Is David Ortiz done?

[Burg]

I thought that Big Papi was just in a slump but it appears that he may be done. If so, despite my dislike for "Red Sox Nation", I'll be a little sad. Say what you will, but the man had a knack for the clutch hit.

Also, I guess it has to be asked, do you think that he was "juiced" or is this just a case of a guy getting old in a hurry?

[NewMarketSean]

Even thought Ortiz plays for the bad guys he seemed like a really good guy and looked like he had fun playing the game on a team that looks like they hate it.

I do feel bad for Ortiz a bit, especially from all of the steroids backlash, but we'll never really know what is going on.

At only 34, and as good as he has been over the last 6-7 years, you'd expect him to do better than he has so far this year. Maybe there is something else he's hiding, like an injury or poor eyesight.

With Ortiz though, you almost want to give him the BOTD, because he has been a good guy in the past.

[TyCobb]

Ortiz was a product of Fenway and Manny batting behind him. I am happy he is failing because I can't wait until the awful Red Sox fan turn on him and kick him to the curb.

[Shopay]

Even thought Ortiz plays for the bad guys he seemed like a really good guy and looked like he had fun playing the game on a team that looks like they hate it.

I do feel bad for Ortiz a bit, especially from all of the steroids backlash, but we'll never really know what is going on.

At only 34, and as good as he has been over the last 6-7 years, you'd expect him to do better than he has so far this year. Maybe there is something else he's hiding, like an injury or poor eyesight.

With Ortiz though, you almost want to give him the BOTD, because he has been a good guy in the past.

Agree with everything above. And yes, Papi is done, at least the dominant Papi that we saw a few years ago. He will never be that player again. He doesn't have the bat speed anymore.

[Shopay]

Ortiz was a product of Fenway and Manny batting behind him. I am happy he is failing because I can't wait until the awful Red Sox fan turn on him and kick him to the curb.

By the way, this is already happening.

[sbauer]

By the way, this is already happening.

At least he'll be laying in the curb so he won't get hit by the RSN bandwagon when it drives by.

[Spoonless]

Ortiz was a product of Fenway and Manny batting behind him. I am happy he is failing because I can't wait until the awful Red Sox fan turn on him and kick him to the curb.

Sure, because only the hated Red Sox and Yankee fans turn on their own. I'll tell you what, when the O's are a perennial contender, O's fans will turn on Markakis or Jones or whoever is struggling or showing signs of being "done." Red Sox fans want their team to go to the playoffs/World Series. Continuing to slot a struggling Ortiz in the lineup hurts their ability to win games and achieve that goal. It's hard to argue against those who don't want him in the lineup right now. If he finds his swing, they'll cheer him as loudly as they did before. This crap about vilifying Red Sox fans is just dumb, when you know that Orioles fans would react the same way if the O's were in the position the Sox are in. Can you imagine the Hangout night after night in the same situation?

[TyCobb]

Sure, because only the hated Red Sox and Yankee fans turn on their own. I'll tell you what, when the O's are a perennial contender, O's fans will turn on Markakis or Jones or whoever is struggling or showing signs of being "done." Red Sox fans want their team to go to the playoffs/World Series. Continuing to slot a struggling Ortiz in the lineup hurts their ability to win games and achieve that goal. It's hard to argue against those who don't want him in the lineup right now. If he finds his swing, they'll cheer him as loudly as they did before. This crap about vilifying Red Sox fans is just dumb, when you know that Orioles fans would react the same way if the O's were in the position the Sox are in. Can you imagine the Hangout night after night in the same situation?

Not at all. Name one oriole that we hate because they started to perform poorly after having an amazing 6 year career with us. Did I even say yankee Fans. Nope. Because Red Sox fan's treat their players the worst when they go bad.

Nomar, Pedro, Manny all great Red Soxs are treated like crap the moment they get kicked off the team. Those are just off the top of my head.

[Austin]

Not at all. Name one oriole that we hate because they started to perform poorly after having an amazing 6 year career with us. Did I even say yankee Fans. Nope. Because Red Sox fan's treat their players the worst when they go bad.

Nomar, Pedro, Manny all great Red Soxs are treated like crap the moment they get kicked off the team. Those are just off the top of my head.

Just curious, when have Pedro/Nomar been treated poorly by Red Sox fans?

