Do you agree or disagree with Trembley's decision to "call out" Pie?

[Hank Scorpio]

The only flimsy defense Trembley has is the fact that Buck asked him directly about Felix Pie's night. Buck singled him out and Trembley answered him.

Again, nobody is saying Pie didn't do something stupid.

But why doesn't he call out Mora every other game when he does something even dumber (which he has many times). Its the double standard here that people are questioning. Pie's getting lit up for something everyone on the team has done, and he's the only guy that Trembley has called out publicly to my knowledge.

He was asked a direct question about the guy following a tough loss where he had to be frustrated, so I'll forgive him for last night, but this can't become a regular thing where he calls out certain players for their mistakes in the media and doesn't say anything about other guys who make similar mistakes just as often.

This is my answer, and I'll agree that it's a flimsy defense (as I stated above.)

That and to be honest, maybe he knows that the writing is on the wall for him and is just past the point of holding his tongue. Who knows?

[Tx Oriole]

Okay, you're Trembley and you're getting interviewed by Buck.

Buck: "Felix Pie had a tough night, made a spectacular catch early on to save runs and then ran into an out late in the game. What do you have to say about Pie's night?"

What do you say?

I will talk with him. Or yes he made some mistakes. Never say that is Felix Pie being Felix Pie.

[VTmook213]

I have less of a problem with Pie getting thrown out at third trying to play aggressively than I do with Roberts getting picked off first for the umpteenth time. Pie may have made a poor decision, but that can be fixed. Roberts getting picked off is just a lack of concentration, imo.

Also, on the play where Pie didn't advance to third, what was the third base coach doing, did anyone notice?

[DuffMan]

What Felix Pie did on the base paths last night is comparable to what my girlfriend and her girlfriends do when they play softball. They basically have no clue whereas Felix Pie is a professional baseball player and he still has no clue. Of course I wouldn't call the girls out for it since they don't know any better, but in Pie's case, he should expect to be called out for it.

And your gf and her friends have an excuse, they are girls. Felix Pie is not a girl so what's his excuse?

[Hank Scorpio]

"These things happen, Buck. It's unfortunate, because we were in control at that point, but it just goes to show you how we need to play smart baseball for all 9 innings. It isn't the first time we've made mistakes this year, and won't be the last, but if we do more good then bad, then that's the sign of winning baseball.

By the way, I love your silver hair."

Something nebulous like that. Then go in the back and lambaste Pie for all I care. If the rest of us sitting at home can tell Trembley hates one player on the team, you don't think that one player can't tell too???

Classic!!! :clap3:

But, listen... those kinds of things should never happen. I felt like I was in the Twilight Zone or something watching that play. It was weird and uncomfortable.

[LookitsPuck]

"These things happen, Buck. It's unfortunate, because we were in control at that point, but it just goes to show you how we need to play smart baseball for all 9 innings. It isn't the first time we've made mistakes this year, and won't be the last, but if we do more good then bad, then that's the sign of winning baseball.

By the way, I love your silver hair."

Something nebulous like that. Then go in the back and lambaste Pie for all I care. If the rest of us sitting at home can tell Trembley hates one player on the team, you don't think that one player can't tell too???

Very well said.

[tywright]

And your gf and her friends have an excuse, they are girls. Felix Pie is not a girl so what's his excuse?

Exactly. His excuse is he has zero baseball smarts.

[Dipper9]

This is my answer, and I'll agree that it's a flimsy defense (as I stated above.)

That and to be honest, maybe he knows that the writing is on the wall for him and is just past the point of holding his tongue. Who knows?

Mora has made some terrible, TERRIBLE baserunning blunders over the years, but I can never, EVER recall a man trying to tag up from 2nd to 3rd on a pop out at the dugout! Add this to the botched hit and run, and yet ANOTHER miscommunication between Pie and his fellow outfielders (this seems to occur almost every time Pie is out there) and I'm sure Trembley has just had enough.

