The New Cavalry?

[interloper]

1. DL Hall
2. Grayson Rodriguez
3. Keegan Akin
4. Zac Lowther
5. Dean Kremer
6. Sedlock/Harvey?

The relative success of these guys in the minors this year has me hopeful for a sort of new SP "cavalry", a term oft-mentioned during the 00's dark ages. Maybe we actually hit on a couple guys this time? 

[glenn__davis]

38 minutes ago, interloper said:

1. DL Hall
2. Grayson Rodriguez
3. Keegan Akin
4. Zac Lowther
5. Dean Kremer
6. Sedlock/Harvey?

The relative success of these guys in the minors this year has me hopeful for a sort of new SP "cavalry", a term oft-mentioned during the 00's dark ages. Maybe we actually hit on a couple guys this time? 

The original "Cavalry" has gotten a bad rap over the years in my most humble of opinions.   The Big 4 there really were Matusz, Tillman, Arrieta and Britton.  Those 4 produced:

Tillman - Above average starter on a contending Orioles team.  De facto ace of the staff that really had no true #1.

Matusz - Decent LOOGY, albeit for not a very long time.

Britton - One of the best relief pitchers in the game for several years.

Arrieta - CY award winner....just not with us.

Ultimately those 4 produced about as well as could reasonably be expected.  The only real negative is that none developed as a true shutdown ace for us.  Arrieta finding himself elsewhere really was the killer.

[OFFNY]

21 minutes ago, glenn__davis said:

 

The original "Cavalry" has gotten a bad rap over the years in my most humble of opinions.   The Big 4 there really were Matusz, Tillman, Arrieta and Britton.  Those 4 produced:

Tillman - Above average starter on a contending Orioles team.  De facto ace of the staff that really had no true #1.

Matusz - Decent LOOGY, albeit for not a very long time.

Britton - One of the best relief pitchers in the game for several years.

Arrieta - CY award winner....just not with us.

Ultimately those 4 produced about as well as could reasonably be expected.  The only real negative is that none developed as a true shutdown ace for us.  Arrieta finding himself elsewhere really was the killer.

 

o

 

Also, Brad Bergesen had that 2-month stretch in 2009 which saw him pitch so effectively that he wound up being in the top-5 for the AL Rookie of the Year award ........ and then the line drive back to the mound that broke his leg ended that very promising season. He was never the same after that, with the lone exception being the CG-Shutout that he threw in May of 2011 as a final moment of Major League glory for him.

 

 

 

o

[Jammer7]

Blaine Knight and Mike Baumann should be in the conversation somewhere in the back end as well. And maybe Ofelky Peralta too if he can keep his delivery together. Overall, and it’s early, but the Chris Holt era has been a resounding success. Maybe unfair to some of the previous guys to say it is Holt, or the new regime in general, but the way many have broken out this year has to be appreciated. Baumann, Peralta, Sedlock and Harvey have shown marked improvement. Maybe Harvey’s performance is only encouraging because he has stayed healthy so far, but that is huge for his continued development. 

I would say that some of the original cavalry, in retrospect, was not handled well developmentally and/or at the major league level. I think the situation is different in this regime, but really too early to tell. Britton and Tillman were failures with one more season to break out when they found something that clicked. Dave Wallace and Dom Chiti saved Britton for us. Tillman, not sure if it was Wallace/Chiti or Peterson, but he was headed nowhere until he learned to pitch that 4S up in the zone and work the CB off that. Matusz was underwhelming for the high pick he was, but I’ll agree we got some solid work from him as a LOOGY. I do remember the Bergesen hype, and that made me shake me head then and now. I was never a believer. 

I like that Mike Elias is not a “hype” guy. He doesn’t try to create expectations or mania about young players. He tempers things with a lot of, “He is doing well. We’ll see what he does here when Sig feels they are ready to contribute here.” 

[mdbdotcom]

Take 10 talented pitchers in the low minors and four might ever sniff the majors. Pitching is a position of attrition. There's no way of knowing how many of these guys will be healthy enough and be coachable enough to make it beyond the minor leagues.

[ThomasTomasz]

8 minutes ago, Jammer7 said:

Blaine Knight and Mike Baumann should be in the conversation somewhere in the back end as well. And maybe Ofelky Peralta too if he can keep his delivery together. Overall, and it’s early, but the Chris Holt era has been a resounding success. Maybe unfair to some of the previous guys to say it is Holt, or the new regime in general, but the way many have broken out this year has to be appreciated. Baumann, Peralta, Sedlock and Harvey have shown marked improvement. Maybe Harvey’s performance is only encouraging because he has stayed healthy so far, but that is huge for his continued development. 

I would say that some of the original cavalry, in retrospect, was not handled well developmentally and/or at the major league level. I think the situation is different in this regime, but really too early to tell. Britton and Tillman were failures with one more season to break out when they found something that clicked. Dave Wallace and Dom Chiti saved Britton for us. Tillman, not sure if it was Wallace/Chiti or Peterson, but he was headed nowhere until he learned to pitch that 4S up in the zone and work the CB off that. Matusz was underwhelming for the high pick he was, but I’ll agree we got some solid work from him as a LOOGY. I do remember the Bergesen hype, and that made me shake me head then and now. I was never a believer. 