EDIT: According to this article, Pedro was actually received quite warmly in Boston as a Met.

[ShaneDawg85]

Bill Simmons just wrote an article on ESPN that basically states it's not PED's that have contributed to this demise, but more than likely he's older than his age is. I like Ortiz, even though he plays for the The Nation, but I wouldn't doubt if that is the case, although it wouldn't be easy to prove. The man's bat speed is just gone, and it's not a product of being hurt. It's just gone. When that happens it's a pretty solid indication that your time is practically up.

[TyCobb]

Just curious, when have Pedro/Nomar been treated poorly by Red Sox fans?

Immediately after they were no longer on the team.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/7419906/

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/040802

[Moose Milligan]

Ortiz was a product of Fenway and Manny batting behind him. I am happy he is failing because I can't wait until the awful Red Sox fan turn on him and kick him to the curb.

Nice.

Nomar, Pedro, Manny all great Red Soxs are treated like crap the moment they get kicked off the team. Those are just off the top of my head.

Nomar and Manny were shunned because they had bad attitudes by the time they were sent away. Pedro is still revered by Boston fans.

As pointed out by Simmons, Boston fans are being respectful.

Back in 2004, I think it's safe to say all of us were rooting for the Sox to beat the Yankees. Ortiz was incredible during the ALCS and it was amazing to watch his clutch hitting. Due to that, he's reached upper echelon status in Boston sports lore with guys like Larry Bird who delivered championships and were clutch.

Oritz was a good guy for baseball, if you can put your Sox hatred aside. It's sad to see someone like that hit the wall that hard.

[TyCobb]

Classy.

Nomar and Manny were shunned because they had bad attitudes by the time they were sent away. Pedro is still revered by Boston fans.

As pointed out by Simmons, Boston fans are being respectful.

Back in 2004, I think it's safe to say all of us were rooting for the Sox to beat the Yankees. Ortiz was incredible during the ALCS and it was amazing to watch his clutch hitting. Due to that, he's reached upper echelon status in Boston sports lore with guys like Larry Bird who delivered championships and were clutch.

Oritz was a good guy for baseball, if you can put your Sox hatred aside. It's sad to see someone like that hit the wall that hard.

Hey, I am not from San Diego.

Bad attitudes? That is simply Red Sox Nation putting that in the air so when they trade them or don't sign them they have an excuse. That is why I can't stand Red Sox Nation.

I have nothing against Ortiz. I just hate Red Sox Nation and the way they treat their players.

[Spoonless]

Immediately after they were no longer on the team.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/7419906/

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/040802

So your issue should be on the Sox FO's typical smear campaign when a popular player is on his way out, which I agree is despicable. However, it's also understandable why they do it. The "average" baseball fan doesn't really think about the team's future. They think about the here and now. So they may not see the whole reason why a team trades a player or chooses not to re-sign them. So a couple media leaks and smear campaign later, and you get people thinking that the team is getting rid of a bad influence.

As far as Manny goes, I'm sure part of it is you not living in the media market, but there were a fair share of Sox fans that didn't like Manny's antics while he was with the Sox. In addition, with the way he handled his final season with the Sox, you could say the backlash was warranted. Of course, some of it is due to the aforementioned smear capaign that is the FO's MO.

Go read the thread on SoSH about Ortiz. There are plenty of people who think they should be giving him every opportunity to work out of it, and plenty of people that think he needs a MiL rehab assignment. Not everyone is attacking the guy. You're perfectly entitled to your opinion about Red Sox fans and their treatment of players, but I'll just agree to disagree.

[TyCobb]

Nice.

Nomar and Manny were shunned because they had bad attitudes by the time they were sent away. Pedro is still revered by Boston fans.

As pointed out by Simmons, Boston fans are being respectful.

Back in 2004, I think it's safe to say all of us were rooting for the Sox to beat the Yankees. Ortiz was incredible during the ALCS and it was amazing to watch his clutch hitting. Due to that, he's reached upper echelon status in Boston sports lore with guys like Larry Bird who delivered championships and were clutch.

Oritz was a good guy for baseball, if you can put your Sox hatred aside. It's sad to see someone like that hit the wall that hard.

"I cannot remember another Boston athlete stinking this long, and this fragrantly, without getting dumped on. "

This is from the article you linked. Great fan loyalty.....