Now, that all being said, I have gotten to the point where I want to see an entirely new coaching staff next year. Top to bottom, Trembley gone and everyone currently coaching on this team. I like Dave Trembley the man, but as a manager he is not cutting it. Every time he brings Bass in, I say to myself "there goes the ball game." Matusz wasn't pitching great, but he got out of the 4th unscathed and had a one-two-three fifth. He was getting stronger. Why not bring him out to at least start the 6th inning? We have beaten the Samuel stuff to death, but what does this guy do as te third base coach? It appeared that Pie looked to third on the hit and run play. Was Samuel doing anything? Making any motions? Yelling? Knowing Samuel, he was probably just standing there watching the play. I like Crow, but he is part of this losing culture and not part of the solution (unless the new manager chooses to bring Crow back.) Kranny seams to be a decent pitching coach, but again, the new manager needs to choose his own guys.

MacPhail and Trembley along with BRob and some of the players keep on saying "we are in most of the game." Yeah, well being "in a game" and still losing is no different than getting blown out 30-3. A loss by any other name is still a loss. DT, I love him and I know he'll land on your feet, but the job he and his coaching staff has done has been unacceptable. Fundamental baseball? Yeah..my foot!

[tywright]

DT has called out players before, but it seems to do it more diplomatically then his approach with the Pie situation.

http://masnsports.com/2009/07/trembley-on-jones-1.html

Jones got some unwanted attention from Trembley by catching Marco Scutaro's fly ball in the seventh inning and being slow to return it to the infield as Raul Chavez tagged and advanced to second base.

"I'm not sure if he forgot how many outs or if there was a runner at first," Trembley said. "I want to leave on a positive note, but that kind of stuff, there's no room for that. Adam Jones, I love him like he was my own son, but there's no room for that. He's a great kid and a good player and he made a mistake and he's embarrassed by it, but that's what I'm talking about. There's no reason for that."

[Tony-OH]

I think Dave screwed up here.

I don't mind if he calls a guy out for a mistake, but I'd hope he would be more consistent in calling out guys that make the mistakes regularly if he does decide to go through the press for things.

And I also don't like the words he used. "Felix Pie being Felix Pie" seems to me that he is saying Felix is a lost cause who can never improve.

I really don't like the way he handled this, but I'm willing to consider it him blowing off some frustration and not a larger issue if it remains more of an isolated event.

Maybe, just maybe, this is the book on Pie? This guy came to the club with baggage for doing dumb things in games throughout his minor and major leagu career with the Cubs. There's a reason why he was available for Garrett Olson and there's a reason he'll never be more than a 4th outfielder for a contending major league club.

I'm sure Dave was frustrated after a tough loss, but it comes down to the fact that Pie is who he is. He'll flash some promise, but he'll probably always be a guy who will be inconsistent.

I know the guy gets a couple of hits and certain people get on his bandwagon, but I've seen enough of Pie this season to know he's not a regular guy on a good team. Now saying that, he'll flash enough that someone will give him an everyday look in CF, but I'll bet if you give the guy 550 at bats his line will look a lot like this .248/.312/.410. Add in his inconsistent base running and his occasional lapses in the field, and you have one below average starting outfielder.

[ShoelesJoe]

Of the people who disagree with Trembley's decision to call out Pie, when is it appropriate for a manager to call out a player for their play on the field?

I would have no problem with Trembley calling out Pie if he had done it before when other players made bone headed mistakes. But the manager already set his standard earlier in the year when Roberts, Markakis, Mora etc, made similar blunders. So when he publicly gets on Pie's case it's obvious that it's not about last night's mistakes, but about something else going on between the two men.

Let me put it this way -- if Mora had done the same thing would Trembley have said anything to the press? Not a chance, and Mora's got a history of base running gaffs that Pie can only dream of matching.

