Montanez on the bench...again

[McLovin]

Payton hasn't looked good in CF either...

Alberto Castillo would disagree. There would be three or more runs built into his ERA if it weren't for Payton. Payton can make big league plays in CF.

It's unfair to the pitchers to put Montanez in CF at this time - much like you can't play Cintron over Castro. If there is anything 'young' about our team, it's the pitching staff. They need all the help they can get behind them.

[Waryn]

Well then show me evidence that Montanez can't play CF and that Payton is a better defender than him there.

I don't see any...

I'm going on the fact that the player himself has said "I DO NOT FEEL COMFORTABLE OUT THERE AND I AM STILL LEARNING THE POSITION"

[ledzepp8]

I'm sick of seeing this statement. Where's the proof that he's worse than Payton? Payton hasn't looked good in CF either...

How about from the man's own mouth, the coaching staff/scouts that have worked with him and seen him play, and Dave Trembley who managed him in the minors? How long did you manage him JTrea? Just so I can get a comparison...:scratchchinhmm:

[SilentJames]

I'm sick of seeing this statement. Where's the proof that he's worse than Payton? Payton hasn't looked good in CF either...

ARE YOU SERIOUS J?

Have you seen the last couple of games out there? Payton is a very solid defender and plays a very solid CF.

[Waryn]

ARE YOU SERIOUS J?

Have you seen the last couple of games out there? Payton is a very solid defender and plays a very solid CF.

J doesn't watch games he's all about Boxscores and Stats.

[YardBirds13]

But this is his role. If he was an Oriole out of ST next year, this is the role he plays.

If Luis Montanez is an Oriole next year, this is what he would be doing. He is not a starter so why should he be getting starter reps here?

Because I want him to get as many ML AB's as possible. Show if you can hit ML pitching or not. IF he plays a ton, and looks like his AAA numbers, then you move on. No harm done. If he shows he can hit ML pitching with consistency, you have him as the 4th OF next year.

Seriously, what is it hurting to not get him the max amount of AB's you can? I'm not saying to play him in center (although that would be nice, DT isn't stupid. If he could play there at all, he'd be there.), I'm just saying I'd like to see him play as much as possible.

[Roll Tide]

He will get a start at DH. He's got a role with this team. He is getting a legit chance.

Scottie, He should be in the line up everyday. I am ok with the idea of not playing him in CF.

[JTrea81]

How about from the man's own mouth, the coaching staff/scouts that have worked with him and seen him play, and Dave Trembley who managed him in the minors? How long did you manage him JTrea? Just so I can get a comparison...:scratchchinhmm:

Montanez hasn't said he's worse than Payton, just that he's adjusting to the big leagues. Now I admit he's shooting himself in the foot by saying he's not quite comfortable yet, but at some point you need to play the guy regardless if he's going to have a shot. He can adjust all he wants, but I think the offensive advantage of Montanez, far outweighs the defensive decline (if any) from Jay Payton vs. RHP. Payton can always be put in the game as a defensive sub in the later innings if it's close and of course should play vs. LHP. But Montanez needs to prove he can't play CF for me not to stick him out there everyday vs. RHP.

[casadeozo]

A legit chance at what!? Seriously, he is 26 years old and has never performed over AA. He has more AAA ABs than ABs this year and has put up a .248 BA and a career OPS of under 700.

He has a chance of being a fourth outfielder, and that is what they are playing him as. Part of being that guy is going games without playing and still performing.

Wow what an uneducated comment. The guy was on pace to win the triple crown in AA. He's 26 years old, not 36. He's a former #3 overall pick. He obviously is loaded with talent. Maybe it took a few years for him to realize his enormous potential. The team is going nowhere this year. This is the time you give playing time to those that may be contributing for the next few years. This idea is so simple.

BTW Silent James are you familiar with Jeremy Guthrie? He's our current #1 starter

[YardBirds13]

ARE YOU SERIOUS J?

Have you seen the last couple of games out there? Payton is a very solid defender and plays a very solid CF.

I'm in no way agreeing with JTrea here, because I don't think Lou can handle CF right now or he would be playing there.

