TT: Taking a look at the bullpen now that Hall is gone

[Tony-OH]

4 hours ago, Frobby said:

Where would you have ranked Hall in our system if he was still considered  a prospect?  

7th, behind Ortiz. Bradfield is still a bit of a wildcard due to the lack of pop so I'd slot him ahead of him. Ortiz and Hall would be very close though for me. 

[Tony-OH]

4 hours ago, Just Regular said:

Only tactical detail in my mind is if the 10th Anniversary 2024 Andrew Miller type acquisition occurs on precisely the same day of the calendar.

Information compiling whether Alexis Diaz, David Bednar or Devin Williams' arms explode by the All-Star break, and how their teams do this year.     Tanner Scott may get settled before Opening Day.

I hope Craig Kimbrel gets another dogpile and pitches well unlike in October 2018 when Steve Pearce took him along for the ride, but I don't expect Sigbot to be precious about October role if September stuff is soft.     Buck would have cared about 37 saves.

You've got me pumped to see if Luis De Leon can challenge for an early 40-man spot if he's one of the 10 best pitchers at Elias' disposal this fall!

I like De Leon but that would be very, very aggressive for him. I'd rather they take the time to see if they can develop him as a starter for sure.

[Tony-OH]

4 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

@Tony-OH What do you think about Brasier on a 1 year deal? He’s was nearly unhittable in 40 innings after getting out of Boston.

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/brasiry01.shtml

I think I did something on him how the Dodgers gave him a cutter and it changed him. I'm worried though that he may not be better than what we have since he's due some regression at 36 years old and has been up and down a lot in his career.

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, CaptainRedbeard said:

Yeah it would be a huge sell low for them, but they are the A’s.

It would be pretty nice to turn 1-2 of Santander, Hays, O’Hearn, Urias, Stowers, Norby into a RP of equivalent value. I’m less keen on trading Mountcastle right now but would also deal him.

I think we’re more likely to see that at the deadline, when teams are more looking to move their RP as well, and more likely to pick up a FA. But Elias is probably exploring all options. 

My goal would be to create space for the 4 rookie hitters that are or will be ready by June or so.

Ortiz accomplished that for Holliday.

You have Mateo, Urias, Hays, Mountcastle and Santander.

My preference would be to keep Hays more than any single player on there but would still move him.

I would like to see one of the 2 IFers dealt (Urias makes sense to keep for what the team will be but Mateo makes sense to keep for the first half of the season) and one of Mountcastle or Santander.

Kjerstad and Cowser would join Hays and Mullins in the OF, either them playing almost everyday, including some DH time (especially for Kjerstad)

First base would be OHearn and either Santander or Mountcastle.

The other 3 IF positions would be 1 or Urias/Mateo, Henderson and Westburg.

By June or so, you enter in Holliday and Mayo. 

A good case can be made that you keep Urias and Mateo for now because you need 4 IFers outside of first base. The reason you trade one is if their value dictates you do that to get you something you need. If that value isn’t there, you keep them for now.

The more critical move is trading one of Hays, Santander or Mountcastle. We need the 2 OFers up here imo and it helps create room later for Mayo. 

By the time you get to the trade deadline, your established lineup should be 1st base (ie whatever is left) and some kind of combo of Holliday, Henderson and Westburg.  
Mayo rotating between 1st and RF…and then the  4 OFers I mentioned before with a bunch of guys rotating at DH.

How guys like Holliday and Mayo do defensively will determine positions but basically, your everyday lineup should have Kjerstad, Cowser, Mullins, Mayo, Adley, Gunnar and Westburg in it. That leaves 2 spots for Mounty, Hays and Santander.

That should be the goal.

[btdart20]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

My goal would be to create space for the 4 rookie hitters that are or will be ready by June or so.

Ortiz accomplished that for Holliday.

You have Mateo, Urias, Hays, Mountcastle and Santander.