[Tony-OH]

I would have no problem with Trembley calling out Pie if he had done it before when other players made bone headed mistakes. But the manager already set his standard earlier in the year when Roberts, Markakis, Mora etc, made similar blunders. So when he publicly gets on Pie's case it's obvious that it's not about last night's mistakes, but about something else going on between the two men.

Let me put it this way -- if Mora had done the same thing would Trembley have said anything to the press? Not a chance, and Mora's got a history of base running gaffs that Pie can only dream of matching.

This is some flawed communistic way of looking at things. Not everyone is treate the same in life. Veterans do get more leeway and have earned more respect. At the same time, Trembley has said things about Mora, Markakis, Huff, Wigginton, and Roberts when they've made mistakes.

Either way, posters with a bird of rep around here certainly get more leeway then newbies because they've earned the respect of the community. Same things goes with major league players.

[Mackus]

I know the guy gets a couple of hits and certain people get on his bandwagon, but I've seen enough of Pie this season to know he's not a regular guy on a good team. Now saying that, he'll flash enough that someone will give him an everyday look in CF, but I'll bet if you give the guy 550 at bats his line will look a lot like this .248/.312/.410. Add in his inconsistent base running and his occasional lapses in the field, and you have one below average starting outfielder.

I don't think he'll ever hit lefties well enough to be a regular anywhere. But he plays excellent defense and I think he can hit righties well enough to be part of a very effective platoon, and I think we're an ideal team to give him that chance.

We've got poor defenders (at least this season) in LF and CF. Now hopefully Reimold improves and Jones gets back to where he was last year and Pie just stays on the bench as a 4th OF giving us really good depth. But if they can't bounce back defensively, then we've gotta make a change. I'd suggest having Pie be the CF against RHP (assuming he can hit them at a .750+ clip, which I think is reasonable if not an underestimate) with Jones in LF and Reimold at DH. Against LHP, Jones slides back to CF, Reimold to LF, and a cheap lefty-masher at DH (Wigginton?). Jones and Reimold aren't so poor defensively that having them out there occasionally (i.e. against LHP starters) will hurt us much.

I give Jones and Reimold the bulk of next year to show that this year is a fluke defensively, but if they are still well below average by August, I switch to this sort of an arrangement (assuming Pie is still showing he deserves that much time, which he clearly is right now).

[Dipper9]

I don't think he'll ever hit lefties well enough to be a regular anywhere. But he plays excellent defense and I think he can hit righties well enough to be part of a very effective platoon, and I think we're an ideal team to give him that chance.

We've got poor defenders (at least this season) in LF and CF. Now hopefully Reimold improves and Jones gets back to where he was last year and Pie just stays on the bench as a 4th OF giving us really good depth. But if they can't bounce back defensively, then we've gotta make a change. I'd suggest having Pie be the CF against RHP (assuming he can hit them at a .750+ clip, which I think is reasonable if not an underestimate) with Jones in LF and Reimold at DH. Against LHP, Jones slides back to CF, Reimold to LF, and a cheap lefty-masher at DH (Wigginton?). Jones and Reimold aren't so poor defensively that having them out there occasionally (i.e. against LHP starters) will hurt us much.

I give Jones and Reimold the bulk of next year to show that this year is a fluke defensively, but if they are still well below average by August, I switch to this sort of an arrangement (assuming Pie is still showing he deserves that much time, which he clearly is right now).

Wow. I must not be watching the same games as you. He is improving, I'll give you that, but "excellent defense?" I think not. How many near collissions occur between Pie and the other outfielders? How many times does he throw to the wrong base? He makes a spectacular play every now and then, but that hardly makes him excellent as a defender.

[tywright]

I don't think he'll ever hit lefties well enough to be a regular anywhere. But he plays excellent defense and I think he can hit righties well enough to be part of a very effective platoon, and I think we're an ideal team to give him that chance.

I wouldn't characterize his D as being "excellent". He runs poor routes to flyballs and drives to the gaps. He misses the cut off man and his throws aren't accurate. And he has a tendency to not acknowledge other fielders calling him off a flyball.