Ortiz down, Stowers up

[Frobby]

2 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

Makes sense. The sudden change of heart on Stowers, just seems odd after he was so quickly buried and demoted. Brought back up after just a week or two in Norfolk and batting fourth. There doesn’t seem to be a clear rhyme or reason for his treatment. 

I could offer reasons, but they’d be speculation.   I’d rather not.  I’m glad Stowers is getting another shot so quickly and hope he makes the most of it.  

[Tony-OH]

5 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

Makes sense. The sudden change of heart on Stowers, just seems odd after he was so quickly buried and demoted. Brought back up after just a week or two in Norfolk and batting fourth. There doesn’t seem to be a clear rhyme or reason for his treatment. 

I imagine they don't think Santander is 100% physically so they want to give him some time to heal. The thought of running Frazier out in RF vs Stowers didn't sit well with anyone.

[SteveA]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

Who’s not going to play to make room for Stowers playing 4-5 times a week?   I hope he’ll play more than last time, but he’s not playing 4-5 times a week unless someone gets hurt. 

Well he's basically replacing Vavra, so he can minimally get the AbS Vavra was getting -- EXCEPT that we saw 13 lefty starters in our first 27 games and now we will see right-handers in 9 of our next 10.

[Aristotelian]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

If Santander has nagging injuries and is struggling because of them why would they not put him on the 15 day IL when they have other options on the 40 that can fill in?

It's not as if they don't have other options and a hobbled Santander is being forced out there.

It doesn't make sense.

Its possible he is healthy and struggling. Its possible he is like 95% and they wanted to see if he could play through it and produce close to his 2022 level before shutting him down. I would not be surprised if he is shut down at some point. He already missed some games for a back injury and back injuries can often be of the lingering type. Admittedly I do not have hard proof but it is a reasonable belief with some circumstantial evidence.

[cheecks]

Not a fan of Stowers at all and I don't understand why he's batting cleanup of all places. Maybe Hyde has a good feeling about him today, who knows.

[eddie83]

Elias is so foolish to have created a 40 man roster with depth. How dare he. 

[eddie83]

17 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Well he's basically replacing Vavra, so he can minimally get the AbS Vavra was getting -- EXCEPT that we saw 13 lefty starters in our first 27 games and now we will see right-handers in 9 of our next 10.

Includes 7 in last 10. 

[LA2]

2 hours ago, Just Regular said:

I like the daily roster maximization.     I think most of us appreciate Elias as a representative of management giving talking points that sound plausible is just doing his job.

The best 26 players to win today fluctuate often, if you care about winning today.

If you don't, you purposely deploy reps to players outside the best 30, or best 50, or best 100, or ask Jorge Lopez to be a starting pitcher.

Some of what 2023 will reveal is if Elias is a strong tight poker player, and now he's getting his money into the pot.    More than these follow up moves in that spirit, the quick Cole Irvin hook is for me the transaction of the month.

This in particular I agree is indicative, as well as not waiting longer for Grayson to reestablish his command in Norfolk a month ago.

[sportsfan8703]

3 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

Because we're not facing a bunch of LHP? Stowers will now take the Vavra role and gets some OF starts. O'Hearn will continue to be pinch hitter, occasional 1B/DH. I'd like to see him a bit more. 

Brown and McDonald mentioned that Elias/Hyde have said now is time for winning so they are managing the roster that way. So if we’re facing a string of lefties, why not bring up Ortiz?

At least we’re not just trotting out the same lineup everyday. Heck, Stowers is batting 4th. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, LA2 said:

This in particular I agree is indicative, as well as not waiting longer for Grayson to reestablish his command in Norfolk a month ago.

I wonder if the lure of the draft pick was a factor?

[Billy F-Face3]

I think Stowers in cleanup playing RF and Santander taking a break is as much of a roster experiment as it is anything else. How does the team perform if Tony is not in the lineup and Stowers tries to take that role? Stay tuned, because we are about to find out!

(I'm speculating that this has implications for decisions leading up to the trade deadline.)

[Billy F-Face3]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

I wonder if the lure of the draft pick was a factor?

Good point. Could be.

[LA2]

46 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

An interesting thread to read through.

I'm fine with this move as long as Stowers is going to get "mostly" everyday PAs including at bats against lefties. Stowers has shown if he plays everyday he will produce. He has not shown the ability to be productive part-time, something many players struggle with.

Ortiz's demotion is a product of having an $8 million Frazier that Elias still feel a need to play. I do think most of the Elias "roster mismanagement" conversation starts with Elias's poor offseason and unneeded signing of Frazier. 

Even now, Frazier is miscast as an everyday player, but his salary dictates that he will be for the most part. As many of said when he was signed, even if Elias didn't believe in Mateo, he had plenty of internal options to overcome him if he struggled.

I mean, right now, who believes Frazier makes this team better than Ortiz? 

By sending Ortiz back to AAA, he's saying that he was no going to get everyday PAs and that's because between he already has four guys for three infield positions right now. This goes back to Elias' poor offseason where he was unwilling or unable to move guys that may have freed up this playing time allowing players like Ortiz and even Westburg to be in the majors contributing vs making Norfolk the best AAA team in all of baseball.

Now saying all that, the Orioles are 18-9 and playing very well so you can't be too down on Elias' major league roster moves. 

The way the team is made up right now, and knowing that Frazier is going nowhere anytime soon, sending Ortiz back down makes sense. If the plan is for Stowers to be an everyday player, including against left-handed pitching, then I applaud that move as well.

As I said before, there are plenty of PAs for him, Santander, and Hays and at the very least this should end Frazier playing corner outfield in anything but an emergency.

I get what you're saying above (in the bolded part),  but it just occurred to me that in a way I'm glad Elias did not trade away players with the intent of freeing up space for Ortiz, Westburg et al. Because in all likelihood that would have involved trading away Mateo on the strength of his fine defensive and stolen bases season. We would have definitely been robbed in that case.

Maybe ditto with Urias cresting with his GG.

The acquisition, however, of yet another infielder in Frazier--that one still puzzles me, although I have not been dismayed by his level of play per se.

Also, I believed at the time and still do that McCann and Gibson were good acquisitions.

Edited April 30, 2023 by LA2

[Sports Guy]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

No, what I want is for Westburg, Ortiz and Stowers/Cowser to all be up here and getting 4-5 starts a week. It’s not hard to do it.

No one on this roster should be playing everyday right now. Gunnar is the closest imo but until he figures out lefties, I don’t have an issue sitting him vs the BETTER lefties. 
 

Even Mullins, who can also be an everyday guy, should sit vs some of the tougher lefties at times.
 

 

Mateo should be playing everyday right now. Again, he can get the occasional day off or if they are still protecting the hip but while playing like this, he should be in there basically everyday.  Oversight on my part there.

[Mooreisbetter27]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I wonder if the lure of the draft pick was a factor?

Might’ve been a slight factor, but pitchers winning ROTY has become increasingly rare. 2 times in the last 10 years and one of those was Ohtani. 

If you count NL 5 out of the last 22.