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PBS Frontline: The Astros Edge

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24fps Hangout Grand Counsel

24fps

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The long-running PBS documentary series Frontline began its new season tonight with a 90 minute documentary on the Astros cheating scandal and how it reverberates even today - just in time for post-season baseball, of course.

I don't think many posters on this site will find that much new information in it, but I recommend making the effort to watch it nonetheless.  It is hosted and co-produced by Ben Reiter who wrote Astroball so his access is about as good as it's going to get on the subject.  I particularly enjoyed Fay Vincent who left no doubt about where he stood on the issue at the time (ban them for life) and Antonio Padilla, a young, extremely thoughtful and well-spoken young man who served as a manager in the Astros video room during the 2016 and 2017 seasons and afterward although I don't remember for how long.  The fan who did the video analysis that became the viral sensation for revealing the cheating process was also extensively interviewed.  Luhnow comes across as slimy and disingenuous to nobody's surprise.

Understandably Mike Elias and Sig Mejdal did not agree to be interviewed, although they were seen at times in the doc.  There was no suggestion that they were in any way involved but it's eerie how closely they've followed the Astros early playbook for rebuilding an organization virtually from scratch.

I was left really hoping that the O's meet the Astros in the ALCS because the narrative couldn't be scripted any better given the FO's roots in the Astro organization during that time and the continuing animosity toward the Astros.  Then if the O's can meet the Diamondbacks in the World Series and we can watch each league's ROY go head-to-head, well what could be better?

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Just Regular Hangout Grand Counsel

Just Regular

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The texture of the clubbies economy was new to me.     Padilla the video guy shared the Players voted him a full postseason share of ~$450k, circa 10x what the Club was paying him.

It was in a segment where AJ Hinch and Carlos Beltran were being compared and contrasted as stewards of what the ballclub did.

 

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OriolesMagic83 Hangout Grand Counsel

OriolesMagic83

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No player was ever suspended were they?  I remember the manager was suspended for a year and I believe the GM was fired.  It just seems wrong.  How is this less "cheating" than using steroids.  Year long suspensions for the main transgressors seems about right.  Shorter suspensions for the other guys that are staggered so the Astros could field a team.

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ShoelesJoe All-Star

ShoelesJoe

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2 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

No player was ever suspended were they?  I remember the manager was suspended for a year and I believe the GM was fired.  It just seems wrong.  How is this less "cheating" than using steroids.  Year long suspensions for the main transgressors seems about right.  Shorter suspensions for the other guys that are staggered so the Astros could field a team.

The players were granted immunity so they'd be free to acknowledge what they did and who was involved. The manager and GM were both suspended from baseball for a year, and subsequently fired by the team. I believe Manfred has admitted that giving the players immunity was probably a mistake, but maybe it was necessary in order to get to the bottom of what happened. IMO the Astros organization should have been stripped of the championship, the players forced to give back their rings, and all pennants from that season removed from the stadium. Yes, the players get to keep their jobs and the paychecks that go with them. But nothing else. 

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Uli2001 Hangout Grand Counsel

Uli2001

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On 10/9/2023 at 3:18 AM, ShoelesJoe said:

The players were granted immunity so they'd be free to acknowledge what they did and who was involved. The manager and GM were both suspended from baseball for a year, and subsequently fired by the team. I believe Manfred has admitted that giving the players immunity was probably a mistake, but maybe it was necessary in order to get to the bottom of what happened. IMO the Astros organization should have been stripped of the championship, the players forced to give back their rings, and all pennants from that season removed from the stadium. Yes, the players get to keep their jobs and the paychecks that go with them. But nothing else. 

The title has been stripped in the baseball community. It has an asterisk bigger than a 14-wheeler.

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LA2 Hangout Grand Counsel

LA2

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On 10/19/2023 at 8:42 PM, Uli2001 said:

The title has been stripped in the baseball community. It has an asterisk bigger than a 14-wheeler.

I believe that for many fans, there has been an erasure of the crimes through subsequent, supposedly clean success. More severe and widely distributed punishment would have been an indelible judgement and full moral statement.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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11 minutes ago, LA2 said:

I believe that for many fans, there has been an erasure of the crimes through subsequent, supposedly clean success. More severe and widely distributed punishment would have been an indelible judgement and full moral statement.

If the Astros had been hit hard I imagine they would have spilled a lot of dirt about what everyone else had been doing.

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24fps Hangout Grand Counsel

24fps

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17 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

If the Astros had been hit hard I imagine they would have spilled a lot of dirt about what everyone else had been doing.

More’s the pity.

If that’s the case then I understand Manfred’s reluctance, but baseball would have survived. 

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