Trade Value Power Rankings

[atomic]

7 minutes ago, MongoBoy said:

Trade away core players to get garbage in return.  What a concept.

But we will get a high draft pick next year and the year after that and the year after that 

[Moose Milligan]

Looks like maybe people are tempering expectations on how much our guys are worth for once.

Whenever I start thinking about what I think our guys are worth, I try to look at it from another GM's perspective...if I were, say, a GM of a team like the Astros or the Dodgers or even the Twins....and I was looking at Baltimore's roster to see if there were pieces I'd want and, in turn, assigning a value to those pieces, I keep coming back to the same conclusion.

Which is...no one I'd absolutely have to have and wouldn't be willing to part with much to get anything I'd be slightly interested in.

[wildcard]

19 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Looks like maybe people are tempering expectations on how much our guys are worth for once.

Whenever I start thinking about what I think our guys are worth, I try to look at it from another GM's perspective...if I were, say, a GM of a team like the Astros or the Dodgers or even the Twins....and I was looking at Baltimore's roster to see if there were pieces I'd want and, in turn, assigning a value to those pieces, I keep coming back to the same conclusion.

Which is...no one I'd absolutely have to have and wouldn't be willing to part with much to get anything I'd be slightly interested in.

The other side to that is that Elias really does not have to trade anyone but Cashner.

The O's are not paying 10+m next year so they will allow him to be a free agent this off season if he is not traded by the deadline.     So if they can't get anything more then some salary relief Elias needs to trade him to get value out of him.

Givens, Mancini, Villar will all be available on the trade market but if no one gives Elias what he considers good value he can just keep any or all of them.  He can revisit their trade value in the off season.

[Moose Milligan]

Just now, wildcard said:

The other side to that is that Elias really does not have to trade anyone but Cashner.

The O's are not paying 10+m next year so they will allow him to be a free agent this off season if he is not traded by the deadline.     So if they can't get anything more then some salary relief Elias needs to trade him to get value out of him.

Givens, Mancini, Villar will all be available of the trade market but if no one gives Elias what he considers good value he can just keep any or all of them.  He can revisit their trade value in the off season.

I agree, gotta get some value for Cashner especially since he's continuing to pitch well and his salary is off the books next season.  Even if it's a spare part or two, something back is better than nothing.

[Can_of_corn]

45 minutes ago, MongoBoy said:

Trade away core players to get garbage in return.  What a concept.

When the core is rotten it needs to be trashed.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

With Andrew Cashner I would strike while the iron is hot. Don’t wait for him to let his ERA balloon out or a trip to the injured list.

Of course this is all contingent on an acceptable trade proposal. 

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

31 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I agree, gotta get some value for Cashner especially since he's continuing to pitch well and his salary is off the books next season.  Even if it's a spare part or two, something back is better than nothing.

Salary relief and a good bullpen arm for the next three years is a win. 

[Aglets]

Wonder how well Mark Trumbo would have to hit in order to have trade value this summer.................

.950?

[HowAboutThat]

Moose made a very valid point. When GM’s look at our team what do they see that they want.

Nothing. The answer is nothing. We have some guys who are better than replacement level, but we have nobody who would benefit a contending team, and a non-contending team wouldn’t be interested. Who are the Fringe contenders? The Rockies? The Diamondbacks? The Braves? Maybe the Mariners(although they’ve been shooting them selves in the foot quite a bit over the last month)

Do we have anybody who would benefit any of those teams? No, we don’t. Nobody. I despised Dan for years Because personnel  moves are the GM’s responsibility, and so many of the moves were unthinkably stupid even at the time that they were made. He’s been gone since last fall, for which may God be praised, but the effects of those unthinking moves will be felt for a very long time.

[LookinUp]

10 hours ago, Philip said:

1)Means.

2-25) everyone else.

 

Means is an interesting consideration. On the positive, he's young, performing and under control. In theory, he's the type of player you build around, not the type you trade away. However, those peripherals and at least the one scouting report posted in the Means thread really do temper the enthusiasm around him. 

This is where the scouts earn their money. If the projections for Means are a #4/5 pitcher, but his value is higher (perhaps significantly), I think you have to consider trading him regardless of how young and cheap he is. In fact, that young and cheap part would increase his value too. It's tough to get rid of a guy who could be a future rotation fixture though. Do you trade away a young, cheap, very slightly less version of Wei-Yin Chen? That's hard to do.

