Wigginton Official/Moore DFA

[Dipper9]

Millar was anything but solid for the Orioles in 2008. He hurt the team more than he helped it. Moore at least possibly had a future with the Orioles. It was a poor move for a rebuilding club not to potentially evaluate a player like Moore at the ML level IMO. What did we really have to lose by playing him instead of Millar?

Moore made the team and then was sent down. He earned his spot but only got 8 sporadic ABs and only 1 start to show what he had after he made the team. Everybody's numbers were hurt by Norfolk, but a flyball hitting LH power hitter like Moore was especially hurt by the park. There's a reason they are moving the fences in this season.

I understand your points, but your total disgust and aptitude surrounding Millar makes any good points you make questionable. We ALL understand that you think Millar had no place on this team, but on a young team trying to adapt to the Majors, he was an excellent guy to have around, whether you want to admit that or not.

[JTrea81]

I understand your points, but your total disgust and aptitude surrounding Millar makes any good points you make questionable. We ALL understand that you think Millar had no place on this team, but on a young team trying to adapt to the Majors, he was an excellent guy to have around, whether you want to admit that or not.

Who exactly was young on the team besides maybe a few of the starters and Adam Jones that needed to adapt? Mora, Roberts, Huff, Hernandez, Markakis, Scott and Castro/Cintron were all veterans last season. Heck even Fahey and Bynum were veterans.

Millar wasn't needed at all last season and did nothing to help the team improve. Maybe your total admiration for his antics and demeanor are causing you to look past his production which was pretty poor for a 1B man in MLB. A .714 OPS isn't needed on any team at 1B/DH.

[Dipper9]

Jeter can hit. Wigginton is $3 million a year who can actually hit and is relatively young and can fill in at 2B, SS and DH and can platoon very well.

Payton was ridiculously overpaid. Millar provided decent production, save for his last year when he was giving way too much leeway.

Guys like Payton and Millar, I never once heard anyone say they're going to see a game to see those fellas. MacPhail is signing filler but to very inexpensive contracts for short time periods to players with decent upside who can serve roles.

Sorry, this organization has been driven into the ground prior to MacPhail. MacPhail gives me hope.

Apparantly you never met Laurie Lasagna, otherwise known and adored as CamdenChick!

[Dipper9]

Who exactly was young on the team besides maybe a few of the starters and Adam Jones that needed to adapt? Mora, Roberts, Huff, Hernandez, Markakis, Scott and Castro/Cintron were all veterans last season. Heck even Fahey and Bynum were veterans.

Millar wasn't needed at all last season and did nothing to help the team improve. Maybe your total admiration for his antics and demeanor are causing you to look past his production which was pretty poor for a 1B man in MLB. A .714 OPS isn't needed on any team at 1B/DH.

Slow down. I like the guy...ALOT. But I am not defending him starting first base every game. IF we had a better option, I would have been all for it. Even without a better option this year, I have no issue with us not resigning him. I like him. I think he's a good guy. But I don't defend his play last year. My only beef with you is that you have hated the guy for two years ever since his Red Sox WS stunt. What he did was no worse than Huff's comments, but because Huff produced last season, everyone forgot and forgave. The Orioles had no one in the organization who was ready to come up and step up as the everyday first baseman. That is the fault of the Organization, not of Millar. Is he done as an everyday player? Absolutely. Does he deserve the hatred you spew towards him? Absolutely not.

[JTrea81]

Slow down. I like the guy...ALOT. But I am not defending him starting first base every game. IF we had a better option, I would have been all for it. Even without a better option this year, I have no issue with us not resigning him. I like him. I think he's a good guy. But I don't defend his play last year. My only beef with you is that you have hated the guy for two years ever since his Red Sox WS stunt. What he did was no worse than Huff's comments, but because Huff produced last season, everyone forgot and forgave. The Orioles had no one in the organization who was ready to come up and step up as the everyday first baseman. That is the fault of the Organization, not of Millar. Is he done as an everyday player? Absolutely. Does he deserve the hatred you spew towards him? Absolutely not.

They didn't even try anybody else at the spot and just gave it to Millar by default. Scott Moore could have been just as productive if not more so at that position. Millar could have been dumped just like Bradford before 2008 to save his contract $ and then Moore could have been allowed to play there for the season.

[Dipper9]

They didn't even try anybody else at the spot and just gave it to Millar by default. Scott Moore could have been just as productive if not more so at that position. Millar could have been dumped just like Bradford before 2008 to save his contract $ and then Moore could have been allowed to play there for the season.

I won't argue that. Moore COULD have been given a chance. I can agree with that. But obviously there is a reason that only a few of these "Quad A" type players make it in the Bigs. Puck mentioned earlier a list of guys the Orioles have let go. Of that list, only Blake and Cust have been successful. And even them it took a while for it to happen. Its one thing for a guy to bounce around among numerous teams before finally making his mark. Its another for ONE team, (any team, not just the O's) to hold onto a guy for years and years waiting for something to happen. Look at Cabrera. If he suddenly "gets it," was it a mistake for us to let him go? I say no. You can't keep a guy forever just hoping he'll make it. At some point you have to cut bait. Now I am not saying Moore fits that category (yet) but also there is a good chance he is still with the organization 10 days from now. Lets just wait and see.

BTW...wasn't this thread supposed to be about Wiggy????

[ChaosLex]

[Tony-OH]

Thanks, mate. I appreciate it.

Truth be told, I'd say a very good portion of this site has had it out for me since I'm a bit crass on my delivery. I guess I don't like the rose coloured sunglasses. So, I'll have my naysayers, regardless whether they're the admins or your basic users.

