Bergesen threw 6 scoreless today

[wildcard]

I know that we aren't supposed to care about what happens on the field in 2009, this is a transitional year, etc...

...but damn, I still plan to watch as many games as possible, and it's going to be mighty painful if I have to watch guys like Baez and Penn (hate to admit it, but let's face facts) getting hammered and losing games for us, even if it's just for a couple of months, just because AM wants to keep his options open. Especially when we know that there are better choices available at Norfolk who are only there because they have options (Bergesen, Albers, Mickolio, McCrory...)

The Russ Ortiz episode was probably the most infuriating chapter of the last 10 years...I'm not anxious to repeat it.

So far this spring it seems that Penn has not given us much reason to believe that he can pitch in the majors. However, Baez seems pretty good for a couple of innings. He has not shown he can stretch out yet, but he still has 2 weeks to keep trying to prove that.

[wildcard]

I think you're being too results oriented. You seem to be acting as if they're going to sit down, look at everyone's numbers and make decisions based on those numbers. I think they're smart enough to know that the numbers posted by a pitcher in 20 or 30 innings isn't enough on which to make a sound judgment. I'm also pretty sure they had a pretty good idea of what to expect from these guys coming in.

They will make their decisions based on how these guys threw the ball (their stuff), on how they did things such as set up the hitters, on how the hitters reacted (which can still be judged, regardless of the level of the hitter), and the like. They'll judge these guys on things absolutely none of us are privvy to.

Most of the time stuff, poise, experience, and talent are reflected in results. Not all the time but most of the time. Options and contracts normally play as big if not a bigger role in who stays and who goes and where they go.

[Crazysilver03]

Roch

Bergesen said he mostly faced a Single-A lineup.

It was a mismatch.

Bergesen threw 73 pitches in six innings, and he worked at his usual brisk pace.

"He just rolled through six innings," catcher Robby Hammock said. "We might have been on the field a total of 25 minutes the whole time. It was just boom, boom, boom. It was nice."

Bergesen threw his two-seam and four-seam fastballs, changeup and slider. Under instructions from pitching coach Rick Kranitz, he worked on throwing his changeup to right-handed hitters and using his slider in 2-0 and 2-1 counts.

"He was good," Hammock said. "I know it was an A-ball team, but still, he got out there and he was pitching. He wasn't just trying to throw it down the middle for them. He was throwing his sliders in off-counts and changeups in fastball counts. His two-seamer was great. And later on in the game, the longer he pitched, the better it got."

Is Bergesen's stuff good enough for the majors?

"Without a doubt," Hammock said. "He's got a good changeup, a good two-seamer, and he throws to spots. His slider is probably the only pitch that might be a question, but when he throws it right, it's definitely where it needs to be."

It is nice he got all of his pitches to work but to be facing a Single-A line-up, that should be expected.

[Frobby]

I agree completely with your third sentence.

As for the first sentence, you can't make definitive judgments based on 20 or 30 ST IP.

Agreed, but it's been pretty obvious that the O's have been singling out Bergesen as a guy who might make this rotation from almost the first day of camp. In the first exhibition vs. Italy, he was the only pitcher who threw 2 innings. He was quickly moved to 3 innings, then 4, and now 6. I think this guy is just the kind of pitcher Trembley want, i.e., a fast working strike thrower.

[Sports Guy]

Roch

It is nice he got all of his pitches to work but to be facing a Single-A line-up, that should be expected.

It also tells you which way the Orioles are likely leaning in terms of the rotation.

[mark_beckens]

I remain skeptical. I'll be shocked if Eaton is released. Obviously with Hill probably not ready to go at the start, that opens up another spot. If Baez was released, traded, or relegated to the bullpen that would open up a permanent spot. My locks are:

1. Guthrie

2. Uehara

3. Hill

4. Eaton

Do you disagree with these four? What do you see happending with Eaton & Baez?

And don't forget that Simon, Bass, & Hendrickson are also in the mix.

Penn?

[clapdiddy]

It also tells you which way the Orioles are likely leaning in terms of the rotation.

I don't know how it tells you this. It sounds like Bergesen did what was asked of him...he went out threw strikes and worked fast.

