A Look at Radhames Liz, Contest Winner

[TJ Wrangler]

EDIT: TO ALL READERS FOLLOWING THE LINK FROM CHRIS O'LEARY'S BLOG, PLEASE FOLLOW THE LINK BELOW TO MY RESPONSE TO HIM.

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76456

The idea to look at Liz was originally brought to me by Frobby. I initially expected his mechanics to be terrible. After a quick glance the other day, something surprised me. We'll see how that holds up after I take a more in depth brief look.

I really like this picture of Liz. All that is really bad is that his shoulder gets a little high, but it isn't too high. There is a small risk of shoulder issues, but I wouldn't say the risk is huge. His timing is excellent here, as his foot has just landed, his hips have rotated ahead of his shoulders (great hip/trunk separation), and his arm is in the high cocked position with the ball facing 3b. At the point of landing, there isn't too much to not like about Liz.

This picture is a good shot of Liz tilting his shoulders to use an overhand arm slot.

I also like how Liz is pronating his wrist at relase in this picture. This takes a lot of load off the elbow and adds movement to your pitch.

Another example of Liz's good timing. He's showing the ball to 3b and his elbow is slightly below shoulder level.

Here is a picture from his days with the Frederick Keys. I don't like how he's showing the ball to CF, but judging by other pictures, he appears to have fixed this fault. The real interesting thing here is how his timing is still great even as far back as a few years ago. This suggests that Liz has always had good mechanics in regards to timing, which completely shocked me.

This shot suggests that Liz does not break his hands with his elbows. He breaks his hands and swings his arm up into the high cocked position, which is less likely to cause a timing problem compared to lifting your elbows up and rotating your arm into the high cocked position.

Another example of great hip/trunk separation and good timing. I don't like how he's showing the ball to CF. This appears to be an inconsistency in his otherwise great delivery.

This image suggests that Liz strides towards his target leading with his heel, turning his heel at the last minute so he lands with his toe pointing to his target. Liz has solid lower body mechanics which explains why he gets great hip/shoulder separation and throws so hard.

Another example of how he leads his stride with his heel, not his toe. I would prefer that he hid the ball behind his leg or rear a little better to make his already fast fastball look even faster.

There appears to be a lot of great pictures of Liz. I'm going to stop here because otherwise I may have a complete analysis without even needing video. My conclusion is that the assumption that Liz has poor mechanics is wrong. I used to think he was a guaranteed bust that wouldn't be able to put it together, but now I'd be very disappointed if we got rid of Liz. He has great mechanics with only one true flaw (that isn't even always prevalent). However, since his flaw of showing the ball to CF could hurt his elbow is combined with the fact that he throws a slider, there is always a risk of injury, but since Liz is so solid in every other aspect of his delivery, I think that risk is minimized.

Liz is good mechanically, and when he does figure it all out, he will be dangerous. I'm guessing that all his problems are between his ears, and if he can master the mental part of pitching, he will be really good for a long time. This came to a surprise to me that he was so solid mechanically, but I'm glad that we have a pitcher like Liz, and I think he deserves every chance to make the rotation, because he will more than likely hold up as a starter.

[Guest rochester]

Wow.....ummm, just Wow!

[TJ Wrangler]

Wow.....ummm, just Wow!

Is someone happy?

[TGO]

My guess is that because he is so wild, the O's probably at some point in the very low minors recreated his delivery from scratch.

I am glad he is mechanically sound in terms of risk of injury.

However, I don't think that means he is mechanically sound in terms of repeating his delivery. I would love to see how consistent he is/isn't in the location of his foot plant, his arm slot, and his release point.

[Omega]

Thanks. Nice to hear those encouraging words about a pitcher many of us were ready to put in a package deal or just give up on. Mechanics + brains is the key to pitching. Hopefully Liz has both tools.

[Guest rochester]

Is someone happy?

Pitched a long, long time ago - clocked at 85 in high school but never had a coach that even mentioned real mechanics - nothing great but still would have been cool to learn this stuff.

I meant nothing great being my ability

[TJ Wrangler]

Pitched a long, long time ago - clocked at 85 in high school but never had a coach that even mentioned real mechanics - nothing great but still would have been cool to learn this stuff.

I meant nothing great being my ability

Yeah, unfortunately I had to seek out this information and learn it on my own. I thought you were just happy about hearing my positive take on Liz.

[Sanfran327]

You need to find some pictures of his release and follow through. Those are more key in determining whether or not his control issues are easy to fix. Most guys that throw that hard don't have excellent control, but maybe he's got a hitch later in his deliver that could shed some light on things. A lot of it could just be nerves though. His MiLB numbrs are night-and-day different from his MLB numbers.

