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Brady would like to see Mancini get steady at bats this season


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Can the O's contend with Mancini at DH?   There are probably different opinions within the O's organization.   Brady speaks very highly of Mancini's ability to hit.  "The guy can mash." is Brady's opinion.   So do the O's pass on Trumbo?   Let Mancini be the primary DH?  

I have wondered whether the O's would really go to the 165-170M in payroll that Trumbo would require.     Its still an open question IMO.

http://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2017/01/anderson-on-mancini-the-guy-can-mash.html

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I see what he's saying, and it seems like Mancini is ready to get ABs.  Another year in the minors, is, IMO, a waste.  I don't want to see him in the OF though.  I've advocated a DH platoon between him and Alvarez.  I'd still be good with that.  Alvarez would be an insurance policy in case Mancini struggles.  And if Mancini takes off like Brady thinks he can, all the better, you've got a dangerous (albeit expensive) LH pinch hitter on your bench most games.

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7 minutes ago, esmd said:

I see what he's saying, and it seems like Mancini is ready to get ABs.  Another year in the minors, is, IMO, a waste.  I don't want to see him in the OF though.  I've advocated a DH platoon between him and Alvarez.  I'd still be good with that.  Alvarez would be an insurance policy in case Mancini struggles.  And if Mancini takes off like Brady thinks he can, all the better, you've got a dangerous (albeit expensive) LH pinch hitter on your bench most games.

I continue to not see where Alvarez fits on this team. We have two LHH platoon outfielders right now in Kim and Smith that will need platoon partners. On top of that we need to carry a backup catcher and infielder (likely Joseph and Flaherty). As a result, we're left with two positions to be filled by the Kim and Smith platoon partners. I don't see where we have a spot on the bench for another platoon. I know DD is talking about another LHH, but I just cannot see where one fits unless that LHH is a full-time player and not a platoon bat like Alvarez...unless, you are of the opinion that Kim is that everyday player, but I don't get the sense that Buck agrees with that (Smith has clearly proven that he is not a good option against LHP). If we are to get another LHH, that player basically needs to be an everyday answer at RF or DH. 

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20 minutes ago, esmd said:

I see what he's saying, and it seems like Mancini is ready to get ABs.  Another year in the minors, is, IMO, a waste.  I don't want to see him in the OF though.  I've advocated a DH platoon between him and Alvarez.  I'd still be good with that.  Alvarez would be an insurance policy in case Mancini struggles.  And if Mancini takes off like Brady thinks he can, all the better, you've got a dangerous (albeit expensive) LH pinch hitter on your bench most games.

The only problem is that both of these guys need regular at bats to get going. I think Mancini could be the "real deal" at the plate. We need to happen for us what happened for the Red Sox, which is some young guys coming of age. Who knows, Mancini might be able to hit 240 with 25-30 bombs and decent OBP. But Alvarez as insurance is wise.

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9 minutes ago, pastorfan said:

The only problem is that both of these guys need regular at bats to get going. I think Mancini could be the "real deal" at the plate. We need to happen for us what happened for the Red Sox, which is some young guys coming of age. Who knows, Mancini might be able to hit 240 with 25-30 bombs and decent OBP. But Alvarez as insurance is wise.

If Mancini hits 240 he won't have a decent OBP. Plate discipline is not one of his skills.

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24 minutes ago, jamalshw said:

I continue to not see where Alvarez fits on this team. We have two LHH platoon outfielders right now in Kim and Smith that will need platoon partners. On top of that we need to carry a backup catcher and infielder (likely Joseph and Flaherty). As a result, we're left with two positions to be filled by the Kim and Smith platoon partners. I don't see where we have a spot on the bench for another platoon. I know DD is talking about another LHH, but I just cannot see where one fits unless that LHH is a full-time player and not a platoon bat like Alvarez...unless, you are of the opinion that Kim is that everyday player, but I don't get the sense that Buck agrees with that (Smith has clearly proven that he is not a good option against LHP). If we are to get another LHH, that player basically needs to be an everyday answer at RF or DH. 

I don't see Alvarez as a fit, but I think Valbuena could be. He can hit and has defensive value at several positions. He could act as a sort of super sub and be DH insurance if Mancini doesn't produce.

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I know the conventional wisdom is young players shouldn't DH, but I am hoping this is something the org and Mancini embrace going into spring.