My preference would be to keep Hays more than any single player on there but would still move him.

I would like to see one of the 2 IFers dealt (Urias makes sense to keep for what the team will be but Mateo makes sense to keep for the first half of the season) and one of Mountcastle or Santander.

Kjerstad and Cowser would join Hays and Mullins in the OF, either them playing almost everyday, including some DH time (especially for Kjerstad)

First base would be OHearn and either Santander or Mountcastle.

The other 3 IF positions would be 1 or Urias/Mateo, Henderson and Westburg.

By June or so, you enter in Holliday and Mayo. 

A good case can be made that you keep Urias and Mateo for now because you need 4 IFers outside of first base. The reason you trade one is if their value dictates you do that to get you something you need. If that value isn’t there, you keep them for now.

The more critical move is trading one of Hays, Santander or Mountcastle. We need the 2 OFers up here imo and it helps create room later for Mayo. 

By the time you get to the trade deadline, your established lineup should be 1st base (ie whatever is left) and some kind of combo of Holliday, Henderson and Westburg.  
Mayo rotating between 1st and RF…and then the  4 OFers I mentioned before with a bunch of guys rotating at DH.

How guys like Holliday and Mayo do defensively will determine positions but basically, your everyday lineup should have Kjerstad, Cowser, Mullins, Mayo, Adley, Gunnar and Westburg in it. That leaves 2 spots for Mounty, Hays and Santander.

That should be the goal.

I’m nearly 100% with you.  I lean toward keeping Santander and trading Mountcastle though.

Mateo’s split vs LHP are better than Urias.  Career is close but trend is with Mateo.  Plus the speed and defense.  For those reasons, I can see Mateo as the bench guy.

Gotta think Mounty, Urias, and a 10-20 prospect can get an RP.

[wildbillhiccup]

2 hours ago, CaptainRedbeard said:

Mason Miller is the dream guy if we’re trading with the A’s. He’s had all kinds of health issues that mean the A’s probably will make him a RP and certainly will be looking to deal him eventually. His stuff is unreal nasty and he’ll definitely be a dominant RP.

Problem is they’ll probably wait to get him healthy and performing in the closer role and trade him at the deadline when his value will be much higher.

Old friend Hunter Harvey with 2 years of control remaining may be the best target if we’re looking to find a non-competitive team that wants to cash in on a RP. 

I don't think there's any chance the A's will trade Mason Miller. He's one of the only true bright young spots on their team. I also don't think they're ready to give up on him as starter. They might bounce him back and forth a bit this season between the bullpen and rotation to control his innings, but it's pretty clear they think very highly of him. 

I can understand the mentality to want to go big after the Burnes trade, but I really don't think it's an approach that we need to take. Not for a RP. We should be able to sell some of our older excess (Mateo, Urias, Santander, etc.) for a reasonable bullpen arm. It's just a matter of finding the right fit / trade partner. 

[Sports Guy]

21 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

I’m nearly 100% with you.  I lean toward keeping Santander and trading Mountcastle though.

Mateo’s split vs LHP are better than Urias.  Career is close but trend is with Mateo.  Plus the speed and defense.  For those reasons, I can see Mateo as the bench guy.

Gotta think Mounty, Urias, and a 10-20 prospect can get an RP.

I don’t care which of the 2 is dealt. I just think if you trade Santander, you get value for him instead of him walking for nothing.  
 

You can keep Mounty and trade him next offseason.

OTOH, if you feel Santander helps you to win more, I can see keeping him instead.

Either way, I don’t care which one goes. Just want the reliever and these guys give you a chance to get that player.

[Since1984]

40 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

My goal would be to create space for the 4 rookie hitters that are or will be ready by June or so.

Ortiz accomplished that for Holliday.

You have Mateo, Urias, Hays, Mountcastle and Santander.

My preference would be to keep Hays more than any single player on there but would still move him.