I hear you on your threads. I'm an avid reader of your mechanical threads on pitchers. Always good to read.

Put it this way. We have guys on this forum who are "vetted" who are 50% right all the time. We have guys on this forum who aren't, who are 50% right all the time. You know this, but we have to be pretty selective about our sources. Hell, bring every shred of evidence into the picture before looking into what a person's saying. How many times have our insiders been dead wrong about something (although they may have been right at that point and time of the trade)?

We're not going to get into this insider crap anymore ok? Stick to your observations and stay away from your 4th hand information unless you want to caveat your stuff with "I've heard this through my girlfriend's stylist's, milkman..."

Stop crying about the admins or other people who "have it out for you" and try using a better tone instead of being confrontational. That has a lot more to do with how you are accepted than whether you where Orange colored glasses or not.

[Shellax]

Excellent non sequitur Chaoslex!

[TJ Wrangler]

We're not going to get into this insider crap anymore ok? Stick to your observations and stay away from your 4th hand information unless you want to caveat your stuff with "I've heard this through my girlfriend's stylist's, milkman..."

Stop crying about the admins or other people who "have it out for you" and try using a better tone instead of being confrontational. That has a lot more to do with how you are accepted than whether you where Orange colored glasses or not.

I agree here. I didn't see anything that happened before I posted to Lookitspuck, but I definitely agree that he won't go winning friends and believers by insulting people.

Puck, if you want to post saying you heard something, take Tony's advice with the caveat and be respectful about it.

[ScottieBaseball]

Truth be told, I'd say a very good portion of this site has had it out for me since I'm a bit crass on my delivery. I guess I don't like the rose coloured sunglasses. So, I'll have my naysayers, regardless whether they're the admins or your basic users.

So you admit to being "a bit crass" and then present yourself as some kind of...what? Martyr? Which "very good portion" of our thousands of registered users are you referring to? Or wait...by "have it in for you" do you mean "vehemently disagrees with my opinion on a regular basis"? Well I gotta tell ya...this is a message board, buddy. You wouldn't be the first person and you definitely wouldn't be the last to cry "everyone hates me" when in actuality it boils down to a difference of opinion.

Put it this way. We have guys on this forum who are "vetted" who are 50% right all the time. We have guys on this forum who aren't, who are 50% right all the time. You know this, but we have to be pretty selective about our sources. Hell, bring every shred of evidence into the picture before looking into what a person's saying. How many times have our insiders been dead wrong about something (although they may have been right at that point and time of the trade)?

We're not going to get into this insider crap anymore ok? Stick to your observations and stay away from your 4th hand information unless you want to caveat your stuff with "I've heard this through my girlfriend's stylist's, milkman..."

Thank you, Tony. A million times thank you.

The information posted here by these "vetted insiders" comes from guys for whom, at some point in time, it was reasonable to believe they had a source "in the know". After said "vetting" this staff has advertised said information as nothing else than "buyer beware".

People take this insider crap WAY to seriously. It makes for fun reading and discussion, right? So let it be fun and spark debate rather than some degenerative, immature internet babble that's quite frankly beneath our standards here.

For the record, there's no contest, no award for the occassions on which an "insider" gets one right. When it does happen, the lovefest and/or "so-and-so appreciation thread" that sometimes ensues here is lame, ridiculous, and pathetic.

Nothing personal against the guys who post here with an "inside" source (although...I thought Looper was almost a done deal BB? I digress.), but take it ALL with a grain of salt, for what it's worth, etc. It's never true until the ink's dry anyway! Until then it's ALL rumor and speculation. Either way, while it's entertaining, it makes the job of our collective staff a bit aggravating at times.

Now I'm going to get back to the "Orioles Hangout Admin Staff's List of Posters We Have it Out For."

[TJ Wrangler]

Now I'm going to get back to the "Orioles Hangout Admin Staff's List of Posters We Have it Out For."

ooooohhhhhhh ahhhhhhhhhhh

Mind if I take a peek at the list? :laughlol:

[NewMarketSean]

Are the Orioles really in a position to DFA positional players, even "most likely to be AAAA positional players"?

Scott had a poor season last year... but still posted a .730 OPS in a cavernous stadium last season. He can play multiple positions. He's hit 4 HR in 98 AB's at the MLB level. I can think of about 5 players I would have DFA'd before Moore.

[DrungoHazewood]

Are the Orioles really in a position to DFA positional players, even "most likely to be AAAA positional players"?

Scott had a poor season last year... but still posted a .730 OPS in a cavernous stadium last season. He can play multiple positions. He's hit 4 HR in 98 AB's at the MLB level. I can think of about 5 players I would have DFA'd before Moore.

If the O's need Scott Moore they can either just recall him from Norfolk when he passes through waivers, or find another one and acquire him for Freddy Deza or something. There will be 23 guys just like Moore on the waiver wire in late March. Just because the O's don't have six of him in the system doesn't mean a bunch of other teams are in the same situation.

Never fret too much over someone who lives in the gray area between AAA and the majors. Talent in baseball is a pyramid, and there are always spare AAAA guys to go around. And besides, Moore isn't even Jon Knott or JR House. He's a step down.

[jcroemer]

If the O's need Scott Moore they can either just recall him from Norfolk when he passes through waivers, or find another one and acquire him for Freddy Deza or something. There will be 23 guys just like Moore on the waiver wire in late March. Just because the O's don't have six of him in the system doesn't mean a bunch of other teams are in the same situation.

Never fret too much over someone who lives in the gray area between AAA and the majors. Talent in baseball is a pyramid, and there are always spare AAAA guys to go around. And besides, Moore isn't even Jon Knott or JR House. He's a step down.

Now there are some class AAAA acts!