Disturbing trend or just the offseason?

[Going Underground]

I saw this in the Sun and got me thinking a little that perhaps maybe players don't want to come to the Orioles. Probably much ado about nothing and three players will probably sign with the Orioles this week. Players need to find a home and quick. How  many other players have turned down Oriole offers?

The Orioles attempted to bring back Flaherty, but their efforts weren’t enough to keep him as he signed a minor league deal with the Philadelphia Phillies. They also pursued infielder Ryan Goins to make him the utility man, but he signed a minor league deal with the Kansas City Royals. The fact that both players signed minor league deals with other clubs is disturbing. Intent to acquire both was there, but it indicates the team wasn’t able to make offers in a timely manner.

 

The Orioles also missed out on right-hander Mike Fiers, who had been nontendered by the Houston Astros, when he chose to sign a one-year, $6 million deal with the rebuilding Detroit Tigers this past week over a reported two-year offer from the Orioles, according to ESPN. Fiers, 32, turned down guaranteed money for a second year for a one-year deal that gives him the opportunity to earn a raise through the arbitration process next year.

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/blog/bs-sp-orioles-spring-20180211-story.html

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/blog/bs-sp-orioles-meetings-20171210-story.html

 

[theocean]

2 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

I saw this in the Sun and got me thinking a little that perhaps maybe players don't want to come to the Orioles. Probably much ado about nothing and three players will probably sign with the Orioles this week. Players need to find a home and quick. How  many other players have turned down Oriole offers?

The Orioles attempted to bring back Flaherty, but their efforts weren’t enough to keep him as he signed a minor league deal with the Philadelphia Phillies. They also pursued infielder Ryan Goins to make him the utility man, but he signed a minor league deal with the Kansas City Royals. The fact that both players signed minor league deals with other clubs is disturbing. Intent to acquire both was there, but it indicates the team wasn’t able to make offers in a timely manner.

 

The Orioles also missed out on right-hander Mike Fiers, who had been nontendered by the Houston Astros, when he chose to sign a one-year, $6 million deal with the rebuilding Detroit Tigers this past week over a reported two-year offer from the Orioles, according to ESPN. Fiers, 32, turned down guaranteed money for a second year for a one-year deal that gives him the opportunity to earn a raise through the arbitration process next year.

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/blog/bs-sp-orioles-spring-20180211-story.html

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/blog/bs-sp-orioles-meetings-20171210-story.html

 

Flaherty and Goins both likely have the opportunity to start with the teams they chose. The O's are pretty much set in the field. I guess Friers wanted to bet on himself and reestablish his value with a one year deal.

I don't think that Baltimore is the most attractive landing spot for free agents, though. Small market team, have to get beat up by the Yankees and Red Sox. I love Baltimore - but if you aren't from here and you have an opportunity to play in a bigger city that doesn't have muggy swamp weather - you probably jump on it.

[backwardsk]

Those three examples don't really concern me.

If you are a utility infielder, you don't get much playing time under Buck if there are no injuries.  You'd need to give them MLB deals.  (Though I would have for Goins or Barney)

I want to say I read that the Orioles offer was 2/10.  A fair offer.  If I'm Fiers, I'm betting on myself to pitch well enough to be offered arbitration.  I do wonder if the Orioles had a chance to counter with 1/6.25M and if Fiers still would have gone to Detroit.

[vab]

Why wouldn't these SPs want to get lit on fire by the Yankees and Red Sox 5, 6, 7 times this year? I can't imagine. 

[Can_of_corn]

44 minutes ago, vab said:

Why wouldn't these SPs want to get lit on fire by the Yankees and Red Sox 5, 6, 7 times this year? I can't imagine. 

I figured they would relish the challenge.

[OriolesMagic83]

What free agents have the O's offered the most money and they signed elsewhere?  Fiers and Fowler?  I believe both just wanted 1 year deals to build their value.  I can't think of any free agents the O's offered multi-year deals for the most money and they signed elsewhere.  90%+ of the time, the players sign with whoever offers the most money.

