Russell's (NOT) Coming.

[Frobby]

16 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

I don't think the O's are chea

I don't think of the O's as cheap at all.... in fact I am pretty consistent on my opinion that they have way overpaid on all of their major extensions (Hardy, O'day, Davis, Trumbo).

I'd like them to pay they young guys, and lock them up to pre FA extensions... and not sign 30 yo's who are past their prime

Cheap is not their problem, allocation of salary to the best players is what I have an issue with

They are in the top 10 of payroll, definitely not cheap

I would like to see them locking up some young guys several years before FA as well.    Of the four vets you listed, the only one I'm sweating is Davis.   That's got a 50% chance to be a real albatross down the road.    

[webbrick2010]

16 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I would like to see them locking up some young guys several years before FA as well.    Of the four vets you listed, the only one I'm sweating is Davis.   That's got a 50% chance to be a real albatross down the road.    

No need to rehash this, we simply disagree... I think all 4 contracts are bad to horrendous and the equivalent value could have been had for > 50% less dollars, money that could have been used towards  a pre FA extension of Britton and Tillman for sure.

[backwardsk]

6 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

No need to rehash this, we simply disagree... I think all 4 contracts are bad to horrendous and the equivalent value could have been had for > 50% less dollars, money that could have been used towards  a pre FA extension of Britton and Tillman for sure.

If DD had extended Tillman after 2014, how many negative posts would you have written in 2015 when he struggled? 75?

[webbrick2010]

1 minute ago, backwardsk said:

If DD had extended Tillman after 2014, how many negative posts would you have written in 2015 when he struggled? 75?

About as many as I did for signing Ubaldo (zero), which I was strongly in support of (actually hasn't been a bad value).

[scOtt]

John Russell is leaving?

[Number5]

1 hour ago, scOtt said:

John Russell is leaving?

I believe that the thread title refers to H. Russell Smouse not handling the arb cases this year.  Apparently the relatively small amounts of difference between the players' numbers and the team's numbers in all three cases aren't significant enough to warrant using Smouse.

[Can_of_corn]

 

[Can_of_corn]

I guess the arbiter wasn't a believer in framing metrics.

[thezeroes]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I guess the arbiter wasn't a believer in framing metrics.

Or likes the RBI stat.

[canonfaz]

Guess they can afford to sign the contracts of those front office guys now.

[weams]

One down 

[weams]

Ok. They were able to pay Jim Hunter. 

[Ohfan67]

This case seems incredibly stupid to me. Joseph was terrible last year and the money is ML pocket money. Definitely seems like the O's are trying to make a point with arbitration cases. Overall, owners seem to be playing hard ball with salaries this offseason. A few players have gotten big deals, but a lot of small contracts and unsigned solid veterans. I wonder if the number of arbitration cases is up overall this year? If so, then there may be some mild collusion happening. 

 

Hmm. Just found a list:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2015/02/23/whos-winning-the-mlb-salary-arbitration-game-heres-data-from-1974-to-2015/2/#55016c4d60ce

This may be the most number of arbitration hearings since about 1992. 

[Can_of_corn]

7 minutes ago, Ohfan67 said:

This case seems incredibly stupid to me. Joseph was terrible last year and the money is ML pocket money. Definitely seems like the O's are trying to make a point with arbitration cases. Overall, owners seem to be playing hard ball with salaries this offseason. A few players have gotten big deals, but a lot of small contracts and unsigned solid veterans. I wonder if the number of arbitration cases is up overall this year? If so, then there may be some mild collusion happening. 

 

Hmm. Just found a list:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2015/02/23/whos-winning-the-mlb-salary-arbitration-game-heres-data-from-1974-to-2015/2/#55016c4d60ce

This may be the most number of arbitration hearings since about 1992. 

If I can get labor costs at a 30% discount I'd do it.

[Frobby]

So I got curious about the Orioles' only arbitration loss, in 1995 with Ben McDonald.    That decision followed a strike-shortened season in which McDonald went 14-7 in 24 starts, with a 4.06 ERA (123 ERA+ in an offense-friendly era).   Big Ben would have had a decent shot at 20 wins in '94, but the season was cut short with 50 games remaining.    (Note: his teammate Mike Mussina would have had an even better shot at 20, as he was 16-5 at the time.)

McDonald, who had made $2.675 mm in '94 and was entering his final year of arbitration, asked for $4.5 mm.    The O's offered only $3.2 mm.    McDonald prevailed, and said afterwards that he had been willing to split the difference, but the O's never came off their $3.2 mm figure.  Scott Boras was McDonald's agent.

Because the strike didn't end until after what normally would be Opening Day, the arbitration hearing didn't happen until early June, by which time McDonald had already pitched 7-8 games.   About six weeks after he won his case, he got injured, missing about 60 games.    That hurt his stock dramatically, and the O's non-tendered him at the end of the season.   Apparently, Scott Boras was shocked by that and it damaged his relationship with the Orioles for some time.

McDonald then signed with the Brewers for 2/$5.75 mm plus incentives that eventually took him to $7 mm total for the two seasons.   He had an excellent 1996 season, and was offered a 3/$18 mm extension, which he turned down, only to get injured in July '97 and never pitch in the majors again.  

Looking back at it, the O's $3.2 mm offer ($525,000 raise) seems crazy low considering how good McDonald had been in '94.    Maybe the Orioles though the arbitrator would take into account that the season had been shortened.    In any event, they lost, for the only time.