Is this rock bottom?

[nadecir]

1 minute ago, glenn__davis said:

I'm not neglecting it, I just don't believe it's going make as big of an impact as you seem to.  And attendance numbers will level out a bit with marquee opponents and better weather.

Do you think that if the Orioles and Manny Machado mutually agreed to an extension through, say, 2025, that the Orioles would say no, that doesn't work for us because we owe Mark Trumbo $10M in 2019?  I do not.

The Orioles could offer $10 million more in 2019 for Machado as part of a long-term contract if they did not have Trumbo's contract.

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, nadecir said:

The Orioles could offer $10 million more in 2019 for Machado as part of a long-term contract if they did not have Trumbo's contract.

That’s not nothing, but in the context of a 10-year deal for Manny, obligations in 2018-19 aren’t likely to have a big impact.   Honestly, the O’s haven’t had a serious discussion of a long term deal with Manny in 3 years or so, and to me they have no intention of pursuing him seriously as a free agent.    

[glenn__davis]

7 minutes ago, Frobby said:

That’s not nothing, but in the context of a 10-year deal for Manny, obligations in 2018-19 aren’t likely to have a big impact.   Honestly, the O’s haven’t had a serious discussion of a long term deal with Manny in 3 years or so, and to me they have no intention of pursuing him seriously as a free agent.    

Exactly.  Maybe the Trumbo deal prohibits them from signing a better role-type player, but it's not going to prevent them from extending Manny or Schoop, or doing anything that had long term significance for the franchise.

Personally I'd prefer to see that money spent on player development, but again there is no indication that the money spent by the Orioles on this front is related to their MLB payroll.

[NashLumber]

Is it really necessary to dump other posters and their opinions (and even go as far to post someone's post history)? I know a few of the folks here personally, and I know none of us would be that crappy to one's face. Some folks tend to be pessimists by nature and some are optimists and some are a mix. I don't buy that any person here roots for the team to fail.

 

EDIT: nevermind. The post seems to have been deleted.

[nadecir]

22 minutes ago, Frobby said:

That’s not nothing, but in the context of a 10-year deal for Manny, obligations in 2018-19 aren’t likely to have a big impact.   Honestly, the O’s haven’t had a serious discussion of a long term deal with Manny in 3 years or so, and to me they have no intention of pursuing him seriously as a free agent.    

Trumbo's 2019  in isolation may only have a 3-4% impact on a long-term deal for Machado.  But his contract is symbolic of a big problem the Orioles have: giving long-term contracts for aging free agents with high annual salaries.  It would not be difficult at all to find a majority portion of the $300 million or so it would take to sign Machado long term that the Orioles have wasted over the last 4 to 5 years.  Add in with what will be wasted next few years too, and you are well on your way to making a competitive offer to Machado.

You have to believe the Orioles would love to sign Machado long-term.  They just don't believe they can afford him, so they have not had serious discussions with him.  Mistakes in the past have really hurt the Orioles ability to make Machado a competitive offer.

The Orioles are not a high payroll budget team that can afford to waste this kind of money on a regular basis and still contend.

[OFFNY]

7 minutes ago, NashLumber said:

 

Is it really necessary to dump other posters and their opinions (and even go as far to post someone's post history)? I know a few of the folks here personally, and I know none of us would do that to one's face. Some folks tend to be pessimists by nature and some are optimists and some are a mix. I don't buy that any person here roots for the team to fail.

 

o

 

I suppose not.

However, there is a distinct difference between pessimistic fans such as Look It's Puck and Roy Firestone whom are ALWAYS here regardless of how well the team is doing, and a select few other posters who have nothing to say when the team wins, and then come trotting along full of facetious digs at the team, the manager, and the front office when they lose. So I don't buy your sentiment that there are no posters here who root against the team ........ it is too much of a coincidence in their behavior.

 

o

[NashLumber]

2 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

I suppose not.

However, there is a distinct difference between pessimistic fans such as Look It's Puck and Roy Firestone whom are ALWAYS here regardless of how well the team is doing, and a select few other posters who have nothing to say when the team wins, and then com jogging along full of facetious digs at the team, the manager, and the front office when they lose. So I don't agree with you that there are no posters here who root against the team ........ it is too much of a coincidence in their behavior.

o

Your post (the one I questioned) was deleted as my edit showed. You quoted me during my edit. It's pretty easy. People vent. Try not to make it personal.  I accept that. Thank you.

