Orioles trade Cashner to Red Sox

[atomic]

1 hour ago, LocoChris said:

Yikes.

Not exactly a ringing endorsement of Buck Showalter is it?

Well besides Cashner who on the team from last  is better this year? Mancini?   I don't see any other improvements.  

[HowAboutThat]

23 minutes ago, atomic said:

 

 

He is not a fifth starter.  Look at we gave up for Norris and Feldman.  Cashner is better than them. 

True and valid, but Norris had two more years. That was a very good trade. And Feldman was more about dumping Arietta and showing how stupid Duquette is. That was a very bad trade.

Mike is not Dan, and it is way too early to be passing judgement on him.

[atomic]

2 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

This is a funny place.  We all go crazy on J2 when Elias signs a bunch of guys just like this.  And then we trade an average ML starter for two guys that are just like J2 types and...all of a sudden it's a big letdown.  

Why were we crazy for the guys Elias signed on July 2nd. None were top rated players.  None were big dollar signings.  

[LocoChris]

4 minutes ago, atomic said:

Well besides Cashner who on the team from last  is better this year? Mancini?   I don't see any other improvements.  

Our team is a lot different from last year...

[Lucky_13]

22 minutes ago, atomic said:

 

 

He is not a fifth starter.  Look at we gave up for Norris and Feldman.  Cashner is better than 

Norris had 2.5 years of control left and Arrieta and Strop were considered spare parts by the Orioles at the time. Come on man. 

[Lucky_13]

1 minute ago, Lucky_13 said:

Norris had 2.5 years of control left and Arrieta and Strop were considered spare parts by the Orioles at the time. Come on man. 

Not to mention Norris had more then a half a season of recent success.

[Tryptamine]

25 minutes ago, atomic said:

 

 

He is not a fifth starter.  Look at we gave up for Norris and Feldman.  Cashner is better than them. 

Not really. Feldman had a 3.46ERA 3.93FIP 3.83xFIP when the Cubs traded him to the Orioles. Cashner has a 3.83ERA 4.25FIP 4.88xFIP.

[atomic]

13 minutes ago, atomic said:

Well besides Cashner who on the team from last  is better this year? Mancini?   I don't see any other improvements.  

Why would anyone downvote this?  I was asking who has improved? If you think I missed anyone please tell me.  Villar hasn't improved, Bundy did not improve, Givens didn't improve.  Castro didn't improve.  Bleier didn't improve.  Hess didn't improve.  Wright didn't improve.  Davis didn't improve.  

[Hallas]

44 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Some folks valued the stability that Cashner provided over a light return.

Can I be both nonplussed at the return while also not really expecting more?  We got two lottery tickets for a functioning major leaguer.  I'm not really upset though because the team is so bad that the lottery tickets are worth more than a currently-functioning major leaguer.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Hallas said:

Can I be both nonplussed at the return while also not really expecting more?  We got two lottery tickets for a functioning major leaguer.  I'm not really upset though because the team is so bad that the lottery tickets are worth more than a currently-functioning major leaguer.

I'll allow it.

[atomic]

10 minutes ago, Tryptamine said:

Not really. Feldman had a 3.46ERA 3.93FIP 3.83xFIP when the Cubs traded him to the Orioles. Cashner has a 3.83ERA 4.25FIP 4.88xFIP.

Feldman wasn't playing with the ball they have this year and was in the National League.  Not pitching in Camden Yards.  Cashner's WAR is over twice what Feldman's was at the time. And if you look at the 3 years before the trade Cashner's was tremendously better. 

[Baroquen131]

6 minutes ago, atomic said:

Why were we crazy for the guys Elias signed on July 2nd. None were top rated players.  None were big dollar signings.  

We were enthused that the club signed J2 guys at all. Because we haven't. In years. You know that. And you know that it's more the laying groundwork rather than the actual guys signed. (And we won't know if any of those guys overachieve for years anyway... )

Your call for Elias to be fired over this trade is ridiculous. After Cashner's poor work last year, and his questionable advanced stats this year, and the fact that's he's a rental... you're not going to get anything flashy for him. Don't like the trade? Sure. I can agree with that. Calling for Elias to be fired? Wow... quite the "hot take". 

[atomic]

16 minutes ago, Lucky_13 said:

Norris had 2.5 years of control left and Arrieta and Strop were considered spare parts by the Orioles at the time. Come on man. 

Cashner has an option year.  I would rather have spare parts like Arrieta and Strop than 17 year olds in the DSL. 

[NattyO's]

I think Elias knows more about this game than most of us. Im going to trust his process for a couple years before i start judging.  

[foxfield]

17 minutes ago, atomic said:

Why would anyone downvote this?  I was asking who has improved? If you think I missed anyone please tell me.  Villar hasn't improved, Bundy did not improve, Givens didn't improve.  Castro didn't improve.  Bleier didn't improve.  Hess didn't improve.  Wright didn't improve.  Davis didn't improve.  

Well the manager is improved. So is the GM. Ownership has shown improvement and the Orioles are improved in the analytics Dept and the international market. They have dumped salary. The team is playing at least at the same level as last year, but there are signs of improvement everywhere. Of course it’s not off to the World Series for these Orioles. Attendance still stinks and the team is on pace to garner its second straight #1 draft pick.

 

But I’m with you man. Fire the GM. Oh wait. That’s absurd. You of course know this...I’m gonna wait until he extends Davis or trade Rutschman for a couple 17 yr olds before I join your bandwagon. But it shall be noted that you were first. I’ll just say I hope your wrong for awhile.