I like that Mike Elias is not a “hype” guy. He doesn’t try to create expectations or mania about young players. He tempers things with a lot of, “He is doing well. We’ll see what he does here when Sig feels they are ready to contribute here.” 

The guys drafted in the past two drafts should be credited to John Wasdin as well, as he had a lot of influence in those selections, which I believe were analytically driven given his time with the Athletics (at least as much as can be, given our limited information and what he took with him.) 

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

It’s doubtful any prospects valued by Elias are going to have their service clocks started this year. 

[scbalt52]

1 hour ago, interloper said:

1. DL Hall
2. Grayson Rodriguez
3. Keegan Akin
4. Zac Lowther
5. Dean Kremer
6. Sedlock/Harvey?

The relative success of these guys in the minors this year has me hopeful for a sort of new SP "cavalry", a term oft-mentioned during the 00's dark ages. Maybe we actually hit on a couple guys this time? 

We also have an interesting secondary tier of pitching prospects where we could snag a few good ones:

Michael Baumann, Drew Rom, Ofelky Peralta, Alex Wells, Bruce Zimmerman, & Cameron Bishop

[esmd]

Adam Loewen was also part of the cavalry, wasn't he?  What might've been with him, smh.

I'm excited to see which of these guys might pan out (I assume we'll see Akin first, possibly in the 2nd half), plus the positional guys (Sisco, Hays, Diaz, Mountcastle, etc.).  I'm hoping we see some or even all of those guys in the 2nd half as well.

[jabba72]

 

2 hours ago, interloper said:

1. DL Hall
2. Grayson Rodriguez
3. Keegan Akin
4. Zac Lowther
5. Dean Kremer
6. Sedlock/Harvey?

The relative success of these guys in the minors this year has me hopeful for a sort of new SP "cavalry", a term oft-mentioned during the 00's dark ages. Maybe we actually hit on a couple guys this time? 

The top four pitchers on this list might be arriving in different seasons if we're to believe Elias is going to stick to his plan of level by level development.

[TGO]

1 hour ago, esmd said:

Adam Loewen was also part of the cavalry, wasn't he?  What might've been with him, smh.

I'm excited to see which of these guys might pan out (I assume we'll see Akin first, possibly in the 2nd half), plus the positional guys (Sisco, Hays, Diaz, Mountcastle, etc.).  I'm hoping we see some or even all of those guys in the 2nd half as well.

Loewen was several years earlier, made his debut in 2006.

David Hernandez also was part of the cavalry and has carved out a 10-year career for himself, and still going at age 34.

[atomic]

3 hours ago, glenn__davis said:

The original "Cavalry" has gotten a bad rap over the years in my most humble of opinions.   The Big 4 there really were Matusz, Tillman, Arrieta and Britton.  Those 4 produced:

Tillman - Above average starter on a contending Orioles team.  De facto ace of the staff that really had no true #1.

Matusz - Decent LOOGY, albeit for not a very long time.

 Britton - One of the best relief pitchers in the game for several years.

Arrieta - CY award winner....just not with us.

 Ultimately those 4 produced about as well as could reasonably be expected.  The only real negative is that none developed as a true shutdown ace for us.  Arrieta finding himself elsewhere really was the killer.

Matusz didn't produce anything. And he was rated the #5 prospect in baseball right before he joined the big club. 

[interloper]

3 hours ago, glenn__davis said:

The original "Cavalry" has gotten a bad rap over the years in my most humble of opinions.   The Big 4 there really were Matusz, Tillman, Arrieta and Britton.  Those 4 produced:

Tillman - Above average starter on a contending Orioles team.  De facto ace of the staff that really had no true #1.

Matusz - Decent LOOGY, albeit for not a very long time.

Britton - One of the best relief pitchers in the game for several years.

Arrieta - CY award winner....just not with us.

Ultimately those 4 produced about as well as could reasonably be expected.  The only real negative is that none developed as a true shutdown ace for us.  Arrieta finding himself elsewhere really was the killer.

I think this is fair in that most of these guys would go on to have successful careers. However, we didn't get what we hoped, which was 4 or 5 good homegrown starting pitchers. And that's probably an unfair expectation/hope. Loewen was in this convo as well and flamed out even worse than Matusz did.

My hope is that our development process makes more sense now. There's structure and purpose behind it. We feel a little better set up to turn the next crop (honestly, the next NEXT crop as I consider Bundy/Gausman a cavalry of their own) into some resembling a successful rotation. 

 

[atomic]

6 minutes ago, interloper said:

I think this is fair in that most of these guys would go on to have successful careers. However, we didn't get what we hoped, which was 4 or 5 good homegrown starting pitchers. And that's probably an unfair expectation/hope. Loewen was in this convo as well and flamed out even worse than Matusz did.

My hope is that our development process makes more sense now. There's structure and purpose behind it. We feel a little better set up to turn the next crop (honestly, the next NEXT crop as I consider Bundy/Gausman a cavalry of their own) into some resembling a successful rotation. 

  

Add Harvey.  It was Harvey/Bundy/Gausman that were going to lead us to great success.  

[Yachtsman]

Ahhhhh!!! He said the word!!! Without saying the dreaded word, the best players in the Orioles system, including pitchers, are at the lowest levels, so the wait will be painful but hopefully worth it. I am very interested in this year’s draft. It really starts the true rebuild from the ground up at that point.