[OFFNY]

3 minutes ago, NashLumber said:

 

Your post (the one I questioned) was deleted as my edit showed. You quoted me during my edit. Thank you.

 

o

 

I deleted my post, after reading yours.

However, as incendiary as my post was, I really don't believe that an argument can be made against it.

 

o

[glenn__davis]

4 minutes ago, nadecir said:

Trumbo's 2019  in isolation may only have a 3-4% impact on a long-term deal for Machado.  But his contract is symbolic of a big problem the Orioles have: giving long-term contracts for aging free agents with high annual salaries.  

This is fine and I do not disagree with it.  But that is not the argument at hand.  I agree that the Orioles have too often wasted money and given bad contracts on aging players, and that this is generally unwise and inefficient.  The Trumbo signing certainly is an example of it.  But of the potential shortcomings Moose had originally mentioned - signing Machado, Schoop, Bundy, or spending more on develoment/drafting - that contract, specifically, isn't going to hurt those things.

I just think we should not be lumping the Davis and Trumbo contracts together as if they are remotely equivalent.  One very much has long term consequences, the other does not.

[NashLumber]

1 minute ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

I deleted my post, after reading yours.

However, as incendiary as my post was, I really don't believe that an argument can be made against it.

 

o

People vent. Not everyone is going to be our buddy or see things the way you or I do. I just hate to see people getting piled on, even if it's an unpopular post and then their posting history is made public like it's a court case and this is the discovery phase. Thank you for deleting that. It was the right thing. You're a good fellow and valuable member and I enjoy your informative posts.

[OFFNY]

12 minutes ago, NashLumber said:

 

People vent. Not everyone is going to be our buddy or see things the way you or I do. I just hate to see people getting piled on, even if it's an unpopular post and then their posting history is made public like it's a court case and this is the discovery phase. Thank you for deleting that. It was the right thing. You're a good fellow and valuable member and I enjoy your informative posts.

 

o

 

Thank you.

As I just stated, I'm not talking about the posters whom are pessimistic but always here regardless of how well the team is doing. I consider Paul Folk to be as fair-minded of a poster as there is, and even he questioned the poster and asked them if they "Did anything besides troll the team and the front office." So if Paul Folk went so far as to use the "troll" label, then I don't see any other explanation for that type of behavior. It has nothing to do with being a buddy or seeing things eye-to-eye ........ it's intellectual dishonesty at best, and trolling at worst.

 

o

[NashLumber]

1 minute ago, OFFNY said:

o

As I just stated, I'm not talking about the posters whom are pessimistic but always here regardless of how well the team is doing. I consider Paul Folk to be as fair-minded of a poster as there is, and even he questioned the poster and asked them if they "Did anything besides troll the team and the front office when they lose." So if Paul Folk went so far as to use the "troll" label, then I don't see any other explanation for that type of behavior. It has nothing to do with being a buddy or seeing things eye-to-eye ........ it's intellectual dishonesty at best, and trolling at worst.

 

o

I see. i guess some of us have different thresholds for the tolerance of such things. I often skim and move on. Grain of salt, for me. I guess it's just a bigger thing for others. Since it's a court case, I'll rest. Hope you will, too.

[OFFNY]

6 minutes ago, NashLumber said:

 

I see. I guess some of us have different thresholds for the tolerance of such things. I often skim and move on. Grain of salt, for me. I guess it's just a bigger thing for others. Since it's a court case, I'll rest. Hope you will, too.

 

o

 

That's probably the best (and mentally healthiest) route to take. It reminds me of the outstanding poem by Rudyard Kipling (If.)

 

 

 

o

[Natty]

I would say that a .261 winning pct is rock bottom... 

But certainly there are other variables involved that may not be rock bottom. 

 

[Going Underground]

7 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

That's probably the best (and mentally healthiest) route to take. It reminds me of the outstanding poem by Rudyard Kipling (If.)

 

 

 

oMore important things to worry about.

Farquhar had surgery Saturday to address the aneurysm, and the team reported his medical team felt he was "progressing well." He has use of his extremities and is responding to questions and commands. "We are very happy that he is trending in the right direction," White Sox manager Rick Renteria said. "To know that he is able to move and able to speak and know his family is there, he knows everybody cares for him. We're going in the right direction and we're guardedly optimistic about the outcome." Farquhar was selected by Toronto in the 10th round of the 2008 draft and made his major league debut with the Blue Jays in 2011. "Nothing really matters as far as baseball goes right now," White Sox pitcher James Shields said. "As long as we know one of our brothers is doing better."

 

Many more important things.