However, Jay is not great in CF. He made a couple GREAT catches the other day, but he isn't anything more than average out there.

[NCRaven]

The Orioles have 0 chance of overtaking Boston, New York, & Tampa. So these games are meaningless in regards to Win & Losses.

I just don't think many here understand that managing a team in our situation is a tight rope walk. MacPhail and Trembley have multiple obligations in this situation, to the future of the team, to the players on the roster now, to the fans who have paid hundreds and even thousands of dollars for season tickets. They have to try to build for the future AND win every game as they come up on the schedule. They have to balance multiple goals and issues.

It's not cut and dried that on June 3rd you realize you're not going to make the playoffs, so you play any scrub (yeah, I mean the Knott's, House's, Montanez's and Salazar's of the world) that might have a shot at a 24th or 25th spot on the roster next year. Payton and Quiroz have proven themselves, either this season or over a pretty decent career, to be competent ML bench players. No one that we've had as a middle infield reserve has done anything but suck, but that isn't Trembley's fault and has nothing to do with Montanez or Salazar (or Reimold for that matter). And, the lack of a 4th bench player has been entirely the fault of a starting rotation that spent two months unable to get through 5 innings and probably hasn't had any impact on our overall won-loss record, anyway.

I'm just not convinced that

- Not playing Montanez is the end of the world.

- Trembley is an idiot that doesn't know his job as well as we do.

- This is an issue worth getting really excited about. Certainly not worth all the:cussing:

[McLovin]

Because I want him to get as many ML AB's as possible. Show if you can hit ML pitching or not. IF he plays a ton, and looks like his AAA numbers, then you move on. No harm done.

Ah, no harm done. You realize defense counts right? Defense affects pitchers. We're trying to evaluate pitchers. We need to know if guys like Garret Olson are part of the long term solution. They deserve a major league defense behind them.

[YardBirds13]

Ah, no harm done. You realize defense counts right? Defense affects pitchers. We're trying to evaluate pitchers. We need to know if guys like Garret Olson are part of the long term solution. They deserve a major league defense behind them.

Come on McLovin. Read my posts. Where have I said to play Lou in CF? Never.

I just want him in the line-up as much as possible. I don't even have a problem with him sitting tonight, as long as it doesn't keep happening.

Get him two starts a week in LF and a couple more at DH. Let him pile up some AB's against major league pitching. THAT'S what I meant by no harm done if he fails.

[Roll Tide]

Now read those AAA numbers s-l-o-w-l-y.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/M/luis-montanez.shtml

We KNOW what we have here. You are HONESTLY advocating moving Nick Markakis out of his comfort zone so we can give a guy who MIGHT BE a FOURTH OUTFIELDER a chance?

A guy who has admitted he is unsure about fielding his position? This is what Luis' role will be next year IF he makes the team.

I dont care about his previous numbers James. He is a former #3 pick. He could be a late bloomer. The games the O's are playing now dont matter. He might only ever be a 4th OF ... maybe not even that... But he maybe be the next version of Guthrie. If thats the case the Orioles can afford to find out.

Yes I wont mind moving Nick temporarily ... I'd bet he'd do whats best for the club long term. I'm sure he knows that Payton is not part of the Orioles future!

[utvolzac]

Without question the odd man out at this point in the season is Kevin Millar.

Mora, we are stuck with next year.

Huff is hitting well and will be here next year.

Scott has a role with the team for the next few years.

Millar is a free agent and in his late 30's. He is clearly the odd man out.

Montanez at one time had potential. He might never be more than a 4th outfielder. But he might be a Guthrie part II, where the light comes on for a player to realize his talent, later in his career.

Regardless, it's worth it for the Orioles to find out what they have. Even if it's a just a 4th outfielder, at least he can contribute something to the team for the next few years. Millar on the other hand is easily the most replacable and with Huff firmly entrenched at DH and Tex being targeted as a must get, Millar most likely isn't going to be a factor next year anyway.

Besides that, you can still be the head cheerleader from the bench. Montanez on the other hand needs as many at bats as he can get, to be fairly evaluated.