I would like to see one of the 2 IFers dealt (Urias makes sense to keep for what the team will be but Mateo makes sense to keep for the first half of the season) and one of Mountcastle or Santander.

Kjerstad and Cowser would join Hays and Mullins in the OF, either them playing almost everyday, including some DH time (especially for Kjerstad)

First base would be OHearn and either Santander or Mountcastle.

The other 3 IF positions would be 1 or Urias/Mateo, Henderson and Westburg.

By June or so, you enter in Holliday and Mayo. 

A good case can be made that you keep Urias and Mateo for now because you need 4 IFers outside of first base. The reason you trade one is if their value dictates you do that to get you something you need. If that value isn’t there, you keep them for now.

The more critical move is trading one of Hays, Santander or Mountcastle. We need the 2 OFers up here imo and it helps create room later for Mayo. 

By the time you get to the trade deadline, your established lineup should be 1st base (ie whatever is left) and some kind of combo of Holliday, Henderson and Westburg.  
Mayo rotating between 1st and RF…and then the  4 OFers I mentioned before with a bunch of guys rotating at DH.

How guys like Holliday and Mayo do defensively will determine positions but basically, your everyday lineup should have Kjerstad, Cowser, Mullins, Mayo, Adley, Gunnar and Westburg in it. That leaves 2 spots for Mounty, Hays and Santander.

That should be the goal.

That is a lot of movement to get the future bats up as they deserve a shot. I wonder what the FO thinks about the appropriate balance of veteran hitters verses the long term upside of Kerjstad, Cowser, Mayo and Holliday.

The Burnes trade is the competition kicker for 2024 and I agree with most of your sentiment.  These young hitters are more balanced in their approach than some of the veterans, potentially.

[ThisIsBirdland]

If Santander and Kjerstad could provide some LH options at 1B, I'd be interested in finding room for all of the rookies if it could make sense to move on from all of O'Hearn, Mateo and Urias. I like to toy around with playing time scenarios periodically in the off-season; something like this is my favorite. I don't necessarily think it's realistic, just a fun exercise for me.

• Adley, Gunnar receive 140 starts, resting for about 3 games per month
• Mullins, Santander, Hays, Mountcastle, Holliday and Westburg receive 130 starts, resting for about 5 games per month
• Rookies Mayo, Cowser and Kjerstad can still receive 110 starts each, playing 2 out of every 3 games as they acclimate to MLB pitching
• McCann rotates at catcher, McKenna spells Mullins against LHPs

[Sports Guy]

34 minutes ago, Since1984 said:

That is a lot of movement to get the future bats up as they deserve a shot. I wonder what the FO thinks about the appropriate balance of veteran hitters verses the long term upside of Kerjstad, Cowser, Mayo and Holliday.

The Burnes trade is the competition kicker for 2024 and I agree with most of your sentiment.  These young hitters are more balanced in their approach than some of the veterans, potentially.

The presence of Burnes and the idea of adding another high end BP arm should give you enough pitching where you can get over some of the growing pains.

That said, the balance of how many young guys do you bring up is a huge question imo.  Been asking that question for a year.

[Since1984]

First it was Lyles, then Gibson and now Burnes. I like the progression. ME is a depth guy too, another exciting baseball season awaits!

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, Since1984 said:

First it was Lyles, then Gibson and now Burnes. I like the progression. 

Who’s next, Koufax?  

[Sports Guy]

Reliever market:

 

 

[ThisIsBirdland]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Reliever market:

 

 

White Sox board seems pretty content to let him go; apparently bad clubhouse guy and very high injury risk.

One day I'll stop checking in over there, but not today apparently.

[Sports Guy]

14 minutes ago, ThisIsBirdland said:

White Sox board seems pretty content to let him go; apparently bad clubhouse guy and very high injury risk.

One day I'll stop checking in over there, but not today apparently.

Only 23, had some good stats last year. He’s a good get for Seattle, who already have some legit horses out there.