“Winning Fixes Everything”

[tntoriole]

5 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

 

I would assume anyone in a position like his would have known about the cheating or at least about the general culture that facilitated it. However, people that are part of an organization have different levels of responsibility. Was it his idea? Did he order people to do it? I don't think we have any evidence of that although I have not read the book. Maybe he did nothing to oppose it but that happens all the time in big organizations. 

I think the fact that Sig and Eve followed him from the Astros to the O's is a solid indicator that he is not a toxic person. 

 

Have not read the book, but media distortion and smearing  sounds  like the case if politics and extramarital life is included.  I care less about either.  Obviously the cheating issue could be a problem but it has been years now and nothing really there for Elias as of yet. 
I agree very much that one measure of interpersonal leadership is both the quality of people who come work for you and the stability of their tenures.  By all appearances, he has had excellent results up and down the organization .. Sig, Perez. 

[crowmst3k!]

6 hours ago, Yardball85 said:

Agreed.  While I don't like hearing about the cheating on his spouse, Elias has given me every reason to like him as a baseball fan.  And that is what I care about. 

I met Allie before I met Mike. There didn't seem to be any smoke there, let alone fire.  

[interloper]

It's certainly hard to reconcile the version of Elias in the book versus what we've seen over the past 4 years. Not re: the politics, but just in general. He seems like a super nice, respectful guy. But I guess to be in these high profile jobs, you have to be pretty good at putting on a face. That said, his team seems to all be smart and pulling in the same direction. The vibes all seem very good, from the coaching staff to the front office. I would think his team runs the spectrum politically, too, so it's not like he's packing the room with one type of person, or yes-men, etc.

That said, it's the Orioles, and it's proooobably only a matter of time before we start to hear of some kind of Warehouse drama. Right now it's been contained to Angelos, which is nice and familiar at least. But Elias seems to be running a well-oiled machine in the baseball ops department. 

Edited February 20, 2023 by interloper

[Tony-OH]

8 hours ago, wildcard said:

We don't need to a tell all book to explain Mike Elias to us.   He has been here for 4 years.   I think most of us know what kind of guy he is.

Do we? Or do we know the results of how he's run the organization so far? Other then meeting him a few times (Very cordial and seemed like a good guy) and interviews, I don't think I know him as a person at all.

Perhaps you've had personal conversations with him and know him better or perhaps you judge people by their press pesona. 

Now I don't know or care about his politics or anything else that would be "personal" in nature. I care whether he can put a consistent playoff contender on the field year in and year out. The rest is just noise. 

There are very few people in the world that I've met that no one has anything bad to say about. I really don't care what could possibly come out about how Elias got to where he is at this point. He just needs to show me a winning team on the major league field.

[RZNJ]

Here's a hypothetical for you.   You're the assistant GM.   You know your team is cheating with the video/garbage lid system.   You don't think it's right.   The players and manager are ok with it and the GM is ok with it.   Do you keep your mouth shut or be the guy who turns your own team in?

We're looking for honesty here!

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Here's a hypothetical for you.   You're the assistant GM.   You know your team is cheating with the video/garbage lid system.   You don't think it's right.   The players and manager are ok with it and the GM is ok with it.   Do you keep your mouth shut or be the guy who turns your own team in?

We're looking for honesty here!

I'd keep my mouth shut.

Here's a hypothetical for you.  You're the assistant GM.  You know your team is cheating with the video/garbage lid system.  You think it's fine.  The players and manager are OK with it and the GM is OK with it.  Do you distance yourself from the whole mess when the house of cards come tumbling down?

We're looking for honestly here!

 

 

[wildcard]

8 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Do we? Or do we know the results of how he's run the organization so far? Other then meeting him a few times (Very cordial and seemed like a good guy) and interviews, I don't think I know him as a person at all.

Perhaps you've had personal conversations with him and know him better or perhaps you judge people by their press pesona. 

Now I don't know or care about his politics or anything else that would be "personal" in nature. I care whether he can put a consistent playoff contender on the field year in and year out. The rest is just noise. 

There are very few people in the world that I've met that no one has anything bad to say about. I really don't care what could possibly come out about how Elias got to where he is at this point. He just needs to show me a winning team on the major league field.

We know he is consistent following the same objective since Nov of 2018. 

We know he is loyal to the people he respects like Sig, Hyde and Holt.

We know he is a good organizer putting a farm system together.

We know he has a long term vision that includes building with international talent.

We know he is a good communicator.

We know he will give women employees a chance.

We know he loves to scout and does not forget the ones he liked years ago.

I can go on and on but I think we know a lot about  Mike Elias.

 

 

[RZNJ]

14 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'd keep my mouth shut.

Here's a hypothetical for you.  You're the assistant GM.  You know your team is cheating with the video/garbage lid system.  You think it's fine.  The players and manager are OK with it and the GM is OK with it.  Do you distance yourself from the whole mess when the house of cards come tumbling down?

We're looking for honestly here!

 

 

Depends what you mean by distance yourself.   Please give me something to go with.     Sure, I keep my mouth shut and hope they don't come after me.    If I'm interviewed it gets pretty tricky.   

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Depends what you mean by distance yourself.   Please give me something to go with.     Sure, I keep my mouth shut and hope they don't come after me.    If I'm interviewed it gets pretty tricky.   

I'd say something like:

Quote

“Yeah, it’s tough ... It’s a shame," he said during his own media availability at the event, which was held at the new Atlanta Braves spring training complex. “Obviously, the personal people involved, it’s been very difficult to watch what’s happened there. It’s also been disappointing to learn what we’ve seen about the things that happened in the 2017, 2018 time frame coming to light.”

Of course I'd say the same thing if I knew and didn't approve or didn't know.

[RZNJ]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'd say something like:

Of course I'd say the same thing if I knew and didn't approve or didn't know.

If I knew about it, I wouldn't make that comment.  Not in those words.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

If I knew about it, I wouldn't make that comment.  Not in those words.

I would say something of the sort.

Deny, deny deny until you have to come clean.

[RZNJ]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

I would say something of the sort.

Deny, deny deny until you have to come clean.

Maybe.  Tough to say until you're actually in that spot and your career/job is potentially on the line.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Maybe.  Tough to say until you're actually in that spot and your career/job is potentially on the line.

I don't think my job would be on the line if it came out I knew.  Look at what happened to those actually involved.

Now if it came out it was my plan that was implemented, that could be a different situation. 

[eddie83]

I have the book. Been reading it for a couple of days. I did not start on the first chapter but later on. 
 

- nothing on Elias personal life so far other than his politics. Could be something in there earlier. Drellich’s personal bias shines thru IMO

- Mike was Asst GM in title but was not really in reality the number 2 guy. He was more on his own with running scouting 

-Sig leaving was at worst mutual. I think organization was ready to move on. Sig would email Hinch about game decisions. His draft model did not have some of the new data from the hi tech stuff. That caused some issues. 
 

Basically Luhnow pushed people. He wanted people uncomfortable. 

 

The theme so far for me is about how driven and cost conscious the organization was. 

[eddie83]

Brandon Taubman is a big part of the book where I’ve been reading. He basically became Luhnow’s right hand man. Willing to please, Wall Street type. 
Had a heck of a downfall. 

Luhnow brought in McKinsey to oversee stuff in 2017. That created issues.  
 

Luhnow wanted tension. He hired a bunch of people from the outside world. 
 

A part of book is about scouting. Basically the TrackMan and other hi tech stuff replaced scouts. Bottom line is it works. Astros were before their time on this.