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How come the Blue Jays can be competitive and the Orioles can't?

keysersose

By keysersose
in Orioles Talk

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ScottieBaseball Veteran All-Star

ScottieBaseball

Posted
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Angelos learned:

-That the fans are stupid

-That they turned on him when the team started losing no matter that he spent money

-That the fans are stupid

-That he could make money off the stupid fans even without putting out for a decent team

-That "rebuilding" could be an excuse for a decade

-That he could use the Orioles and the fans misfortune of being located close to DC to his advantage and gain

-That the fans are stupid

-That old big-names can make stupid fans buy tickets

-That Yankee and Red Sox money is still green

-That the fans are stupid

He learned A LOT!

Where do you get off calling O's fans stupid? You're out of line, Sapper.

We buy tickets because we love Orioles baseball. We watch games because we love Orioles baseball. It's unconditional for me. I can love the sinner without condoning the sin. It has nothing to do with my intelligence.

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badboydrake Newbie

badboydrake

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He didn't call O's fans stupid, he said that Angelos learned or thinks that O's fans are stupid.

Wouldnt him saying that Angelos learned the O's fans are stupid, that he believes the O's fans are stupid too, and that Angelos finally realized it?

How can someone learn something that isn't true(in his opinion, apparently it is true)

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hoosiers Hangout Grand Counsel

hoosiers

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That fact is huge. Angelos changed his entire mind-set. So in mid-2000 we had a watershed event. That's when the Orioles did a salary dump for a lot of third-rate prospects (except for a luck-out with Melvin Mora). Angelos decided that it was no use spending a lot of money because it wasn't appreciated, plus he realized he couldn't buy a title, plus he knew he could make money even if attendance dropped. There were tons of gullible fans and the Baltimore sports media had all the backbone of a jellyfish.

Actually, by the end of the 2000 season, PA had put up full $ for about 13 first/supplemental first round picks between 1998 and 2000 and had every right to expect that an appropriate portion of these 13 players would play a significant role in the future competitiveness of the team.

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camdenyardblues Newbie

camdenyardblues

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That fact is huge. Angelos changed his entire mind-set. So in mid-2000 we had a watershed event. That's when the Orioles did a salary dump for a lot of third-rate prospects (except for a luck-out with Melvin Mora). Angelos decided that it was no use spending a lot of money because it wasn't appreciated, plus he realized he couldn't buy a title, plus he knew he could make money even if attendance dropped. There were tons of gullible fans and the Baltimore sports media had all the backbone of a jellyfish.

Why can't the firesale be explained by the fact that the O's had several losing seasons so the FO decided it was time to trade off the vets for younger players? And if Angelos decided it was no use spending money, why does he authorize a 72 million dollar payroll? Why not just slash payroll down to $15 to $20 million especially since he thinks that he can make money even with low attendance?

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RShack Hangout Grand Counsel

RShack

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And if Angelos decided it was no use spending money, why does he authorize a 72 million dollar payroll? Why not just slash payroll down to $15 to $20 million especially since he thinks that he can make money even with low attendance?

No, no, no... you're trying to be sensible about this... when it comes to people's opinions of PA, "sensible" is very often not a factor ;-)

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Sapper AA

Sapper

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He didn't call O's fans stupid, he said that Angelos learned or thinks that O's fans are stupid.

EXACTLY!!!! Do people TRY to be insulted around here?

I am an Orioles fan. I'm not stupid. But Angelos thinks we are.

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ScottieBaseball Veteran All-Star

ScottieBaseball

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EXACTLY!!!! Do people TRY to be insulted around here?

I am an Orioles fan. I'm not stupid. But Angelos thinks we are.

Not nearly as hard as you try to be over-the-top with sarcastic pessimism!

You said Angelos learned Orioles fans are stupid as though it were a fact. If you meant it the way Sean explained it, then forget I brought it up. The truth is your act has grown so tiresome here that it was easy for me to jump to the insultive conclusion I did.

Next time you're in town, swing on by my trailer and I'll buy you a mayonaisse sandwich.

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camdenyardblues Newbie

camdenyardblues

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No, no, no... you're trying to be sensible about this... when it comes to people's opinions of PA, "sensible" is very often not a factor ;-)

Yup, I'm not saying I'm an Angelos fan because I'm not but some really suspect things gets attributed to him. Like Boswell saying a few years ago that Angelos was purposely trying to field a bad team in order to keep the Expos out of DC. Angelos has faults but I think he wants to win, in fact he desparately wants to win. Purposely sabotaging the team isn't his MO.

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TinCup Major Leaguer

TinCup

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Angelos has faults but I think he wants to win, in fact he desparately wants to win.

Now now, desparately?? Really?

If so, he has an odd way of trying to satisfy that desparation.

Frankly, he has yet to prove in recent years that he is desparate about winning. More money from his wallet into the team would go along way to show he is deparate about things.

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mikezpen Major Leaguer

mikezpen

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Why not just slash payroll down to $15 to $20 million especially since he thinks that he can make money even with low attendance?

That w/b a little obvious, don't you think? He really couldn't justify doing that. He can do fine, financially, by spending $75 or so million. counting on NY and Boston (and this year-Washington) fans to fill the Stadium a third of its home games and get around 2.5 million attendance per year. Then he can make all kinds of excuses that he's indeed spending money but that (this excuse or that) is thwarting him. "But next year we'll really go get /em." That's the same line he's used the past few years. And some people believe him.

Frankly, he has yet to prove in recent years that he is desparate about winning. More money from his wallet into the team would go along way to show he is deparate about things.

If he cared that much, we wouldn't have 9 losing seasons in a row.

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AgentOrange Veteran All-Star

AgentOrange

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But, I believe John Maine, Nate Spears, Mike Fontenot, and Denny Bautista were “top 15 Orioles prospects at the time of these transactions

1/21/06 Benson, Kris Acquired from the Mets for Jorge Julio & John Maine

1/9/06 Patterson, Corey Acquired from the Cubs for Nate Spears and Carlos Perez

2/2/05 Sosa, Sammy Acquired from the Cubs with cash for Jerry Hairston Jr., Mike Fontenot, & Dave Crouthers

6/21/04 Grimsley, Jason Acquired from the Royals for Denny Bautista

Point well taken.

Yet, if you look at our farm system as a whole, we were probably around 25th overall.

Our number 1-15 when our farm system was 25th is not the same as when our farm system is ranked 12th overall.

We actually have better prospects in our system now than we have had in a long time. Hopefully they pan out, we are in a better position waiting for them to come around than for us to trade them for 1 or 2 parts, because I don't think we are that close to contending on a regular basis.

1-2 more good drafts and we will have a top 10 farm system that will give us a lot more flexibility to do those things than what we have right now.

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camdenyardblues Newbie

camdenyardblues

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Now now, desparately?? Really?

If so, he has an odd way of trying to satisfy that desparation.

Frankly, he has yet to prove in recent years that he is desparate about winning. More money from his wallet into the team would go along way to show he is deparate about things.

He craves for public approval. I don't doubt he wants to make money but people aren't one-dimensional.

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