Will the O’s trade away a position player before Opening Day?

[Hallas]

26 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If you have Holliday, Urias and Westburg on the team, do you need a back up SS though? Gunnar is going to play 155+ games if he’s healthy. 

I think that Holliday's the only one, maybe Westburg in a pinch for short stints, that I'd trust at SS.  Urias has been pretty bad there.  Since I expect Holliday to be the starting 2B, I think you'd want a backup option that doesn't involve moving over one of your starters.  If Westburg's that guy then sure we don't need Mateo, but I'm not really convinced.  His arm strength is worrisome and I don't know if he's going to make up for it with range the way we'd expect Holliday to.

 

We could find a deal for Urias too.  I don't think the return for either player is going to be significant though.  Maybe a 45-ish high volatility prospect you take a flyer on, or a relief pitcher prospect.

[MTMan13]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

When I mentioned him to WS fans to be part of a Cease deal, they acted like he was complete trash.  So dumb.

It's an unfortunate product of our success. The odds are pretty good he could be a ML contributor for a mid-division club, but "4th best outfield prospect" doesn't have a great ring to it. He should value in his projection simply for being on a rookie contract. His platoon splits flipping last year did surprise me...   

Edited March 11 by MTMan13

[Sports Guy]

12 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

DirtyBird was arguing they are similar players. You said they could play at the same time. If you meant on the roster at the same time that’s fine but my point remains. 
 

It means Mayo, Mountcastle and Hays would be sitting. 
 

All I am saying is it’s hard to juggle 11 players for 8 spots minus the C postion. 

Mayo isn’t going to be here

[Sports Guy]

12 minutes ago, Hallas said:

I think that Holliday's the only one, maybe Westburg in a pinch for short stints, that I'd trust at SS.  Urias has been pretty bad there.  Since I expect Holliday to be the starting 2B, I think you'd want a backup option that doesn't involve moving over one of your starters.  If Westburg's that guy then sure we don't need Mateo, but I'm not really convinced.  His arm strength is worrisome and I don't know if he's going to make up for it with range the way we'd expect Holliday to.

 

We could find a deal for Urias too.  I don't think the return for either player is going to be significant though.  Maybe a 45-ish high volatility prospect you take a flyer on, or a relief pitcher prospect.

If Holliday is here and players are healthy, only 2 players on the team are playing SS aside from maybe the rare day off here and there.

Westburg and Urias aren’t optimal SS but you can get by with them if you had to.

Again, trying to find a reason to keep Mateo on the roster makes no sense to me.  He’s not good.

[eddie83]

17 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Mayo isn’t going to be here

I agree.  

[Hallas]

6 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

If Holliday is here and players are healthy, only 2 players on the team are playing SS aside from maybe the rare day off here and there.

Westburg and Urias aren’t optimal SS but you can get by with them if you had to.

Again, trying to find a reason to keep Mateo on the roster makes no sense to me.  He’s not good.

 

I don't really think any of McKenna, Urias, or Mateo are worth a huge amount of consernation over, but I think you can make a reasonable argument for any of them deserving to be off the team.  None of them are particularly good; Urias regressed offensively and his 2.7 WAR in 2022 feels fluky because it's driven by a defensive performance that is wildly out of line with his career numbers.  On top of that he has almost perfect positional overlap with Westburg, who also happens to be younger, cheaper, and better at most baseball things than Urias.  I can certainly understand why you'd protect McKenna over the other 2, since he's younger and he's made incremental improvements to his offense to go along with his defense.  I think it's reasonable to wonder how much of Mateo's bat falling off a cliff is bad luck vs his skills degrading.  If you think he's degraded then it's easy to kick him off the roster.  If you think he can get back to being an 80-85 wOBA guy then he might be worth rostering, especially considering he has more positional flexibility than the other 2 guys.

 

I would have liked to see us trade someone with actual value to another team, like Hays or Mountcastle, and hope that Cowser/Kjerstad/Mayo step up in their place.  I kind of feel like the decision to keep or part ways with Mateo/Urias/McKenna is inconsequential in comparison.  If any of those guys get significant playing time, either someone crazy happened with their development, or something's gone horribly wrong with the team.

Edited March 12 by Hallas

[sportsfan8703]

Our position player depth is what gets us through 162. I wouldn’t mind flipping one of Urias/Mateo for a RH RP with an option. 

[interloper]

Still can't imagine a trade does NOT happen. The position players are healthy and it seems like Mounty will avoid the IL. 

I think they wait for the deadline for a bigger trade, but I still think someone like McKenna, Mateo, Urias, or Stowers could be flipped.

For Stowers, I don't think they like the idea of a reverse splits guy. I don't think they believe it will translate when he faces ML lefties with big stuff - I don't necessarily agree, but I don't think Sig wants to count on reverse splits. But the big power display this spring could entice an offense-starved team maybe. 

McKenna, I could see him flipped to somewhere like Boston for cash or a PTBNL. 

[Sports Guy]

The issue I have is that we have obvious pitching issues and we should be using this depth to help solve that, not worry about having positions that are super deep.

[interloper]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

The issue I have is that we have obvious pitching issues and we should be using this depth to help solve that, not worry about having positions that are super deep.

Agree. A guy like Urias is very valuable as a depth piece and steady defender, etc, but you have to make tough calls sometimes and trust that someone like Westburg can handle that role. We have obvious bullpen needs. 

[btdart20]

15 minutes ago, interloper said:

Still can't imagine a trade does NOT happen. The position players are healthy and it seems like Mounty will avoid the IL. 

I think they wait for the deadline for a bigger trade, but I still think someone like McKenna, Mateo, Urias, or Stowers could be flipped.

For Stowers, I don't think they like the idea of a reverse splits guy. I don't think they believe it will translate when he faces ML lefties with big stuff - I don't necessarily agree, but I don't think Sig wants to count on reverse splits. But the big power display this spring could entice an offense-starved team maybe. 

McKenna, I could see him flipped to somewhere like Boston for cash or a PTBNL. 

Stowers is really a reverse splits guy.  2022 and 2023 he hit both RHP and LHP well.  He's could be a solid non-platoon option because of that.  

[wildcard]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

The issue I have is that we have obvious pitching issues and we should be using this depth to help solve that, not worry about having positions that are super deep.

Please describe the pitching issues as you see them.

[interloper]

Just now, btdart20 said:

Stowers is really a reverse splits guy.  2022 and 2023 he hit both RHP and LHP well.  He's could be a solid non-platoon option because of that.  

The thing is, there's not enough playing time on this roster for him to NOT be a platoon guy. He's not going to start in the outfield, and he can't help you in CF like Cowser. So his best role would be coming off the bench to face a RHP. And they won't trust him to succeed there, nor is that setting him up for success. They really need to trade him. 

[Spy Fox]

3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Please describe the pitching issues as you see them.

For me it's a potential lack of shutdown backend relievers.

[interloper]

7 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Please describe the pitching issues as you see them.

It's obvious. The bullpen is in really bad shape my man. At least for a team with WS aspirations.