MLB Lockout Thread

[maybenxtyr]

29 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

People keep saying this but what sport does this? 
 

All sports start the younger players off at less money.  So, just so some middling vets get don’t get paid as much, you want to totally change this?

Im all for these guys getting paid more.  Perhaps instead of making 1.5-2M in their first 3 years, they can make closer to 5M.  Something like that.  But I don’t feel the need to say we need to pay these pre arb guys 15-30M for those first 3 years.  

Most sports are not paying the league minimum for several years. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. They could implement a structure that steps up in increments, and there will still be players that hang in that league minimum category for a few years. 

 

I never said pay 15-30 million.

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, maybenxtyr said:

Most sports are not paying the league minimum for several years. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. They could implement a structure that steps up in increments, and there will still be players that hang in that league minimum category for a few years. 

 

I never said pay 15-30 million.

If you are paying them arbitration right out of the gate, the numbers are getting that high.

And yes, with the NFL and their slotting system, the contracts are essentially league minimum and they aren’t guaranteed.

NBA is similar.

In any of these sports, you don’t start making the real money until your second contract. For a MLB player, they start making more in their 4th season and it grows from there.

Again, I’m all for paying them more but I don’t feel the need to pay them way more just to avoid paying Jordan Lyles 7M.  
 

Those guys shouldn’t be paid that money under any system but to sit there and pay unproven guys big money isn’t the answer either.

I like an incentive based system for these guys and I would have no issue if they all became arb eligible after 2 full seasons but, at a minimum, the first 2 years should be cheap.

[Sports Guy]

 

[Frobby]

49 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If you are paying them arbitration right out of the gate, the numbers are getting that high.

Not necessarily.   Seniority is expressly a factor to be weighed in deciding arbitration awards, and presumably that would be true if players were made eligible earlier.   At the same time, there certainly might be some awards that were higher than the owners would like.  

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Frobby said:

Not necessarily.   Seniority is expressly a factor to be weighed in deciding arbitration awards, and presumably that would be true if players were made eligible earlier.   At the same time, there certainly might be some awards that were higher than the owners would like.  

If you go arb right out of the gate, the rules as we know the now will also likely go away.  It would be an entirely new system.

And btw, it also means paying huge money in those years 4-6.  People just aren’t thinking this through.  It’s a terrible suggestion to give them arb immediately and really pay them big money out of the gate.

Definitely increase pay…perhaps even incentivize stuff like has been discussed.  Maybe even make everyone a super 2.  Stuff like that.  But those “cheap” years should stay.

[maybenxtyr]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

If you go arb right out of the gate, the rules as we know the now will also likely go away.  It would be an entirely new system.

And btw, it also means paying huge money in those years 4-6.  People just aren’t thinking this through.  It’s a terrible suggestion to give them arb immediately and really pay them big money out of the gate.

Definitely increase pay…perhaps even incentivize stuff like has been discussed.  Maybe even make everyone a super 2.  Stuff like that.  But those “cheap” years should stay.

You get 1 season at the minimum and then have structured increases or escalators from there. 

 

Paying someone because of the talent they bring is not a bad idea. The final year of arbitration for a guy like Juan Soto will almost always be a better idea than pretty much any year of whatever contract Kris Bryant gets this year.

[justD]

 

[Sports Guy]

It really sounds like the MLBPA isn’t willing to negotiate much and the owners seem to be in the same spot.

Either someone is going to move on these demands in a big way or the season isn’t starting for a while.    
 

They are at least meeting but momentum isn’t there whatsoever for any kind of a deal.  

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

It really sounds like the MLBPA isn’t willing to negotiate much and the owners seem to be in the same spot.

Either someone is going to move on these demands in a big way or the season isn’t starting for a while.    
 

They are at least meeting but momentum isn’t there whatsoever for any kind of a deal.  

I think once it gets to the point in which we are looking at a four week spring training and a full season they will have a breakthrough and get a deal done.

[Sports Guy]

32 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think once it gets to the point in which we are looking at a four week spring training and a full season they will have a breakthrough and get a deal done.

That’s Feb 28.  

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

That’s Feb 28.  

They could push it to the first week in March, squeeze a few off days off the schedule or push back the playoffs a few days.

What is encouraging to me is that it looks to be money and not basic ideology.

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

They could push it to the first week in March, squeeze a few off days off the schedule or push back the playoffs a few days.

What is encouraging to me is that it looks to be money and not basic ideology.

So the talk is they will meet everyday this week.  With the 28th being the deadline that has been imposed, my guess is they may meet everyday until then or, at the very least, maybe take the day off on Saturday to try to get things done the last 2 days.

I think if they are still far apart after the 28th, talks will shut down.  They aren’t going to just meet everyday I don’t think.  Most likely mediation would need to come in after that.

[OriolesMagic83]

I think the biggest difference is the MLBPA wants to make almost all year 3 players arbitration eligible.  It seems like for the owners, this is a non starters.  I can definitely see it, especially for smaller franchises.  No doubt the owners feel if they move arbitration to 35-40% of 3rd year players, next CBA it will be 50%+. 

[Roll Tide]

I’ve honestly stayed away from the baseball discussion during the lockout as I don’t have the stomach to agonize over it. Baseball players have it best because of their union. The guaranteed contracts that pays guys even when they are no longer productive is as broke as anything the players are asking for the other way. Honestly, baseball stopped being fun for me when baseball forced the Gnats into DC making the Orioles a small to mid market team.

[Sports Guy]

50 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I’ve honestly stayed away from the baseball discussion during the lockout as I don’t have the stomach to agonize over it. Baseball players have it best because of their union. The guaranteed contracts that pays guys even when they are no longer productive is as broke as anything the players are asking for the other way. Honestly, baseball stopped being fun for me when baseball forced the Gnats into DC making the Orioles a small to mid market team.

NBA has guaranteed contracts too.