Brian Graham Out

[weams]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll believe Elias is in complete control when:

Davis is cut

They don't package the comp pick to dump salary.

Spend 90% of the allotment on the draft and international market.

Your data points are not definitive. 

[interloper]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll believe Elias is in complete control when:

Davis is cut

They don't package the comp pick to dump salary.

Spend 90% of the allotment on the draft and international market.

Eventually, sure. But I don't think it's that unreasonable if your boss says, maybe hold off on dumping our $160 million investment for a year or so. Elias doesn't own the damn team, he'll have SOME restraints. He'll be much better off waiting to make his case when Jimmy Top Prospect NEEDS to be unblocked in order to make the team good. We're not nearly there yet. 

[weams]

Just now, weams said:

Your data points are not definitive. 

Any of those thing can happen or not and it will not be indicative of Elias having a free hand. It will be indicative of your lines in the sand that you have drawn. 

[Tony-OH]

Just now, interloper said:

Eventually, sure. But I don't think it's that unreasonable if your boss says, maybe hold off on dumping our $160 million investment for a year or so. Elias doesn't own the damn team, he'll have SOME restraints. He'll be much better off waiting to make his case when Jimmy Top Prospect NEEDS to be unblocked in order to make the team good. We're not nearly there yet. 

Agreed, plus, why would Elias not want to see if his analytics, swing path modifications, and new hitting coach can't help Davis get better? I don't hold out much hope, but with a sunk cost, why not try and see if he can be fixed by Elias' guys? I'd give it to about Mid-May to early June. If Davis is once again the worse hitter in baseball, it will then be time for Elias to convince ownership to eat the cost.

[theocean]

10 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll believe Elias is in complete control when:

Davis is cut

They don't package the comp pick to dump salary.

Spend 90% of the allotment on the draft and international market.

No, it'll just mean Elias is doing what you hope he will do.

[Camden_yardbird]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll believe Elias is in complete control when:

Davis is cut

They don't package the comp pick to dump salary.

Spend 90% of the allotment on the draft and international market.

Close but not quite.  I think each of these things stand for something that show a different level of control but each is not necessary to show that control.

Davis getting cut is emblematic of total roster control.  Elias could find he has some analysis that shows him that he can recoup value out of Davis performance.  Something like trading Bundy or Givens would also suffice.

Your second sign is that of fiscal freedom (so is the first too to an extent).  Now every GM has fiscal constraints and no owner want to spend a top ten payroll for a bottom ten product.  But there are other things that could show this.  Today for example we could see a surprise non tender.  Even freedom in free agent spending would show this.

Your last sign is simply just investment in the international market.  I dont need to see 90% to know there is a commitment.  Hiring of of more than 3 international scouts would suffice or even reporting of interest in a big international player would work (just because you want them doesnt mean they will sign).  I think to some extent the VVM news showed us that this is already there to some extent.

[Can_of_corn]

10 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

I know you like to think other teams would cut his salary, but at this point, too much is left on the table to cut.

I don't mean today.  I've never meant today.  But if he isn't showing huge improvement than before the break.

[Redskins Rick]

6 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't mean today.  I've never meant today.  But if he isn't showing huge improvement than before the break.

Oh okay, even by the ASB, I dont see them pulling a DFA, I really don't.

But, heck, Ive been wrong before.

[interloper]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

I don't mean today.  I've never meant today.  But if he isn't showing huge improvement than before the break.

To what end? Simply being able to move Mancini to 1B full time and plug in someone in LF? In a likely 100-loss season? It's neither here nor there to me. You get the same benefit moving/cutting Trumbo and it's much easier to do so.

[Es4M11]

14 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Agreed, plus, why would Elias not want to see if his analytics, swing path modifications, and new hitting coach can't help Davis get better? I don't hold out much hope, but with a sunk cost, why not try and see if he can be fixed by Elias' guys? I'd give it to about Mid-May to early June. If Davis is once again the worse hitter in baseball, it will then be time for Elias to convince ownership to eat the cost.

Agree with this, mostly. Though, I do see value in just moving on. If Davis does continue to suck, then he's gotta go. Addition by subtraction. No matter how much money he is making, if continues his trends form last year he is an overwhelming negative, and the Orioles would be better off paying him to go away. Frees up a roster spot and a position on the field for one of our pretend outfielders.

[weams]

1 minute ago, interloper said:

To what end? Simply being able to move Mancini to 1B full time and plug in someone in LF? In a likely 100-loss season? It's neither here nor there to me. You get the same benefit moving/cutting Trumbo and it's much easier to do so.

I support this. 

[interloper]

3 minutes ago, weams said:

I support this. 

Don't get me wrong, I don't want Davis on the roster either. But it would be a pretty unprecedented eating of salary for a healthy player not just for the Orioles but, like, ever in MLB? Fact-check me on that, but it would have to rank in the top 3. 

[Moose Milligan]

28 minutes ago, interloper said:

Eventually, sure. But I don't think it's that unreasonable if your boss says, maybe hold off on dumping our $160 million investment for a year or so. Elias doesn't own the damn team, he'll have SOME restraints. He'll be much better off waiting to make his case when Jimmy Top Prospect NEEDS to be unblocked in order to make the team good. We're not nearly there yet. 

I'm not sure if Davis could be looked at as an investment right now.  

They would be better off cutting him and having an AAAA type at 1st instead.  One, the AAAA type would out produce him.  Two, they'd have better roster flexibility.

[clapdiddy]

9 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I'm not sure if Davis could be looked at as an investment right now.  

They would be better off cutting him and having an AAAA type at 1st instead.  One, the AAAA type would out produce him.  Two, they'd have better roster flexibility.

If we got rid of Davis, I'd put Mancini on first.   That would still give us some roster flexibility by removing him from the outfield.

[interloper]

10 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I'm not sure if Davis could be looked at as an investment right now.  

They would be better off cutting him and having an AAAA type at 1st instead.  One, the AAAA type would out produce him.  Two, they'd have better roster flexibility.

Yeah, I mean I don't disagree really. I'd love for them to just cut him, but it's just not super realistic. And whether or not a AAAA guy out-hits him, we're gonna lose approx. 1,000,000 games in 2019.