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The play that ended the game

RZNJ

By RZNJ
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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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Just now, RarityFlaherty said:

I’m just saying that this specific situation puts the runner in a lose- lose situation, not that all IF fly rules called with a runner on second are lose-lose. You’re always going to be off the bag to start, so it makes sense for the umpire to at least give the runner a little leeway to get back to the bag. Otherwise, the runner is left with three options that could all result in him being called out. He could return to the bag like he is supposed to and risk being called for interference like in this situation. He could also run around the position player and possibly be called out for being outside the baseline. Or he could stay where he is until the position player passes and risk getting doubled up anyway. I definitely agree with you that many people here would blame the runner, but I definitely would not. 

I'm sure if Vaughn or anyone but the umpires knew the rule he wouldn't have watched the popup as he nonchalantly walked back to the base. I bet it won't happen to another player again now that they know it can be called. 

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Malike
Malike

If Hays or Mullins or McKenna (when he was here) ran into the guy this board would be blaming the player and not the ump. I have very little doubt about that.

Spy Fox
Spy Fox

You could say that Colton interfered with that ball going over the fence. 

Spy Fox
Spy Fox

It was egregious and inexplicable.  Also egregious was MASN's inability to show a clear replay or explain what happened. Talked about this in the game thread already but-- the Sox feed shared on

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Hallas Hangout Grand Counsel

Hallas

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10 minutes ago, Malike said:

Yes, it is both. 

I really don't think it's trash to call interference.  Gunnar took a fairly direct path to the ball and the runner got in his way.  That's like a textbook interference call.

 

I'm pretty sympathatic to the idea that the penalty for that shouldn't be a double play.  The rule is explicit in saying that this should be, but it does feel wrong.  The batter is out anyway, so there's no need to field the ball.  Just call the play dead and tell the runners to go back to their original base.

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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Just now, Hallas said:

I really don't think it's trash to call interference.  Gunnar took a fairly direct path to the ball and the runner got in his way.  That's like a textbook interference call.

 

I'm pretty sympathatic to the idea that the penalty for that shouldn't necessarily be a double play.  The rule is explicit in saying that this should be a double play, but it does feel wrong.  The runner is out anyway, so there's no need to field the ball.  Just call the play dead and tell the runners to go back to their original base.

If it caused him to not make the catch, I think that would have been accepted a bit more. It was a freak play that we'll probably never see again in our lifetimes, it's hard to parse out I guess. I just think it was an awful way to lose a baseball game when it didn't affect the catch. I guess if they are going to call every interference then fine, but it's just one of those game-ending plays that left a bad taste with me as an Orioles fan.

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Moose Milligan Hangout Grand Counsel

Moose Milligan

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6 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Well, I didn’t know the rule down to its last letter but I knew it.   Technically, on any slow grounder to the 2B, with a runner on 1st, the 2nd baseman can stop right in the runners path and force the runner to stop, go around, interfere.   You can’t make contact with a fielder in pursuit of making a play. 
 

Of course, if you’re already on a base the fielder has to deal with it if you’re in the way.

Correct, I think we're all semi-aware of that rule, too.  

But this is a bit different...IMO, the weird thing is that the ball is already essentially dead the moment it hit the bat, too.  What's there to interfere?  

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RZNJ Hangout Grand Counsel

RZNJ

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3 minutes ago, Hallas said:

I really don't think it's trash to call interference.  Gunnar took a fairly direct path to the ball and the runner got in his way.  That's like a textbook interference call.

 

I'm pretty sympathatic to the idea that the penalty for that shouldn't be a double play.  The rule is explicit in saying that this should be, but it does feel wrong.  The runner is out anyway, so there's no need to field the ball.  Just call the play dead and tell the runners to go back to their original base.

How is not a DP according to your last sentence?

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Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

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11 minutes ago, Frobby said:

In case anyone would like a sampling of White Sox fans reaction, here’s the thread from Soxtalk.   Only a 7 page thread for the whole game; not a lot of interest in following White Sox games these days I guess.  

Lol Sports Guy is still living rent free in their heads over there.

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RZNJ Hangout Grand Counsel

RZNJ

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1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

Correct, I think we're all semi-aware of that rule, too.  

But this is a bit different...IMO, the weird thing is that the ball is already essentially dead the moment it hit the bat, too.  What's there to interfere?  

The infield fly call is just salt in the wound.  lol

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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Just now, Aristotelian said:

Lol Sports Guy is still living rent free in their heads over there.

We'd be every bit as pissed as they are. They had a legitimate chance to win that game.

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Hallas Hangout Grand Counsel

Hallas

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2 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

How is not a DP according to your last sentence?

I don't understand your question?

edit: i meant "the batter is out anyway" my bad

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RZNJ Hangout Grand Counsel

RZNJ

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2 minutes ago, Malike said:

I think he meant the batter is out anyway.

Yeah, but I’m not sure if he’s saying Vaughn should be out or just go back to his base which is where he would be anyway.  It’s not like he advanced or tried to advance.

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RarityFlaherty Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

RarityFlaherty

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4 minutes ago, Malike said:

I'm sure if Vaughn or anyone but the umpires knew the rule he wouldn't have watched the popup as he nonchalantly walked back to the base. I bet it won't happen to another player again now that they know it can be called. 

Yeah, you’re probably right there, but what happens if a ball is being fielded right in the basepath between the runner and the base? What does the runner do? He can’t get back to the base because the fielder is in the way and he can’t go around the fielder or he’ll be out of the baseline. He just has to wait for the fielder to make the play and then he’s likely out anyway. Just doesn’t feel like the runner has any good options in that scenario. 

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RZNJ Hangout Grand Counsel

RZNJ

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3 minutes ago, Hallas said:

I don't understand your question?

edit: i meant "the batter is out anyway" my bad

We all know the batter is out.  What about Vaughn?

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