I still think Bergesen may HAVE to be in the rotation to open the season. You can't rely on Baez to give you any more than 3 or 4 innings in any outing at the beginning of the season. Heck, he hasn't even shown he can go 2.

I see the rotation shaping up as:

Guthrie

Uehara

Eaton

Bergesen

Simon

I think they will skip the 5th guy and let Simon work in long relief to start the season, and bring him into the rotation when he's needed.

This could change if Uehara isn't ready, obviously. If he's not, I think you'll see everyone move up one spot, with Waters being the 5th guy.

[Sports Guy]

I don't know how it tells you this. It sounds like Bergesen did what was asked of him...he went out threw strikes and worked fast.

I still think Bergesen may HAVE to be in the rotation to open the season. You can't rely on Baez to give you any more than 3 or 4 innings in any outing at the beginning of the season. Heck, he hasn't even shown he can go 2.

I see the rotation shaping up as:

Guthrie

Uehara

Eaton

Bergesen

Simon

I think they will skip the 5th guy and let Simon work in long relief to start the season, and bring him into the rotation when he's needed.

This could change if Uehara isn't ready, obviously. If he's not, I think you'll see everyone move up one spot, with Waters being the 5th guy.

But why send BB to face the single A hitters?

Why wouldn't you send Baez to do that?

[Frobby]

But why send BB to face the single A hitters?

Why wouldn't you send Baez to do that?

SG, I think that's a veteran thing more than anything else. You don't ask a vet to travel several hours to go face minor league hitters. Just look at who goes to the ST road games. So I would read very little into the fact that BB was the one who made the trip.

Right now, I think BB makes the rotation over Baez.

[clapdiddy]

SG, I think that's a veteran thing more than anything else. You don't ask a vet to travel several hours to go face minor league hitters. Just look at who goes to the ST road games. So I would read very little into the fact that BB was the one who made the trip.

Right now, I think BB makes the rotation over Baez.

And just to add to this...

They may need to see Baez more than Bergesen at this point in time facing major league hitters. They've seen what BB can do, and maybe they feel confident that he's going to be ready to step in right now.

Baez is probably more of an unknown to the organization in a starting role at this point than Bergesen is.

[wildcard]

Agreed, but it's been pretty obvious that the O's have been singling out Bergesen as a guy who might make this rotation from almost the first day of camp. In the first exhibition vs. Italy, he was the only pitcher who threw 2 innings. He was quickly moved to 3 innings, then 4, and now 6. I think this guy is just the kind of pitcher Trembley want, i.e., a fast working strike thrower.

But do you think MacPhail will waive Simon or Baez or Bass or release Easton to start the year with Bergesen in the rotation? That the decision the O's really have to make. We know they will wait until the last minute to make it but I am not sure they are ready to let any of those guys go.

[Frobby]

But do you think MacPhail will waive Simon or Baez or Bass or release Easton to start the year with Bergesen in the rotation? That the decision the O's really have to make. We know they will wait until the last minute to make it but I am not sure they are ready to let any of those guys go.

How many can we squeeze into the bullpen, assuming a 13-man staff?

Sherrill

Ray

Johnson

Albers

Walker

Sarfate

Hendrickson

+1?

[Old Beta]

How many can we squeeze into the bullpen, assuming a 13-man staff?

Sherrill

Ray

Johnson

Albers

Walker

Sarfate

Hendrickson

+1?

I don't think it's a given that Albers will be there, for reasons that we all know.

[Old Beta]

I see the rotation shaping up as:

Guthrie

Uehara

Eaton

Bergesen

Simon

You might be right, though what happens when Hill is ready, especially considering Bergesen has an option?

[Sports Guy]

SG, I think that's a veteran thing more than anything else. You don't ask a vet to travel several hours to go face minor league hitters. Just look at who goes to the ST road games. So I would read very little into the fact that BB was the one who made the trip.

Right now, I think BB makes the rotation over Baez.

If this is true, it is total bs.

Baez hasn't earned anything to get any kind of special treatment and if you want BB in the rotation, you need to see how he will do against real competition.

Baez is still essentially rehabbing...When you rehab, you face MiL talent.