The DH penalty is a real thing, but if I'm Trey Mancini, I'm focusing my professional energies in 2017 in learning how to beat that, not how to clop around LF.  If Dan could hook him up with Edgar Martinez, that'd be fantastic.  I figure David Ortiz is unavailable.  Any of the few who have beaten it over a multi-year period could be a valuable consultant to him right now if they are willing to share how, and I imagine like with knuckleballers, there might be a bit of a brotherhood.

One of the Orioles greatest success stories in establishing a young player was Eddie in 1977.  He DH'd 111 times that year.  I know that was a case of veteran deference to Lee May and not a lack of defensive ability like in Mancini's case, but the Show is hard and it seems to me like narrowing the focus for a maybe he is, maybe he isn't a nugget guy couldn't hurt.  Earl wrote in Weaver on Strategy that there are very few players who can do everything, and good managing is best utilizing what a guy can do, not fretting about what he can't.

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1 hour ago, esmd said:

I see what he's saying, and it seems like Mancini is ready to get ABs.  Another year in the minors, is, IMO, a waste.  I don't want to see him in the OF though.  I've advocated a DH platoon between him and Alvarez.  I'd still be good with that.  Alvarez would be an insurance policy in case Mancini struggles.  And if Mancini takes off like Brady thinks he can, all the better, you've got a dangerous (albeit expensive) LH pinch hitter on your bench most games.

Dan Duquette has stated that Mancini has nothing further to accomplish at the minor league level. Nothing. 

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Brady tends to talk up our players and focus on the positive, which is good considering his role in helping to train and condition these guys and get them into a positive state of mind.    But I don't hang on every word he says, because he can't be expected to discuss a player's weaknesses or limitations in detail when speaking with the press.  

Giving Mancini 400-500 plate appearances would be a calculated risk, and in 2017 he'd probably be a step down from Trumbo.    I still wouldn't mind taking that risk, so long as we add a guy like Pagan to bolster the defense and add some flexibility in who plays on a given night.    I'm on record as expecting a .750ish OPS from Mancini; maybe slightly lower in his rookie year.    

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Honestly is this the year we should be taking chances on guys producing or hoping to get by with a young guy? I like Mancini but we have a 2-year window with these guys. Are you all ready to go in with what we have?

 

I'm not. I think Trumbo is very undervalued on this board. Bring him back and let's fight these next two years. He's literally looking at 2/3 the money we all thought he was gonna get and 2 less years. I had enough of the losing for a decade and a half.  Put our best team on the field and battle before this window is closed. 

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18 minutes ago, mskrulz said:

Honestly is this the year we should be taking chances on guys producing or hoping to get by with a young guy? I like Mancini but we have a 2-year window with these guys. Are you all ready to go in with what we have?

 

I'm not. I think Trumbo is very undervalued on this board. Bring him back and let's fight these next two years. He's literally looking at 2/3 the money we all thought he was gonna get and 2 less years. I had enough of the losing for a decade and a half.  Put our best team on the field and battle before this window is closed. 

Then in my opinion, you sign Pagan to be your everyday RFer and leadoff hitter. Kim goes to LH DH with Mancini as the other half of that position. Platoon Rickard and Smith in LF.

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2 minutes ago, mskrulz said:

Honestly is this the year we should be taking chances on guys producing or hoping to get by with a young guy? I like Mancini but we have a 2-year window with these guys. Are you all ready to go in with what we have?

 

I'm not. I think Trumbo is very undervalued on this board. Bring him back and let's fight these next two years. He's literally looking at 2/3 the money we all thought he was gonna get and 2 less years. I had enough of the losing for a decade and a half.  Put our best team on the field and battle before this window is closed. 

Let's say the choice is Trumbo vs Pagan. 8 spots are taken by Castlllo, backup C, Davis, Schoop, Hardy, Machado, Jones, Flaherty. OF becomes Kim, Smith, Rickard, Mancini plus either Trumbo or Pagan.

With Trumbo:

vs LHP Trumbo RF/Rickard LF/Mancini DH, Kim and Smith bench. Pretty stacked offensively but we would have the Trumbo problem in RF. 

vs RHP Kim LF/Smith RF/Trumbo DH, Mancini and Rickard bench. Still weak defensively, maybe slight step up from last year.

With Pagan:

vs LHP: Pagan RF, Rickard LF, Mancini DH, Kim and Smith bench. Less stacked offensively but OF would now be a plus defense. Higher OBP than last year but fewer HR from DH.

vs RHP: Pagan RF, Smith LF, Kim DH, Mancini and Rickard bench. Much less power than last year, but at least average defense, and this lineup would be an OBP machine. 

I just like what Pagan would bring to the defense, while offsetting some of Trumbo's power with OBP. 

 

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