 4.53 FiP respectively. Ubaldo has a 4.44.

If we are going to trade for someone, he's going to have to be an older guy in the last year of his deal. Everyone knows our farm system is shot, and yet we keep shooting for the stars in these trade proposals.

[Aristotelian]

Why would any of these teams give up cost controlled young pitching? You have named the guys that these teams want to build around.

[ExileAngelos]

Rebuilding teams are just dying to trade away their 23/4/5 year old aces for middling prospects.

Jimmy Nelson and Hellickson have a 4.91 and 4.53 FiP respectively. Ubaldo has a 4.44.

If we are going to trade for someone, he's going to have to be an older guy in the last year of his deal. Everyone knows our farm system is shot, and yet we keep shooting for the stars in these trade proposals.

Yep. Another Feldman type of player. Let's just not give up a future Cy Young award winner this time.

[LookinUp]

I'm guessing it came up on this board, but the Mets are a World Series contender that needs a catcher and the O's are a team with a catcher that they're not likely to resign long term. I'd trade Wieters for Wheeler, who is young and cost controlled. We are desperate and Wheeler might just work out for us when he's healthy.

[Aglets]

I'm guessing it came up on this board, but the Mets are a World Series contender that needs a catcher and the O's are a team with a catcher that they're not likely to resign long term. I'd trade Wieters for Wheeler, who is young and cost controlled. We are desperate and Wheeler might just work out for us when he's healthy.

This is certainly a bold idea. I don't hate the idea of trading Wieters for a real difference maker.

[Tx Oriole]

Here are a few guys I would like to see us consider targeting. I never want to overpay, but I also understand you have to give up something of value.

The first category is really good young pitchers with lots of controllable years. These guys will cost the most, but would bring the most ROI. Here I would like to see us pursue Philly's Nola, Cincy's Finnegan and Atlanta's Teheran. In all three cases, they are the aces of their respective staffs, however trading them for a package of multiple prospects could speed up their rebuilding process. I would probably offer a package of Mancini, Sisco, Yaz, and Mountcastle for either. Not sure there is enough star power in our package to entice them, but we just don't have much in the way of positional prospects.

Next is young-ish pitchers who are not superstars, but could probably be our second best starter upon arrival. Here I'm looking at Milwaukee's Nelson, San Diego's Pomeranz and Philly's Hellickson.

Oakland's Gray is a wildcard for me. I really like him, but his stats this year smell of injury.

I hear what you are saying and do agree the team needs pitching. I don't think

there is enough in the minors for the O's to do very much without overpaying.

That's really hurt the teams minor leagues. It's almost damned if they do and

damned if they don't. DD has a task trying to solve the pitching problem. IMO

[Aglets]

I'd rather keep Ubaldo in the rotation than get anyone even remotely resembling Feldman. He was embarrassing.

90 innings of a 4.27 ERA (1.22 WHIP) is embarrassing? What would you call what Ubaldo is doing?

I'll grant that Feldman's numbers were not super impressive........but............

[webbrick2010]

I'm guessing it came up on this board, but the Mets are a World Series contender that needs a catcher and the O's are a team with a catcher that they're not likely to resign long term. I'd trade Wieters for Wheeler, who is young and cost controlled. We are desperate and Wheeler might just work out for us when he's healthy.

Man I love this stuff

3 of Wieters wouldn't get you Wheeler

[OFFNY]

Man I love this stuff

3 of Wieters wouldn't get you Wheeler

You're back ...... a sure sign that the Orioles are on a losing streak.

[LookitsPuck]

Rebuilding teams are just dying to trade away their 23/4/5 year old aces for middling prospects.

Jimmy Nelson and Hellickson have a 4.91 and 4.53 FiP respectively. Ubaldo has a 4.44.

If we are going to trade for someone, he's going to have to be an older guy in the last year of his deal. Everyone knows our farm system is shot, and yet we keep shooting for the stars in these trade proposals.

At some point, FIP no longer means anything.

[LookinUp]

Man I love this stuff

3 of Wieters wouldn't get you Wheeler

Wheeler has a high upside, but has an injury history and pitches for an organization with DeGrom, Syndergaard, Harvey, Matz and Colon. He may not even be one of their top 5. They also need a catcher in a bad way, both offensively and defensively.

This is exactly the type of deal that could work if the O's are comfortable that losing Wieters is acceptable.

[Phantom]

At some point, FIP no longer means anything.

As compared to what? FiP is a much, much better predictor of future performance than ERA. Have we not learned our lesson from the last two pitchers we signed who had low ERAs and high FiPs?

[LookitsPuck]

As compared to what? FiP is a much, much better predictor of future performance than ERA. Have we not learned our lesson from the last two pitchers we signed who had low ERAs and high FiPs?

I'm merely talking about Ubaldo here. Using his FIP is about as useful as using his strikeout rate. Who cares without the totality of his peripherals?

[Phantom]

I'm merely talking about Ubaldo here. Using his FIP is about as useful as using his strikeout rate. Who cares without the totality of his peripherals?

Why do you say this? His career FiP is .2 runs off his ERA. His xFip is even closer, and both of those make sense given the ballpark he played mosty in.

Even if you think he's a completely different player now, over the last three full seasons, his FiP and ERA are less than .1 apart. So why are we not expecting his numbers to regress to his FiP?