Part of the reason as to why his mechanics are so good is because he's so athletic. You can tell just by looking at him that he keeps himself in phenomenal shape, which makes the otherwise stressful pitching motion so easy for him to replicate pitch after pitch.

Try to find some of those pics and we can do an even more in-depth analysis of his delivery.

[TJ Wrangler]

My guess is that because he is so wild, the O's probably at some point in the very low minors recreated his delivery from scratch.

I am glad he is mechanically sound in terms of risk of injury.

However, I don't think that means he is mechanically sound in terms of repeating his delivery. I would love to see how consistent he is/isn't in the location of his foot plant, his arm slot, and his release point.

Well the pictures I've seen of him from every level suggest that his timing has always been good, so I would assume he repeats his deliver well enough. I think the control issues are more mental than anything if this is the case.

[Miller192]

This is great work Justin.

The only thing I potentially didn't like was from picture number two where he is throwing the four seamer.

I think that shoulder tilt could be a little excessive and cause his arm to come across his body whereas it should be moving down toward the target on a fastball release.

That said, I haven't watched him nearly enough to say that he does do that but it could potentially explain some of the wildness.

[TGO]

You need to find some pictures of his release and follow through. Those are more key in determining whether or not his control issues are easy to fix. Most guys that throw that hard don't have excellent control, but maybe he's got a hitch later in his deliver that could shed some light on things. A lot of it could just be nerves though. His MiLB numbrs are night-and-day different from his MLB numbers.

Part of the reason as to why his mechanics are so good is because he's so athletic. You can tell just by looking at him that he keeps himself in phenomenal shape, which makes the otherwise stressful pitching motion so easy for him to replicate pitch after pitch.

Try to find some of those pics and we can do an even more in-depth analysis of his delivery.

This is really the telling shot for Liz:

(Yes, he threw this pitch 100 mph) His release and follow through are atrocious. I am no mechanics expert but my guess he is not driving straight and down through his delivery, he is pulling away. LX, your thoughts?

[TJ Wrangler]

You need to find some pictures of his release and follow through. Those are more key in determining whether or not his control issues are easy to fix. Most guys that throw that hard don't have excellent control, but maybe he's got a hitch later in his deliver that could shed some light on things. A lot of it could just be nerves though. His MiLB numbrs are night-and-day different from his MLB numbers.

Part of the reason as to why his mechanics are so good is because he's so athletic. You can tell just by looking at him that he keeps himself in phenomenal shape, which makes the otherwise stressful pitching motion so easy for him to replicate pitch after pitch.

Try to find some of those pics and we can do an even more in-depth analysis of his delivery.

I have one picture up there pre release and one post release. As for follow through, I could only find one small picture of his position after he throws the ball.

The good about this image is that because he is facing sideways to the target, you know his hips have rotated all the way though. It is also good because he minimized the space in which he could get hit by a comebacker by facing sideways.

The bad news is that he's in terrible field position. I guess the trade off is either taking good field position or the assurance that his hips have rotated properly. The question is, which is more important to you?

[TJ Wrangler]

This is really the telling shot for Liz:

(Yes, he threw this pitch 100 mph) His release and follow through are atrocious. I am no mechanics expert but my guess he is not driving straight and down through his delivery, he is pulling away. LX, your thoughts?

Funny how I was posting the same thing. I don't think its necessarily atrocious, and it could be a good thing depending on how you look at it. See my post for explanation.

[Sanfran327]

This is really the telling shot for Liz:

(Yes, he threw this pitch 100 mph) His release and follow through are atrocious. I am no mechanics expert but my guess he is not driving straight and down through his delivery, he is pulling away. LX, your thoughts?

When you're looking at a follow through, there are only two guys to look at, IMO: Greg Maddux and Mike Mussina. They're both immaculate. The way they follow through on a pitch allows them to be squared up with their target (which is important, considering how hard it is to throw at something you're not even looking at), but also allows for perfect defensive positioning after each delivery (ala years and years worth of Gold Gloves for both of them). Basically, your torso needs to darn near touch your lead knee and your throwing arm ought to be scraping the mound on the OUTside of that leg. I don't know how to post a picture, or else I'd probably go find a few for an example.

[TJ Wrangler]

This is great work Justin.

The only thing I potentially didn't like was from picture number two where he is throwing the four seamer.

I think that shoulder tilt could be a little excessive and cause his arm to come across his body whereas it should be moving down toward the target on a fastball release.

That said, I haven't watched him nearly enough to say that he does do that but it could potentially explain some of the wildness.

Thanks. I'll post these shots for you if that helps you come to your conclusion.

His follow through looks solid to me. I like how he has pronated his wrist and nothing pressing appears to be wrong here.