[tntoriole]

2 hours ago, backwardsk said:

Those three examples don't really concern me.

If you are a utility infielder, you don't get much playing time under Buck if there are no injuries.  You'd need to give them MLB deals.  (Though I would have for Goins or Barney)

I want to say I read that the Orioles offer was 2/10.  A fair offer.  If I'm Fiers, I'm betting on myself to pitch well enough to be offered arbitration.  I do wonder if the Orioles had a chance to counter with 1/6.25M and if Fiers still would have gone to Detroit.

Flaherty got way too much playing time due to Buck, imho.  Good luck getting a fulltime job in the bigs.  A team would have to be really bad to have Ryan Flaherty fulltime at anything. 

[backwardsk]

2 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

Flaherty got way too much playing time due to Buck, imho.  Good luck getting a fulltime job in the bigs.  A team would have to be really bad to have Ryan Flaherty fulltime at anything. 

He had 219 PAs over the past two years.  

Buck plays his regulars all the time when he can.

Schoop played  160 and 162 games the past two seasons.  Machado played 162, 157, and 156 games over the past three (with a suspension in there).

With Beckham in the IF, and likely healthier than Hardy, there's even less opportunity for a utility IFer playing for Buck.

I doubt Flaherty has expectations of starting, but he'll definitely have more of an opportunity to play in PHI than BAL.

[weams]

1 hour ago, vab said:

Why wouldn't these SPs want to get lit on fire by the Yankees and Red Sox 5, 6, 7 times this year? I can't imagine. 

You forgot the Blue Jays...

[tntoriole]

1 minute ago, backwardsk said:

He had 219 PAs over the past two years.  

Buck plays his regulars all the time when he can.

Schoop played  160 and 162 games the past two seasons.  Machado played 162, 157, and 156 games over the past three (with a suspension in there).

With Beckham in the IF, and likely healthier than Hardy, there's even less opportunity for a utility IFer playing for Buck.

I doubt Flaherty has expectations of starting, but he'll definitely have more of an opportunity to play in PHI than BAL.

Nice try...you describe 219 PAs over last two years using a real selective time frame...he was injured most of last year so  he only got 43 PAs having nothing to do with Buck but being on the 60 day DL and he had 176 PAs in 2016. The two years before that he totalled over 600 PAs....which was way too many given how awful he was offensively.   Buck played him much, much more during his time here than he will ever see again, imho. 

[backwardsk]

23 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

Nice try...you describe 219 PAs over last two years using a real selective time frame...he was injured most of last year so  he only got 43 PAs having nothing to do with Buck but being on the 60 day DL and he had 176 PAs in 2016. The two years before that he totalled over 600 PAs....which was way too many given how awful he was offensively.   Buck played him much, much more during his time here than he will ever see again, imho. 

And the two years you referenced saw Manny play 82 games (2014) and Schoop play 86 (2015).  Flaherty's 300 PA seasons came when a starting infielder missed significant time due to injury.

Buck doesn't rest his starters if he doesn't have to.  That's been obvious watching this team since 2011.  Beckham will likely be healthier than Hardy over the past three years.  The utility IFer will see minimal playing time.

[tntoriole]

20 minutes ago, backwardsk said:

And the two years you referenced saw Manny play 82 games (2014) and Schoop play 86 (2015).  Flaherty's 300 PA seasons came when a starting infielder missed significant time due to injury.

Buck doesn't rest his starters if he doesn't have to.  That's been obvious watching this team since 2011.  Beckham will likely be healthier than Hardy over the past three years.  The utility IFer will see minimal playing time.

That is when most utility infielders play...when someone gets hurt or needs the occasional day off.  Ryan got many more ABs than he had a right to.  Very rare are the Melvin Moras and the Ben Zobrists.  Most utility types have a glove that works in several spots and can’t hit.  Buck giving him that amount of at bats rather than getting a replacement infielder during those years shows what a nugget he was from Bucks standpoint.