[HowAboutThat]

33 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

Means is an interesting consideration. On the positive, he's young, performing and under control. In theory, he's the type of player you build around, not the type you trade away. However, those peripherals and at least the one scouting report posted in the Means thread really do temper the enthusiasm around him. 

This is where the scouts earn their money. If the projections for Means are a #4/5 pitcher, but his value is higher (perhaps significantly), I think you have to consider trading him regardless of how young and cheap he is. In fact, that young and cheap part would increase his value too. It's tough to get rid of a guy who could be a future rotation fixture though. Do you trade away a young, cheap, very slightly less version of Wei-Yin Chen? That's hard to do.

Plus, at the moment he’s the only watchable guy on the whole staff.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Salary relief and a good bullpen arm for the next three years is a win. 

IMO, if the player is a free agent at the end of the year (as Cashner is, right?  Pretty sure he is) then salary relief isn't as big of a deal.  If we trade him near the deadline, that's only a few months salary we'd still be partially (I'm assuming no one would take his entire salary) still responsible.  He figures into the budget for the rest of this year only...if he was slated to be on the 2020 and 2021 payrolls I'd be more inclined to be excited about salary relief.  At this point I just want to get a piece or two back for him and call it a day.

[Moose Milligan]

37 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

Means is an interesting consideration. On the positive, he's young, performing and under control. In theory, he's the type of player you build around, not the type you trade away. However, those peripherals and at least the one scouting report posted in the Means thread really do temper the enthusiasm around him. 

This is where the scouts earn their money. If the projections for Means are a #4/5 pitcher, but his value is higher (perhaps significantly), I think you have to consider trading him regardless of how young and cheap he is. In fact, that young and cheap part would increase his value too. It's tough to get rid of a guy who could be a future rotation fixture though. Do you trade away a young, cheap, very slightly less version of Wei-Yin Chen? That's hard to do.

Some of the peripherals are worrisome, specifically the 4.17 FIP compared to his 2.33 ERA.  If I'm understanding this correctly, he's benefitting greatly from our defense.  Which is something I never thought I'd say about any of our pitchers.

Let THAT sink in for a minute.

The thing that gives me some semblance of hope is that the 7.7 K rate is pretty solid.  Not elite, but he's not a guy that's around 4 or 5 and we're waiting for the other shoe to inevitably drop.  And the bb/K rate is 3.30, not terrible either.

The thing I like most, he battles.  The other day he had something like 30 pitches in the first inning, didn't have his best stuff and still went 6.  He figured it out.  THAT is awesome.

I think Means would really benefit from developing a solid 3rd pitch, something that can keep hitters guessing.  Right now he seems pretty much like a fastball/changeup guy which has been working but we'll see how the league adjusts.  If he can develop a better breaking ball or even a cutter just so he can give batters a different look,  I think he could be really solid.  Certainly don't think he's an ace, but he could be a really good #3.  

 

[Frobby]

23 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

IMO, if the player is a free agent at the end of the year (as Cashner is, right?  Pretty sure he is) then salary relief isn't as big of a deal. 

Not that it’s likely, but the O’s have an option on Cashner for 2020 that vests if he throws 187 innings — he’s on pace for 182 right now.   His highest past innings total was 184.1, so I’m not too worried about that contingency, but it’s theoretically possible.    Of course, to approach that number he’d have to have a very good season and stay 100% healthy.    

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

32 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

IMO, if the player is a free agent at the end of the year (as Cashner is, right?  Pretty sure he is) then salary relief isn't as big of a deal.  If we trade him near the deadline, that's only a few months salary we'd still be partially (I'm assuming no one would take his entire salary) still responsible.  He figures into the budget for the rest of this year only...if he was slated to be on the 2020 and 2021 payrolls I'd be more inclined to be excited about salary relief.  At this point I just want to get a piece or two back for him and call it a day.

Orioles seem to be budget conscious these days and I think any pennies Elias can divert to player development he will.

If Cashner can land an O’Day (pitcher who just needs a fresh start) in his prime bullpen arm or under appreciated hitter that would be huge.